[00:00:01] Blank Check with Griffin and David, Blank Check with Griffin and David Don't know what to say or to expect All you need to know is that the name of the show is Blank Check
[00:00:20] In telling the podcast of my father's life it's impossible to separate facts from fiction, the man from the myth The best I can do is to tell it the way he told me It doesn't always make sense and most of it never happened
[00:00:33] But that's what kind of podcast this is God, give me that back Come on, you're not already getting one over Crudup is not winning me over in this movie He's the one who's not winning me over I'll say right off the bat hot takes
[00:00:50] Because our guest has been complaining that we've been saying a lot of good stuff That we've spent our hot takes off my Yeah, of course We've been here for roughly 25 minutes and we've discussed so many things about this film
[00:01:02] The last time I was on we didn't even get to the film We barely talked about as good as it gets, that's true You're right, so you know we've spent 25 minutes giving hot takes amongst each other that weren't recorded Sure
[00:01:14] No, you're very right, so you know what? Let's get focused, let's get straight down to business Well, I actually had a question Chris, what do you think of Solo as Star Wars? I thought Solo was solid and I think that it took a lot of Unfairly maligned
[00:01:26] Unfairly maligned in the sense of look if we want this universe to keep expanding Some of these stories aren't going to relate directly to like galactic stakes Sure If every single installment in the Star Wars world The actual galaxy is on the line, it's not sustainable
[00:01:42] It will lose any sense of effect so I think it's really smart from the go Let's take a character you love do a smaller story That has stakes internal to that character's life Outside of the Empire and the Rebellion and all that
[00:01:54] I think people were complaining about, oh this story felt like small And it's like, well they're gonna have to See, I have no complaints on that front My complaint with the movie is I think the movie would work better even more divorced
[00:02:06] I think that story works better not as a Han Solo story And you go here's just a Star Wars story, it's small scale, it's about street rats Right These are kids in the slums who are trying to make a better life than Han Solo
[00:02:17] But let's explain the Millennium Falcon and I'm like don't need you to Well I was thinking about this on the way here Star Wars, it's funny, I feel like one of the points Big Fish makes is that
[00:02:29] And I have so many opinions on this movie because of my background Which I'm sure we'll get into One of the major things that Big Fish I think makes is like Hey life can be more fun sometimes if you just choose to ask less questions
[00:02:40] Star Wars is maybe the ultimate franchise that I was thinking about this here Because especially the end of Big Fish when you start to see the reality versions of everything I think that's so beautiful But Star Wars is maybe the ultimate franchise that
[00:02:55] Anytime they've actually tried to double down and explain a character more than you already heard about it Not important Ruins it Boba Fett was our favorite They tried to, they tried Kids, I feel like they probably sell 80% less Boba Fett merchandise Than they did before the prequels because
[00:03:10] He was just that guy with the cool mask Even when they gave him a name They managed to give him a good name Boba Fett But first in Empire he's just bounty hunter Then I was thinking about it too
[00:03:21] One of the main Achilles heels I think of the original trilogy Who is the Emperor? Who is that? In the original trilogy you know there's a guy even worse than Darth Vader And they never say a word about it I think it's a little unspoken
[00:03:34] Or a little weird like that like Star Wars has the best villain of all time, has Darth Vader He's so scary And then Empire strikes back they're like This guy's got a boss and I'm like No, okay And even Darth Vader
[00:03:46] I don't want him to have a boss Even Darth Vader in the original trilogy They give him an iconic piece of backstory But they give him one piece of backstory Very simple I am your father That's all the backstory they give that character
[00:04:00] And that's at the end of a second entire movie It takes them two movies to reveal anything about that guy we already love And think it's cool It would be like trying to explain every gang in The Warriors You know Right
[00:04:13] It would be like if you made a series and it's like And the Warriors it's like the baseball gang I get it they got baseball bets I get it that's all I needed to know Thank you
[00:04:21] The Rollerskate gang I don't need to know why they chose to make their Headquarters a subway station bathroom Perhaps the least desirable place to hang out in all of New York City A subway station bathroom Most of which are now just locked permanently forever
[00:04:34] Actually, sorry question that I have Have either of you ever used a subway station bathroom? I think I have Because I never have And I was born in the city I've never done it I have There's then would Yeah that's crazy
[00:04:44] Because there is one there at the 61st station That's like tolerable? I used it only for P in an absolute emergency Right That is kind of crazy David because like me you were born in New York City And then lived here for the entire duration of your life
[00:04:57] Well there's this 13 year stretch where I lived in England Just put that out there You guys been to the Penn Station bathroom? Yeah, oh yeah Oh that thing is Giuliani you forgot Giuliani forgot One 30 square foot He was like we can't Port Authority is even worse
[00:05:16] He just basically said Penn Station and Port Authority are like the New Jersey embassies Right Here And I'm just gonna leave them up Port Authority is It literally feels like Like the snow plow machine he used to clean up Times Square He then led directly into Port Authority
[00:05:32] Well Port Authority also feels like say you're the mayor and you sit down with What's like a chic like pancatidian And you're like whatever you want to have a restaurant in Port Authority And they're just like no absolutely not like Tax-free rent free
[00:05:45] You can have it like no we won't do it We won't go in there Right It'll curse us somehow Port Authority is like That place is haunted Only franchises that you're pretty certain went out of business 12 years Yeah Port Authority has like a circuit city
[00:05:58] And the polling alley that they remodel every few years to make cool Right I had my birthday at that polling alley when I was like 7 years old Okay Only one because that's weird because you would have spent the rest of your childhood in New York
[00:06:10] And you never went back I already said that I grew up in England yet twerp I kind of breezed over it so I want to We used to sneak into this as Jersey kids do Used to take the bus into Port Authority Not tell your parents
[00:06:22] And my friend Mike D, older friend of mine, great great guy He was a little bit of a bad kid So he would sneak in all the time And he once had was waiting for the last bus back to Jersey Which if you miss it, you're dead
[00:06:34] Like your high school kid, how are you getting back to New Jersey? What would you do? Would you like sleep in the Port Authority or something? I know and like your parents are gonna think you're dead So he's in there
[00:06:43] This is like a pre-cell phone era too right? Oh yeah, this is the mid 90s And he was in there and he had to take a shit He started doing the math and he's like I can't leave Port Authority and make it back Right Like I have to
[00:06:55] I'm gonna, I have to shit I'm not making it back to Jersey So he goes into the Port Authority bathroom This is the last bus It's probably like two in the morning It's mid 90s too You know this is like He still saw some street walker
[00:07:09] Yeah, the drone and hill it's like And he goes into the Port Authority bathroom He's the only one there Oh that's worse somehow No, he's like thank god Okay So he goes down the stall, he's taking a shit Then he hears the door open
[00:07:22] This is my why it's worse It's just a giant syringe He hears all this screaming Just one person screaming So he just tells himself He goes Mike whatever is going on out there You fucking run You wipe up, you're not washing your hands today It's pre-purella era too
[00:07:42] Sure You have fucking fecal hands To me that's like I'm paying whatever debt I have to pay to get out of here So he wipes up He flushes And he just takes off running And he claims that what he passed Was a homeless individual
[00:07:58] Removing his own teeth with a pair of pliers With knives? Pliers Port Authority That's Port Authority Geez Now, Big Fish is arguably about Like the importance of stories in our lives Storytelling So can I ask you guys Personal legend I really wanted to ask you guys this
[00:08:19] And it's been covered on the internet I looked it up to make sure I've never really read up on it It's bothered me since I was a child In a new hope If we're talking about storytelling Yeah, we're getting focused We're talking about C-3PO
[00:08:34] So specifically says in a new hope Sorry, I'm not good at stories Luke's like tell me about the rebellion And he's like I wouldn't let me know I'm not programmed for that Yeah, yeah So explicitly Jedi He tells the whole story for the Ewoks
[00:08:50] The Ewoks are sitting there with a wrapped attention Like this motherfucker's spalding gray Well, not only that He is kind of like spalding gray Like he's doing sound effects He's holding it down He would like win a Lucille Lortel award If that was off Broadway
[00:09:05] Yeah, he would double extension Oh yeah Oh yeah, and they'll jack the prices too He'd have a chance to make the jump for Big Lea style Yeah, for Big Lea style 12 weeks He's so good at telling stories in Jedi And no justification No No justification except
[00:09:21] No, I'm trying to think like Zero I mean C-3PO isn't really a character who like Changes It's not like He's not like you know, because I can star trek You've got like the holographic doctor
[00:09:33] And like the point of him is that he sort of like becomes human Like the longer he's on and interacting with people Sure C-3PO is always basically the same Yeah He's what he is I think Lucas fell into like
[00:09:46] I guess we gotta do sitcom plots with C-3PO Like he's Mr. Bazinga He's unchanging The thing that can change are the circumstances around him Right So it's like first movie He's up at E Second movie What's the plot now He keeps cock-blocking Yeah, that's it That is
[00:10:03] He keeps cock-blocking And then halfway through the movie His head is blown off Right And he is strapped to the back of Chewbacca But then even you look at the prequels And it's like what story ideas does he have For C-3PO
[00:10:14] C-3PO's head ends up on another robot Yeah Like he doesn't want C-3PO to grow at all Right C-3PO's not gonna do shit In the prequels when he is like to a fault Over explaining how different characters used to be C-3PO's exactly the same
[00:10:28] They're just like what's so weird C-3PO plans two dinners at the same restaurant At the same time Yeah Like it's just like hijinks It feels like Lucas straight up Cause as you get older And you realize that Star Wars
[00:10:41] Star Wars is one of the best things in my life In one of the most informative things in my life I'm about to have a son I can't wait one of my I said it to my wife As soon as we got pregnant
[00:10:50] I cannot wait to show my child Star Wars And I mean all that Yeah It's also bad Yeah And it maybe always was But that's what's great about it And it was cool when he was young Yeah And then the prequels he wasn't young enough
[00:11:03] To be cool anymore And it just exposed that all of it was bad It feels like It feels like The thought on C-3PO Was he straight up watched Hidden Fortress Was like oh I want something that looks Like that tall skinny guy short guy Right
[00:11:17] And you're telling the story from low status characters Right And that image was the extent of the thought Behind C-3PO It's like I need a skinny guy in the desert To look like that And that was the extent
[00:11:29] Oh God George Lucas is now like a sandwich guy From the Bronx Yes he's a Bronx He's a Give me a skinny guy alright Street cart vendor in the Bronx You're gonna want to take this This lamb shoulder Put it in the oven 50 minutes
[00:11:42] Do you know this whole thing that like Anthony Daniels hated Kenny Baker And he would always talk shit about him Really And when people would be like you and Kenny Baker You're a team and he's like I'm an actor Kenny Baker is not an actor Right
[00:11:58] Which is kind of fair because Kenny Baker Is a guy operating a robot Is more of a technician He's just a guy who's inside of a robot But then people would poke Kenny Baker cause they were like Oh is this like a Shatner, Takai thing
[00:12:09] Where they'll both have shit to say to each other And Kenny Baker's like I got nothing bad to say about the guy Look cause look here's what Kenny Baker knows in his heart It's like I don't care how much theater You did on the west end
[00:12:18] Put on your fucking gold helmet Rest Hall you sold your soul just like all of us 100% of people know you as C3PO 0% of people know you as anything And here's the point Literally Post 1980 Anthony Daniels has not had A single acting role that isn't C3PO
[00:12:36] And it's like fine but don't beat up on poor Kenny Baker Kenny Baker had like a diverse career Like he was in time bandits Like he had other roles where he was in this sort of Face visible, saying dialogue Terry Gillian, ensemble He worked, like I had range
[00:12:50] And he was just like this is a job I'm doing I operate R2D too And people were like How nice you're a comedy team And Anthony Daniels was like That guy's a fucking monkey Right, I was Macbeth Just on the basic level
[00:13:02] I don't care how much of an asshole Kenny Baker is You don't talk shit about a little person Agreed Well that's true And Kenny Baker was by all accounts Not an asshole Like even if he was an asshole You'd be like Don't do it, bad optics Yeah
[00:13:16] By all accounts Kenny Baker He was just like I'm not looking to fight with anybody I don't know what Anthony Daniels problem with me is Yeah And then Anthony Daniels would double down I would love I had just a vision in my head of him
[00:13:25] Like going to the producer Going to fucking Irving Kirschner Or whoever Being like I can't work with Baker anymore And then Kirschner Being like cool I'll get that on record anyway Yeah Why don't you go out to wardrobe And get wrapped up in the tuna can asshole
[00:13:40] So I don't have time in the day for this I gotta fix all of James Lucas' plot holes Can't be worried about you We're in the tundra Yeah He wrote this fucking script word In Ice Planet Did you know this? Yeah, you see old asshole
[00:13:54] We're in a part of Norway Where humans can't sustain life I gotta listen to you Do this bullshit You don't even have to look at Kenny Baker He's fully inside the trash can He's like a lid is on The guy who plays Cliff Clavin's already giving me shit
[00:14:08] He's got one line I gotta put up a ship from you too Oh boy What's the motivation in this scene? That's what Cliff Clavin's going on I gotta get people to suspend their disbelief About something called a taunt on So Lucas can sell more goddamn toys
[00:14:25] Especially with that character You're like just say bazinga The game is clear Yeah Be prissy Be prissy Be upset Kershner, if you ever listen to his commentary For him, it's amazing Because he's just like When there's a visual effect scene He's just like, yeah
[00:14:41] I told them to do all this And they were like, what do you mean? You know, I was just I don't know, just make him fly around Like he had no interest in that shit Once I ever Lucas' thing on that has had Like literal Smithsonian exhibits
[00:14:54] About his level of visual Right Like the models and pre-art But that's why that movie worked so well Was like he hired someone to handle The dramatic integrity of the story And the performances And like shot composition and shit Yeah And then he was like, you figure out
[00:15:08] The thing where the thing eats the other thing I don't know It flies into an asteroid I don't know what you're talking about But I'm sure you'll figure it out Yeah Like we were saying before The least explained characters Are the best Star Wars characters Yeah
[00:15:23] Kit Fist to Hope Listen, I haven't caught up On those cartoons as much as I should So I don't know my I know they gave some fist-store ventures I don't think they They're not telling you Like what his deal is He's just a badass The smart thing is
[00:15:37] I feel like anytime they answered A question about Fisto They'd raise five new questions Good So you always felt like You knew less about him Than you You can like him more And know that Did you know more or less He rarely would speak Even on the cartoons
[00:15:51] They'd be like Keep the strength silent But Grunting He's often smiling He's having fun He likes it He likes it But this is why one of My favorite prequel characters Is Count Dooku Because he comes in He's like I'm Count Dooku And you're like Your account Huh?
[00:16:08] What does that mean? Not explained And he's got a curvy lightsaber Not explained Right, you know like You know He's No other character is like him He's old as shit He's so old Yeah And he talks to Yoda Like he knows him You know like Oh Yoda
[00:16:25] We go way back And none of this is ever explained Right and he's like I'm a Darth Maul is less explained than that Yeah, totally Count Dooku And he can't even speak But the problem with Darth Maul Is they've tried They keep bringing him back
[00:16:36] I mean the solo He has him Where they're like More of Darth Maul And I think it's the same answer No, no He was cool when he was nothing You dropped You dropped the ball He gave you one amazing scene The reason to rewatch the Phantom Menace
[00:16:50] Is that fight scene Mm-hmm Let's drop it When we were When we were watching that When we watched it in theater It was I don't think it was opening day It might have been opening weekend And when that came up You just heard all the nerds gasp
[00:17:03] You heard people Oh shit Darth Maul, he's in charge of the gang And my wife With a voice that sounded like She had just finished running a marathon Just goes Who is that? I was like right This is This is for 5% of people This is the problem
[00:17:22] That being said Oh my god I can't believe this is At How many days after it opens Will you guys be staying in that Star Wars hotel down in the We've talked about it a lot We have talked about it You and I are intrigued
[00:17:34] I'm a big theme park person David is not Is it in Orlando or California? Both Your Orlando one's going to be better It always is Because they have more space They can just sort of Right The city of Orlando is like Yeah, pave over that
[00:17:46] You know part of the town I think it's supposed to open in May Maybe Is that so? They're both opening this year I would like to go not in the summer I don't want to go to Orlando in the summer And it's supposed to be like
[00:17:57] A sleep no more thing Right? So there are a couple things You commit to character When you stay in that hotel They're going to be Star Wars Specific hotels I've heard that If you stay in those hotels There's an option where you pay A ton of money
[00:18:08] And I don't know if this is a rumor Where they'll be like So do you want to be a Jedi Or a smuggler Do you want to be a spy And then they'll call you In the middle of the night What if I'm like
[00:18:16] I want to be in the trailer Oh yeah I want to attack some trailer And they're like Sir We have told you That racism is not accepted Here in Disney where I'll do it I'm just going by what you're giving me You show up in green face
[00:18:30] And they're like Sir And you're like Oh And they're like Oh god No No I did They are like The fucking I know there's a waddo presence In the parks So they're not totally erasing The weird racial stereotypes If it can sell a toy
[00:18:49] It's going to show up at Disney Right and his name is Toydarian That's a species name Like there's a short walk there The thing I've heard is You know That was That's true Chris is a little flabbergasted That threw me for a loop What was the Toydarian?
[00:19:05] No, the U-Tone I'm a Toydarian U-Tone of like And his name is Toydarian So it's our short walk I'm a species Yeah But are you I want to go Like I think my son will have been recently born And I think I want to go And abandon him
[00:19:21] For a day or two To go live in that world So I have a friend Who's a theme park fanatic I went to Disney World with him last October He keeps on nudging me Being like When are we going to make Star Wars plans And I'm like
[00:19:33] I don't know if I can go within the first 18 months of the thing opening Because it's going to be a nightmare Insane Like they're They're trying to prepare themselves As much as possible To prevent like Like Black Friday style Death by Stampede Right Like everyone's terrified
[00:19:49] That there's actually going to be Like overpopulation People getting trampled to death Issues Right On the other hand I'm already kind of sniffing around Being like Is there somewhere I can get someone to like Get me to cover this You mean like get like a press visit
[00:20:05] Or something Yeah Like can we sell someone on like A piece or something You know Yeah Because I'm like that I would do Otherwise I feel like I have to wait Like two years You know me well enough to know That if there is a stampede
[00:20:17] You want to be there I want to be an eyewitness Yes I want to be Right Running I want to be fleeing from my life With genuine fear in my heart Right As people around me are trampled to death And it's like
[00:20:30] Oh no I'm holding a fake lightsaber And I just watch someone die Oh no no no Yeah I want to be the witness to that story Because the Avatar theme park at opening I heard it's amazing It rules But it was that thing where like Everyone gets
[00:20:44] To the Gates of Animal Kingdom The least popular theme park An hour before it opens For a franchise that's not One hundredth as beloved Right And the Avatar stuff is all the way In the back of Animal Kingdom And everyone's waiting outside the Gates
[00:20:57] For an hour so that the second the Gates Open they can like run to get in line For the Avatar ride Right Because very quickly that ride Becomes a six hour wait Or something Right And like the Star Wars thing Is going to be That times a billion
[00:21:10] Because everyone loves it The thing I've heard is that like The big rides this Millennium Falcon ride Yeah But it's like a six person ride Where everyone takes a different position On the Millennium Falcon It's actually an interactive thing Where like
[00:21:23] Where you can be in one of the In the gun chairs Oh You're not in one of the gun chairs How You fucked up No Pistor you have your Chewbacca So that's You're the Co-Pilot That's their battle is trying to make Each seat Cool Have its own advantages
[00:21:37] Good luck Yeah right Yeah you're the one who gets to sit there And play holo chess asshole But then here's the thing That's going to blow your guys mind Okay So the ride's actually interactive You're actually affecting the outcome Right You're making decisions Ben fix these fucking lights
[00:21:50] They're driving me crazy Sorry keep going It's not just like a band or snatch thing Where you activate like one of ten Possible options Like anything can happen Okay Right Literally anything But then you go on it Just for the listener Ben quote fix the lights
[00:22:05] By just turning them off Is that a problem? Yeah Just one third darker Ben took out a hammer And started smashing the light bulbs Right And now they're fixed The thing I've heard is that like You go on the Millennium Falcon ride
[00:22:19] You do well or this or that And then they'll like Through some weird like big brother Amazon Echo communication system Relay to cast members in the park Who are playing like Walk around Star Wars atmosphere characters So that if you're at like the cantina after that
[00:22:35] Some like scumbum will come to be like Oh it's you The guy who took the left They'll know what you did on the ride It's not that thrilling that I took a left I hope they got something better than that
[00:22:49] They might come out to you and go like Hey I heard it was your first time behind a gun And you took out three tie fights Right so no the exact details of what you did Fucking walk around the park with a boner
[00:22:59] For the rest of my day Right like you have a reputation at the park If you stay at the hotel that's double And is it because apparently you wake up As someone coming in and being like Quick take this But have you heard rumors that
[00:23:10] You can go into the park in the middle of the night For missions and stuff like that I don't know I know the hotel is like an all night kind of thing I tell you what I was just
[00:23:20] My parents spend a big chunk of the year in Florida now Because they're snow birds Classic snow birds And we went to Not one of the parks It's like Disney spring It's like their outdoor shopping mall type thing They have some attractions
[00:23:33] And they had a Star Wars virtual reality thing Have you done that thing? I just did it Did you do it? I did Dude, David do you know about that? I mean you're walking at one point You have a virtual reality helmet on And it's clearly
[00:23:46] It must be like a 10 foot square area With these hallways That they just have you keep walking around in loops But you don't feel that It's like a black box theater That they're like moving around There's one point where you feel like
[00:23:57] You're walking on like an open air bridge Over lava Where heat is blasting you from all sides And then people are shooting at you And you feel their shots hitting the bridge And shaking it And it's It's got like a laser type thing Where you're wearing the vest
[00:24:12] And if someone shoots you It vibrates the right amount Where you're like I feel the threat Without being painful Your instinct isn't like Oh this game is cool Your instinct is like Oh shit I better focus up There was a part that blew my mind where like
[00:24:26] Which is how it should be Like the VR ones that are just like Isn't this amazing that this exists? Like okay No this was the first time I was like I see this as a sustainable art form Like that I would want to play With validity
[00:24:39] It's the void Any city that has the void That's what this Star Wars thing is made for But that's the whole notion of The props are real if you touch anything It's actually tactile setup in the right way But there was a moment where like
[00:24:52] K2SO is like Your NPC like mission giver And it's just like Okay so there's like a CGI rendering of a robot there And you're just listening to him Give you the instructions before the gates open And then you walk out
[00:25:05] And you're ready for the mind blow of like The doors open And oh my god There's a door opening right there But as I was walking out I like my hand brushed across And I was like wait a second And I went back
[00:25:15] And there was a fucking full scale K2SO there Oh like a real right I think you were talking about There was like a ten foot statue And I was like feeling it And I was like This isn't just they put a mannequin in here
[00:25:27] Like this is clearly K2SO But it has the right dimensions and everything No no no I got you I got you Hey babe can I get a time check On how long we've been talking about Star Wars on the big fish episode? Yeah I'd say about 25 minutes
[00:25:38] The podcast is called Blank Check It's about filmographies, directors Who have massive success Are alone in their careers Can I ask you guys one last question? Anything? If we're playing by the rule of The less you know about a Star Wars character The cooler the character is
[00:25:50] Right the Kit Fisto rule let's call it The Kit Fisto rule But you guys know more about the cartoons And I don't know as much We don't know much Neither of us are super hard to them But we don't know And the comic books I've dabbled with
[00:25:59] And they're actually incredibly good You knew more about them I don't know what else has been explained there By the Kit Fisto rule Do I know more or less about Kit Fisto? Or Plou Koon I don't think any Plou Koon content Is it Koon or Koon?
[00:26:18] No I think you know Koon I think it's Koon or Koon It must be Koon No it's Plou Koon right? I think we got corrected Oh no it's Plou Koon Plou Koon that's what I said Yeah you got it Never doubt George Lucas' ability
[00:26:33] To walk right up to the line That's something that feels like a bad thing As we debated it I said to myself It better be Koon actually I hope I was the one of this one Are they gonna be playing Jizz At the Cantina? Most definitely
[00:26:45] Jizz America's favorite Music genre? Of course They are There will be a Cantina with a Cantina band That you can go Max Rebo? I don't know I've read about the Cantina band I haven't read about Max Rebo I heard Si Snoodals won't sign the contract
[00:27:02] Snoodals is holding out It's kind of like a Fleetwood Mac thing They all dated It's a Lindsay fucking camp It's real fucked up I was desperately like I can think of a third name But I forgot the other names Max Rebo Si Snoodals Is that the cool guy?
[00:27:19] Drew P. McCool Drew P. McCool What we once joked Ben would name his son Drew P. McCool Who you always think is the elephant But that's Max Rebo Drew P. McCool just looks Like an upside down pig It's more of an old Max Rebo is the band leader
[00:27:35] In the old swing band He's like a Tito Puente Si Snoodals is the front woman And then Drew P. McCool is just a pile of laundry Drew McCool looks like an upside down pig An upside down pig Oh no it's not the keys He's playing the...
[00:27:51] Max Rebo plays the keys Yeah Max Rebo's on the keys Who else he got No these names These are not names Oh no they expanded it In the re-releases Cause originally it was just They added In the re-releases they made Si Snoodals like a CGI
[00:28:06] Before she was just a puppet Who just sort of did this Just so jerky My favorite song Oh no wait no There's the guy who's like Ah! Ah! Ah! Like he's like a little free guy Yeah they just added him Looks like the annoying frog or something
[00:28:23] So is the answer Plo Koon? The answer Here's what I would say You know less about Plo Koon But it feels like you know less About Kit Fisto because there's so much more to know But it's and we see Here's the difference Kit Fisto Fights
[00:28:40] Right he's gotta say There's a larger amount of information We know about Kit Fisto But there is a smaller percentage That we know about Kit Fisto In terms of his entire life story He's an Edward Bloom type figure He has enough of a presence
[00:28:54] That we should know more Whereas Plo Koon they nailed it He's a simple guy He's a company man Yeah and Keati Mundy I think has been Very thoroughly explained in the comic books And he has like dialogue You know he like speaks in the pre-heals
[00:29:08] He speaks to mine He speaks to mine Ben quick time check Yeah we're doing Now we're hitting about 30 Now we're 30 Is everyone mad or are they amused at the callback Thrill I think people would be upset if we didn't do this Yeah I mean I'm excited for episode 9
[00:29:24] People keep saying a title's coming But we know nothing about it really When is that out? May or December? Christmas What if it turns out the movie is called Star Wars Episode 9 A title is coming And we've had the title What if it's just called Fisto
[00:29:40] Oh my god Well what are the other stand-alones they got coming up It canceled It's kind of in flux They've sort of taken their foot off the gas Reassessing Cause it's solo Yeah where they're like Let's release episode 9
[00:29:53] We have this TV show in the works called The Mandalorian Which is like going to be probably more what you're talking about Like a you know Scum bum Scum bum western starring With like a little less to do with the main
[00:30:06] Is it going to be for network or for their new For the new Disney Netflix That's going to be one of the things they get Nick Nolte's on it As a regular cast member That's right Werner Herzog is on it As a regular cast member
[00:30:16] Wait as a cast member That is true Ah how did I not know that That is true Oh I'm so happy Well they're going to start working It's going to be a disaster Nolte and Herzog together at last John Favreau is the show runner 2019 era Nick Nolte Yes
[00:30:33] In a show that co-stars Werner Herzog Yeah Can you imagine how much time Werner Herzog is going to send Studying Nick Nolte as if he were like an environmental Right he's going to make a documentary being like A creature in a zoo
[00:30:48] With like creep shots of Nick Nolte Being like nature has ravaged this man Like that Like you like it Once he caused damage with his fist Now time causes damage to his face And then they have the Ryan Johnson trilogy
[00:31:06] That is sort of not being talked about anymore Right and then the Game of Thrones Trilogy that's sort of not being talked about anymore That's dead You think that's dead I don't know if that's dead I wonder I think that's alive
[00:31:19] If it really backed out of all that to reassess the strategy I respect that Because it lets me know they're trying to say How do we keep this thing alive two or three decades from now I think that's the thought Someone intervened and was like
[00:31:30] We don't need a Star Wars every year They were like let's make the movies feel like events And we can do comics, do streaming shows Do all the other stuff in between And Solo showed that Make movies feel really special If Solo hit We would be
[00:31:44] Ewan McGregor, Star Big Fish Would be filming his Obi-Wan spinoff That wasn't just a rumor That was like Pretty much ready to go That one's a shame I agree Because that's what I want I want that There is a part of me that feels like
[00:31:58] Ben's laughing at me There's a part of me that feels like 40 minutes now Well, I will just say There's a part of me that feels like There's certain salvageable pieces of the prequels One of them being that we all did go You and McGregor, that's pretty cool
[00:32:11] He's kind of nailing it as young Obi-Wan And also, I just like Why not get those back He's aged up Yeah, he's aged Right, that he's spent time with this character And now he's It's 15 years later or whatever He's ready to do middle-aged Obi-Wan Right
[00:32:26] Don't cast another guy as Harrison Ford Like, you know, that's much more That's a harder needle to thread And he's been off the grid in general We'd all be happy to just see you and McGregor again He's starting to hit hard again now Because it's like Chris Robbin
[00:32:40] He's doing the sequel to The Shining That he's the villain in the Harley Quinn movie Like, now he's like a big studio guy again You know what? I was thinking about If we're talking about prequel stuff I was thinking about this on the way here It is wild
[00:32:56] That George Lucas made a character And it's everybody made fun of it So who cares Ahmed Best has gone on record Publicly saying he considered Yeah, he was suicidal He was very close to suicide Right That's the damage that George Lucas caused
[00:33:13] Has any other actor played a role So rededible That they've publicly said many times You know, I contemplated murdering myself Right Based on how people reacted to it And your wife had like worked with him And said he's like the sweetest Lovely, hardest working guy in the world
[00:33:31] And I have a little regret And our fans bring it up sometimes Where they were like They were really hard on him We were too hard on him back in the day You know, it's not his fault as much as it is You know, the writer and director
[00:33:42] Of this character Yeah, it was his big lake It was his big lake If I can bring that up again Yeah I think Let's talk about Big Lake Oh, of course Big Lake also my big lake Big Lake's your big lake Big Lake was my big lake
[00:33:59] You went into Big Lake thinking like This is gonna be a good thing Possible recurring You're one of Parnell's students Right Yeah Big Lake was my big lake Of course there's a podcast about The filmography's directors who have early success Now I did bring a big lake Yes
[00:34:15] Not necessarily Big Lake What fits in a big lake? I was just gonna say It is a segue towards Big Fish If you guys want to take it We're taking it Okay Because sometimes directors have massive success Early on in their career
[00:34:27] And given a series of blank checks Make whatever crazy passion projects they want Yeah And sometimes those checks clear And sometimes they bounce baby Sure And this is a main series on the films Of course of Tim Burton The only thing we've been talking about this episode
[00:34:40] It's called Podward Scissor Cast And Big Fish is I think a big Fulcrum point in his career Yeah it's about the midway point of his career Yes Movie wise It's the midway point and for me It creates a lot of interesting sliding doors questions Okay
[00:34:57] You mean like you think if this thing Had been a huge hit Like maybe Tim Burton Is the latter half of his career looks different? I think so I kind of think so I don't know exactly what it would have been Yeah
[00:35:09] But I get the sense in this movie That he's really trying to stretch himself And then I think the problem is When you have a guy like that Who out of the gate makes movies that are So huge His bar for success is so high
[00:35:22] That something like this That was kind of received as like A double or a triple And like a well liked movie that did okay Yeah It's just like fuck I gotta go back and do like a remake of something Now can I ask
[00:35:34] Cause you guys know more than I do Yeah I obviously know about a lot of Burton's work But I'm not a completist Is this his biggest departure from Gothic 5 I would argue so I mean my Hot topic My big take on this movie
[00:35:51] Is that this is the only time he's made a film Where like there are scenes that take place Entirely within the real world Right Because even Ed Wood is such a heightened version Of the real world Like every other movie he has Made has fantastical elements
[00:36:06] Right this is the only one that's like Batman In hospitals and homes and like People are drinking water Quite human moments Right and to me as like a Burton obsessed kid I was like this is really interesting To see Tim Burton try to shoot
[00:36:20] A normal dialogue scene between actors Sure You know Right And try to ground that Which I think works in certain scenes better than others If you got Billy Crudup in a senior You've got a problem It's weird when I was young When this movie came out
[00:36:35] I was all in a Crudup's performance And watching it now I find it very difficult I did on a re... I'm gonna go on record and say I unabashedly love this movie I've pretty much talked with us about it Yeah I mean when you put it out there
[00:36:49] I did pick it And I loved it to the degree That I was shocked when I started hearing people Cause I don't know if this is universal But at least in my circle I've heard people talk shit And say it's like a hallmark card And say
[00:37:06] Sure that it's a goo movie And I was shocked cause I felt like I had witnessed I will say a classic Oh Chris Gethard's our guest today Hey how you doing everybody By my new book Luzwell Ben just wrote on a piece of paper Introduce Chris
[00:37:24] Cool it was a blank track Power Scissor cast Big fish Chris Gethard we got it all out of the way Time check 45 minutes It's about 40 minutes I loved it I loved this movie And I thought that I thought I was shocked That people didn't
[00:37:40] When this movie came out Did you see it in theaters I did and I have actually I have a story that I don't know if it's amazing To the outside But for me The circumstances by which I saw this movie I will never forget I'll never forget
[00:37:53] I wanna hear that Well okay So I I've always been like a very big Jersey guy If you know my work at all You've heard me ramble about New Jersey And I lived there For the first 23 years of my life
[00:38:07] And it was a place that I really loved It was a place Where I felt very safe And it was a big piece of my identity When I started doing comedy in New York I was 19 And I kind of became known as like Oh that's that kid
[00:38:19] Who takes the train in from Jersey And he's so much younger Than the other people And I think people like to watch me figure it out And then I would get back on the train And go back to Rutgers And I was this kid from Jersey
[00:38:32] When I was 23 I got hired for my first ever job In Los Angeles Really my first Outside of doing like some spot acting gigs Like you know Dressing up for some of those Conan bits Was this for cross balls? Cross balls Yeah So I got this job
[00:38:50] On a Thursday And was told that I had to be there on Monday I'd never set foot in California in my life I think I'd never been further west than Chicago And all of a sudden it was like You have to Move out of your house
[00:39:03] Where I still lived with two of my college roommates You have to quit your job And just have to go Right And the job I was working at the time I worked at a magazine called Weird New Jersey I had worked there for three or four years
[00:39:16] And if you Most people would not know that magazine But I will tell you Anybody who grew up in New Jersey Who's around my age Or young girls No, no, no, no, no It's an institution It's an institution And if you think about
[00:39:29] Sort of the ethos of Weird New Jersey It is Sort of local legends and myth making With a pretty clear policy of Who cares if it's true If it's a fun story And a lot of these stories are rooted In some shred of fact
[00:39:44] And then grow out of control So I fly out to California I quit my job there My boss was like Oh my He later was like You can always give two weeks They pressured you into not Just give two weeks If they're not gonna
[00:39:57] If they're not gonna give you that You should be wary of working with I was like, you're right, you're right But I didn't know that I was young and fell like my shot So I moved out to California This was before there was a UCB theater
[00:40:07] There wasn't much of a comedy scene The comedy scene that there was Was well beyond my Experience point to participate in Right, it was like Big shots only Yeah, I wasn't gonna go up on stage at Largo At the age of 23 Right
[00:40:20] And I was shy, I was scared I was depressed I'd been on medication for a year This was in the early 2000 I had all these side effects All of a sudden my mom was terrified That I was going that far away When I was in that state
[00:40:32] And I had a friend who I knew I think two or three people Yeah, I knew three people Who lived in California at the time And one of them told me Why don't you come stay with me at first And he lived I believe if I remember right
[00:40:44] It was Huntington Beach And he told me that was part of LA And it is a very, very far I believe it was about a two hour drive But I would be you Where I'd be like Huntington Beach, sure I heard of it Yeah
[00:40:56] And I think it was Huntington I'm not sure Whichever beach it was It was one of those beaches You know the name And my buddy shows up Let's me into his house And he's like Hey, I gotta go And he doesn't even hang out with me Sure
[00:41:08] And I'm terrified And I'm overwhelmed I walk on the boardwalk I eat a fish taco For the first time in my life One of the loneliest Overwhelming cities to be Especially if you don't know anything about it Southern California is an isolating And you feel it immediately
[00:41:23] Incredibly isolated And like the idea of going out for a walk The city's just kind of like You can't really do that Like kind of laughing at you Oh, yeah I got one quick question Yeah, yeah, yeah The fish taco you ate
[00:41:35] What was the size of that thing It was pretty small I was shocked that it wasn't a big fish They had, no It was not a big fish taco It was a small fish taco I liked that you thought That was the moral
[00:41:43] The story where I was going I didn't think that was the end of the story But I thought that might be a little fun He said fish No, but that first night The first night I spent away from home In like a, and I mean home
[00:41:53] In a big sense Yeah, I get it Like my Samwise moment of I've never stepped this far away from my home Like that's a very impactful scene Your Mount Doom was A little bit Seeing big fish Well, I went to a movie theater
[00:42:07] Bought a ticket for the next movie That was playing It was Big Fish And here I am watching a movie That's A, about stories That don't necessarily need to be true And why don't you just buy in there It was my whole life
[00:42:20] That I had just walked away from Kind of summed up And then also about this character That's like, no, you got to kind of go out And build your own legend And you have to go into places That don't make sense for you
[00:42:30] You have to go into environments That aren't the small place you come from That doesn't mean you can't show pride In being from a small place Or a beat-up place All these things that the movie Wears on its sleeve I sat there in the theater
[00:42:43] And I was so scared But I just cried so hard And it gave me a lot of... It felt like a weight had been taken off my shoulder Of like, okay, I made the right choice You got to take some big swings And you got to kind of
[00:42:57] Go on your own hero's journey And you got to love stories So, like, Tim Burton was My guy I, for the first, like, ten movies was like Or nine I was like, hasn't missed I'm in the corner, everything he does This guy speaks my language
[00:43:18] My whole relationship to movies Is evolving around my, like, interest In his movies and, like, understanding That someone makes films and all this sort of stuff And then Planet of the Apes is just this, like The JFK assassination for me Right? It's just like...
[00:43:33] Oh, was that back-to-back with Planet of the... This is two years later, but this is, you know His last project was Planet of the Apes That was like the day the universe died I fell asleep to Planet of the Apes Boring movie
[00:43:45] About 11 minutes in and slept through the whole thing I mean, it's a horrific film It's a horrific film There's nothing that would rouse you Like, once you fall asleep, the movie's just boring I didn't realize that historically this was the bounce back from Planet of the Apes
[00:43:58] Right, so for me, the stakes of this movie were Like, this felt like Michael Jordan coming out of retirement Like, I was like, I want to believe... To be clear, for you For me! I said the stakes of this movie for me!
[00:44:10] I know, I just wanted to triple emphasize Double-tip, right, look We should all just be happy he made a sports analogy Exactly, exactly, he made some credit Exactly, he came out of retirement The one thing I know how to reference in sports
[00:44:22] Is anything related to the plot of Space Jam But you know... So Planet of the Apes felt like his baseball career And I was like, I want to believe that was a little weird Oh, I see, so you're saying it's him coming out of retirement
[00:44:31] The first time we're right Where he comes out and he's just, I'm back Two word statement and he's great again Planet of the Apes, I was like, is Tim Burton going to be playing Minorly baseball for the rest of his career? Like, is that guy gone? Right
[00:44:42] And then Big Fish, from the moment they announced it I was like, this sounds different This sounds like an evolution This was John August, who you know... You gotta... We do need to mention You gotta worship at the altar John August a little bit, right?
[00:44:56] Yeah, well so he reads the manuscript for this movie Before it was published Right, options are right away His father had just died And he was like, I need this You mean that the book, he reads the manuscript of the book Yes Right
[00:45:09] He had written it on publish It was to be published Right But it had not hit the market yet He read it His father had died and he was like, I get this so fucking hard He had written Go which was like his big hot
[00:45:21] Calling card, spec script At Columbia, went to Columbia And was like, please fucking buy this Worked so hard to try to adapt it The book is far more unstructured And just sort of episodic There's not as much of a spine I think around it Sure
[00:45:37] And he was trying to make it with Steven Spielberg And Jack Nicholson Right That was the plan, this was gonna be like a list of ales This is one of those Spielbergs that came close Like where Spielberg was gonna do it
[00:45:50] And then he decided to make Catch Me If You Can It was This was gonna be the everything right after Minority Report It makes so much sense because the who's better at... Spielberg seems almost ludicrously like a match for this Like an unapologetic nostalgia feel
[00:46:07] About dads, distance with your dad And the magic of storytelling It's a Spielberg movie It is Not a Tim Burton movie No, I agree Outside of a very important character that I just want to say We have to talk about at one point Dana Vita the werewolf
[00:46:22] No, better Better, although so close Interesting Mr. Sagi Bottom is the best of this movie I'm obsessed with Mr. Sagi Bottom I mean if you wanted to sum up Tim Burton in one image It's Mr. Sagi Bottom A single tear running down his cheek
[00:46:36] Having opened up his chest to reveal a silver gun That is incredible It's my favorite part of the movie We'll get to it We'll get to it Deep Roy is a legend This is the first Deep Roy appearance No, no He's in something else
[00:46:48] I forgot that he was accredited Yeah I think he's under makeup so you don't realize it's him or something Deep Roy who was the Yoda stand-in Yeah Oh yeah He was the Sagi Bottom stand-in for Yoda He was Drupy McCool No, in the original In the original
[00:47:04] When you see like That was Mr. Sagi Bottom He was the stand-in The stand-in Yeah, I know he wasn't I mean it's a puppet I know he wasn't the real Drupy McCool Oh no, Drupy McCool he operated He did He was a puppeteer He was Drupy McCool
[00:47:17] He was Drupy I had no idea we were going to come that full circle He was an E-Walk He was an E-Walk It's on Drupy is basically like As is true for a lot of little people Any fantasy movie you've heard of You know what I mean?
[00:47:30] And he's just He was like a background guy But let me see He had some real marquee characters He's in Planet of the Eight Thank you He's one of the eight kids He's a gorilla kid He's the one that I think a fucking hell in Bombard Chastises
[00:47:45] Just in case we lose our train of thought with him Have to point out His scenes in Eastbound and Down Are so funny Oh yeah That's him Yes, yeah, of course Aaron I'm Yoda bitch And then rips off the fake mustache and says I always carry two Yeah
[00:48:01] That scene I re-rounded about ten times in a row the first time I saw it And I cried laughing He's a really good actor We're going to get to Mr. Charlie and the Chocolate Factory Which is like his masterpiece Where he played every Yompa Lumpa
[00:48:13] But I love that guy That shit bugged me out though And where Tim Burton demanded that they pay Deep Roy A million dollars Which I love Really? Deep Roy pocketed a cool mill He was just like This guy's been a fucking journey man
[00:48:24] We're going to have him play 80 Yompa Lumpa Pony up and give him one million dollars He played how many? 165 Yeah, give him a fucking mill He played 165 characters in one movie Yeah, where it like And they had to like photograph him doing every move Like Sagi bottom
[00:48:39] Bring in the heat Fucking Sagi bottom Alright So this Planned The Apes felt like Fuck, have we lost Tim Burton Right, it's sort of one of those things Where he was on such a run That him getting off the run You're like, oh is that Is he just
[00:48:53] That's it He's high track forever Right, and then the Spielberg thing The analogy was kind of interesting Because Spielberg was a guy where for so long They were like Ah, he's so kinetic He's so much style He's so caught up in his childhood
[00:49:06] When's he going to grow up and make a real movie? Which the critics of Tim Burton In the 80s and 90s would always say that Like we get it You can create things But when are you going to sit down Tell a real story
[00:49:15] Which I always found kind of reductive Yeah I think now in retrospect people are like We should again look at more credit When he was doing this wacko shit Because no one does wacko shit as well as him Because before it We're talking Beetlejuice, Batman, Edward Scissorhands
[00:49:29] Peewee's big adventure Peewee's big adventure Was Nightmare Before Christmas before it? Doesn't direct that But that's his story Right, still from his world Yes, right His run in order is Peewee, Beetlejuice, Batman Edward Scissorhands Batman returns Edward, Mars Attacks, Sleepy Hollow, Plain of the Apes Damn
[00:49:48] So not everyone likes Mars Attacks to Sleepy Hollow So for some people maybe Burton, the Rose is wilting Right, and Sleepy Hollow did well Mars Attacks didn't But for me it was like But Mars Attacks I think has aged well I think it's a master of it
[00:49:59] Yeah, yeah, Mars Attacks has aged very nice Edward, was Edward a more Would you say that was closer To like a less fancy Yes, mature film And it makes no money And wins some osmoids And I think it's his best movie He'd flirted with it
[00:50:10] But it's still that movie's very much Like a weird comedy It's playing a weird tonal game I think that's his best film I think the film's incredible Right But you go like Well there's like a clear lateral move Of like Tim Burton making a highly stylized film
[00:50:24] About people who make highly stylized films Right, right And then this felt like Is this Tim Burton trying to do The Spielberg evolution Of just like I'm gonna sort of make the movies about Reckoning with my Sort of a permanent state of adolescence
[00:50:40] My obsession with fantasy worlds, you know? Now at the time I remember feeling like Bullet Dodge We don't want Spielberg making this This is so in his wheelhouse That he's gonna go so sappy with it But this is weirdly the period As we've covered on this podcast
[00:50:53] Where Spielberg starts getting really dark Like the fact that he makes Catch Me If You Can instead Which is the other My weird relationship with my father You can't go home again movie But it's a movie that is like so sad And then he starts making
[00:51:06] Some of like really grim dystopian Sci-Fi Right, my network reports the year The same year Right, so You could argue that Tim Burton And Steven Spielberg Kind of sort of tried to flop Cultural roles for one year Right, he becomes a really tortured Sort of dystopian filmmaker
[00:51:24] And then Tim Burton is now maybe Seeing like can I move into The Spielberg state The other big thing here is In between Plain and the Apes in this movie He ends his relationship with Lisa Marie Which lasted for the better part of a decade
[00:51:37] And then he chacks up with Hanan Barham Carter She gets pregnant He's about to have his first child And both of his parents die You know all of it I know all of this He does proceed, I will say A bold move to I believe gives his wife
[00:51:48] Three roles Three roles You could argue three separate roles Yes Right, the witch Young girl and then Well she plays She's really two roles I guess It's the witch and then the real person But plays the real person at two different ages Correct Yeah that's true
[00:52:04] Playser is a The sort of vaguely fantasy version Of adult Janny and then plays the Right, because those are also two very different Tones of performance when she has to work against Well initially when she's the witch You're like oh he gave his girlfriend a cameo
[00:52:17] In the movie And then when she comes back You're like oh she's like the dramatic Spine of the movie Right In the most Tim Burton-y part of the movie The witch For sure Yeah but so this to me felt like Is he gonna like get it back
[00:52:31] Is he gonna go right back in the pocket But also grow, also evolve Does this become a turning point where like Plan of the apes is the movie that makes him take A long hard look in the mirror and go like
[00:52:39] Who does Tim Burton wanna be for the next ten years Who's Tim Burton in the two thousands And I saw this movie and was like Unqualified triumph I don't think I've told you this I walked out of this theater and said
[00:52:49] This is my number one favorite movie of all time Wow Didn't you also see it ten times or something I saw it, I think I was trying to do the math on it At least eight in theaters That's Crazy I don't cry at movies
[00:53:01] I cry at movies all the time It destroyed me so hard that I was like I need to go back I need another hit of that thing I cry at movies You know I'm a very emotional person I'm a crazy crier, this movie ruins me
[00:53:11] And I always know it's going to You do But now see I feel like The sense I've gotten from our pre-conversations David's a little more reserved Is that you are a little bit more in the camp of Well can I talk about my experience with big fish
[00:53:25] Yeah cause I just wanna put one more Cause Chris had his incredibly profound Like you know sort of Life changes Growing up is you know complicated But ultimately necessary story You gave us a biographer's level of detail About where Tim Burton's life was at the time
[00:53:41] And my level of investment My mental sanity being reliant on By the rock How old were you when this was 2003 14 This is my freshman year I'm 23 I'm 17 I just wanted before you get to your relationship State the big elephant in the room
[00:53:54] My relationship's not going to be that big by the way But yes No but there's the big elephant we have to acknowledge Which is we're recording this four days after Albert Finney died Albert Finney who's maybe your favorite leading man In the history of cinema
[00:54:04] I love Albert Finney so much Is an actor you're like very emotionally attached to Very he's my dad Right I didn't want to say that before you He is like I mean he's the working class English guy Who kind of like you know Jumped at the ranks
[00:54:17] As an English actor who's very crucial as a star When he's young Right As like Oh this is more working class guy This is like a salt of the earth guy Which in the 60s in Britain My father was a working class guy
[00:54:28] When I went to see Saturday night Sunday mornings You were like you should know that's my dad's movie Right right like that is my dad's movie That's the movie that my father sat me down and was like This is the movie about me Right
[00:54:38] So like David was introduced to young Albert Finney As his father saying this is my analog in the soul But Finney rules man Finney's always like I love every phase of Finney I love this phase you know where he's You know He's an old guy
[00:54:50] He's a bit of a ham Terrific in the film Was he nominated No he was not even nominated in Tim Robbins When's for Mystic River Which is not a good performer And you could also say Cause we have all sort of We've been talking very manic fashion about
[00:55:03] Crudups Weird in this Finney saves Finney might save this movie He certainly saves any scene he's in with Crudup Like Crudup is like Like walking around the set smashing it And Finney's like Nah come on don't do that You know like Sorry Karyn
[00:55:18] No no no I think it's I need to hear the dissenting opinion Oh okay well alright Alright look So for me I'm an Oscar watcher Cause you know I'm a big Oscars fan Especially when I'm younger And this movie when it was coming out Everyone was like
[00:55:31] This is it Burton's making the leap Like he's gonna get Oscar nominations This movie's gonna be huge This is gonna be like when Spielberg Sort of finally got anointed Like it'll be the big moment Where like Hollywood is like Burton You've made a grown up movie
[00:55:46] Exactly you've been a weirdo And you've made your money This is a Tony Glossy emotional But now we recognize you Grown up movie And so then when I saw this movie I had the reaction that I feel like a lot of people had Which was like
[00:55:58] That thing is a fucking slog You know it's long Like the hype was so deafening And like you know It's okay but like it wasn't like I think I was expecting like to be like Spielberg'd I guess Like to be blown away with wonder
[00:56:16] You know like all these like color These sets and this like You know right this imagination on screen And I was more like That thing's kind of a slog The ending is kind of amazing And like a Fellini movie And sort of like just like
[00:56:30] Hits you in the gut And you're sort of like Pays out like a slot machine Double though it pays out like a slot machine Which is your favorite It fucking pays out like a slot machine That ending We were recording when I said I believe I said earlier
[00:56:40] It was a three point shot And you actually said no That was a four point shot With the way that it saved that movie In the big three basketball League you can hit a four point shot If you're standing in a specific circle On the court
[00:56:52] I thought he meant he got fouled And made the foul shot Or it's the LJ Yes it gets awesome That's how close it was to disaster though For you that if the ending Not disaster but it was more like I was like very mixed on it
[00:57:01] I was sort of like This is like is this Tussier And like it's so fucking long It's not that long But like you know It's a solid two hours Two fifteen I think Right Two ten yeah Yeah and so I'm just like And then the ending destroys me
[00:57:16] And I'm like I can't like this movie Just because the ending's that good Right you know what I mean And for my whole life The rest of my life I have always wrestled with like Do I just like the ending And is that even
[00:57:28] Does it even work that way If I like the ending so much The movie must work for me in some way Where it's like it's laying the track So when I'm like You know what I mean Like you know so the ending wouldn't work for me
[00:57:37] If I didn't like the movie at all Like you can't just make a bad movie And then at the end it's like You know death and then I'm like Oh you know like it works for me When I was fourteen I was all in
[00:57:48] I was taking all that they got Right when I watch it now I've watched it twice in the last two years Right you rewatched it Not that or Right and I was like Oh this is the first time I've rewatched it A little while and I see lumpiness
[00:58:00] For the first time I was so madly like You know Edward Bloom Time stops popcorn in the air And love with this movie Where I was like You know Wreck-It Ralph style I will brook no criticism You can't say anything bad about this movie It's magic it works
[00:58:13] You're a cynical bastard Right And in the last two times I've watched it I see a ton of problems I see a lot of things that totally work for me And I'm watching it There's lumpy And I'm going like
[00:58:23] Fuck do I like overrate this thing in the mind And then you get to the last fifteen minutes And it's not one of those things where just like Well this is fifteen minutes of good filmmaking But it's one of those things where
[00:58:33] That only works if the movie has set up Everything properly Right And it's one of those things where you go Even the things that feel like They kind of don't work in the movie Up until that point End up lending power to The ending bizarrely
[00:58:47] That's why I use the slot machine now Because it's literally all the quarters you've been dumping in Let me ask you guys too When we're talking about the ending There's the river I'm talking about And then there's the funeral I go fifteen minute mark He wakes up
[00:59:01] We're talking about those in He wakes up in the house with that continuous What feels like a symphony That's when we're in a long distance race And it has that moment of like It's time to fucking get my kick in And go for the ending
[00:59:12] And you see it accelerate towards the finish line On the soundtrack That is one twelve minute track From the time you wakes up to the end of the movie And I think of that section Of course Chris How long have we known each other
[00:59:26] And how many media do you own it though That's my question How many times have you purchased it Do you have it on CDN? I don't know vinyl I bought it on CD I manually uploaded it Onto my iTunes circa 2006 And still have that in the cloud
[00:59:41] You guys will like that Okay, side tracks We're talking soundtracks I didn't plan on talking about this today I was in the car recently And had my iPod on I was with Allie And it was on shuffle And a track came up It was an instrumental track
[00:59:58] And Allie was like What the hell is this And I said Oh, it's a I listened to it On my way to Jiu Jitsu class To get pumped up It's the last of the Moheakin soundtrack Right, Trevor Jones My wife just paused it with
[01:00:11] That is so midlife crisis I listened to the last of the Moheakin soundtrack The kiss It's the best track Yes I've talked about this I listen to movie music all the time Mostly because I need something while I'm writing That's not vocal
[01:00:32] Can I ask you, off of Griffin's point I do feel like watching it back Just a few nights ago in preparation for this The length is in part because There's all these little vignettes, right? For sure Griffin's arguing that the ending I agree with his argument
[01:00:50] See, even I, an unabashed Defender of this movie Is there a fun topic of discussion to be had Which vignette would you lose? Which one would you lose? There's no question which vignette you lose Really? No question Because I debate them heavily in my mind
[01:01:08] There's no fucking question I would be sad to lose it Because I think the payoff is nice But there's no question what you lose There's no question which vignette you lose I think I know There's one vignette where I'm like When I'm watching it
[01:01:22] There's one vignette where you're like Can I guess? I'm gonna go in the order of ones where I know it's not them Is not the giant No Can't lose the giant The giant is incredible Rules You can't lose the hockey bottom No way, I don't know about that
[01:01:37] I'm gonna say But David's playing close to the end I'm enjoying this now He's not tipping off his hands You can't lose Spectre No Him wandering into this weird magical step for Wiser We should talk about Spectre But you can't lose Spectre You can't lose it
[01:01:52] We have to talk about Spectre Wander through the woods down the forbidden trail Into this perfect town that seems so great Can't lose that No, I love that part But although we have to talk about it Him in the army That's what you lose I kind of agree
[01:02:03] That's gotta go You lose the conjoined twins I don't think that's gotta go But I think you need to cut some I like the twins because I like The eventual reveal that they're just Regular twins They're just too late That's a lovely moment
[01:02:14] I think that's a lovely moment I don't like him with an English to Asian dictionary And like jumping into this fucking ventriloquist That where I'm just like I get that it's a tall tale And then it's a little, you know It's supposed to be inflated
[01:02:30] It is one of those What's going on here It's a sex up the movie Sammy's twins Where you go like And you post to the Steven Spielberg Version of the movie You remember like Oh right Tim Burton is inherently a comedic filmmaker Sure
[01:02:44] And he cannot turn down what he thinks is a fun gag I would argue Hit me That when you were at that funeral I agree And Crudup starts to realize that All these things are true But not as true That there's a middle ground
[01:03:00] That he never gave his father credit for That he never bothered to ask And he just dropped down the levels of crying From like crying to sobbing Which I will also say In rewatching it too The idea that all these people were close enough to Finney
[01:03:16] They were close enough to Ed Blum To travel back for his funeral But none of them came back Throughout the entire course of Billy Crudup's life To visit and show Maybe get him to chill out And realize some of this was based in fact Is a flaw
[01:03:29] That's actually a fair point I don't usually think about it I think that the conjoined twins Showing up to everyone's amazement And then separating where you go I think it's amazing I love that That was the exaggeration I'm just saying if you're asking me Which one to kill
[01:03:46] See, I disagree I would put something out there And maybe your love Who are you gonna kill? Well, it's a question for you guys Because you are far more Obviously film connoisseurs than I am I would argue That if it wasn't name actors You lose either Danny DeVito
[01:04:07] At least for the length that he has Or Steve Buscemi as the bank robber See, Buscemi I love And I like that the character goes through Weird stages I think the DeVito character maybe Is a little... I don't think you give him as much time
[01:04:21] To tease out the here's a fact about Your loved one and the werewolf I think it's a little too much The werewolf thing is crazy Because it's sort of like And it turned out he was a werewolf And you're like, it did
[01:04:31] And then you don't bring it up again But Danny DeVito wandering naked I like that Out of the woods From behind shot And the soggy bottom tier And gun moment is to me brilliant The way they stretched out that I worked Once a year I got a fact
[01:04:45] Once a year I got a fact Once a year I got a fact I don't think you give that half as much time If it's not Danny DeVito If you remember back then too I think he wasn't I mean his peak was in the 80s early 90s
[01:04:57] Oh yeah, at this point he's full character actor He's American legend This is before always sunny Before always sunny where he's just like I'm gonna fuck around Like in this next part of my career And I wouldn't say it's quite as cool
[01:05:12] As Bill Murray showing up in Rushmore But it's a similar thing of like Oh, it's that dude we used to love Doing like a smaller one off thing You know what Tim Burton said What's that? Danny DeVito plays the ringmaster Hold on, I just want to say Griffin
[01:05:24] No, I do not know what Tim Burton said You know what he said famously Danny DeVito plays the ringmaster He's addressed to Congress And Tim Burton's We must tear down this wall Danny DeVito plays the ringmaster In the upcoming Tim Burton Dumbo movie
[01:05:42] And apparently Tim Burton just called him And said Danny we have to complete Our circus trilogy Right, that was the pitch Oh my god Right, Penguin, Big Fish Werewolf man Dumbo Is that true? He's done three top hat movies with Teddy W Leading a circus of outcasts
[01:05:59] I did not realize that So it's his only way that he likes to use Danny DeVito, that and rude gambler Rude gambler, rude gambler is the outlier Right, Mars attacks He plays a character in Mars attacks Called Rude Gambler Danny DeVito was fourth billed above the title
[01:06:12] In Mars attacks for a character With no proper name And less than six lines of dialogue And just says Tom Jones, it ain't unusual It ain't unusual And gets blasted to smithereens With a laser gun We already talked about this for 75 minutes Still funny, though
[01:06:26] I do think too There's something that makes me giggle so hard About like So you're at the funeral Which is beautiful to me And the giant He's not 15 feet tall But he's seven feet tall The twins are there They're not conjoined But they're twins
[01:06:40] How much of that is true? Lovely Danny DeVito is just a dude with scraggly hair He does have the like The perspex cane Like the clear cane But you also go like Is this guy like 100 now? You know, because like Some questions are like
[01:06:57] You and McGregor turned into Albert Finney DeVito just stayed DeVito the whole time Like as we think about it All of them did Right Well you go McGregor This show means at least got grey hair But yeah McGregor at the beginning of the film Was playing much younger
[01:07:09] Like he's playing like high school Early 20s My girlfriend was like He's supposed to be 18 Like I mean and he's 32 At this point But it's a tall tale Can I just say something also That distracted me upon the rewatch That's just condescending and pithy
[01:07:24] And I don't remember this From other films I've seen them in Because you and McGregor Especially in those young man scenes In Big Fish Kind of weirdly have meth teeth Something's going on Got some scraggly teeth Like was he a real heavy smoker? Probably
[01:07:45] I mean not to double down On stereotypes about British dental care But it is poor But it's not that That has weird teeth too Finney's got sort of like It's a young man Finney grew up in like He was born in like the 30s
[01:07:59] Like that Britain genuinely had Horrible dental care I feel like with McGregor All of his dentist was that guy In the bathroom at Port of the Lord I'm sorry I had to Listen I've seen McGregor before this And after this And even later in the same movie
[01:08:16] You think he got his teeth done Yeah But even later on in Big Fish But this scene Particularly like the Daffodil field scene When he has that big grin on his face I was actually distracted Where I was like His teeth look Like weirdly grey or something
[01:08:31] In a way they don't look For the rest of this entire movie Maybe he was just like chain smoking He could have been This is in between Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith Oh is it? Right this is that period where they're like
[01:08:43] I guess you and McGregor Is like a major studio leading man Well it's also I mean here he's being cast I feel like firmly in his Moulin Rouge role Where it's like He is a very pretty sweetie pie And Down with Love is the other one
[01:08:57] Where it's like this is him doing like High sort of stylized And let's watch Rupal down On him doing an American accent Even though he is not good at it He's not And adding in an Alabama twang This time But see I'm into that
[01:09:13] Like that's why I think this worked I think McGregor is awful At a normal American accent He's not good I think he gets the latitude Dozens of times I think the latitude he gets in this movie is He's playing a fantasy version
[01:09:26] Of an actor already doing an over the top southern draw Yeah you're giving him the lead Now can I I'm gonna say something since we're on the topic Of the southerns Karthup doesn't have a southern accent Since we I know Doesn't even try Just a
[01:09:37] Sounds like Master Cardat He's so in Master Cardat He is so under playing it Except for any scene where you have to like Pick up a phone Or do some boring business And that I'm like Karthup chill out Just pick up the phone Like a regular person
[01:09:49] I remember I'm gonna rewatch I can admit It's a weird He does just not seem like a human being Scenes where his intonation is Abnormal to the degree You can't believe that Tim Burton Didn't pull him aside and go like Speak like a normal fucking human being
[01:10:03] What are you doing in my movie We were saying before we started recording That the thing And I feel like I've heard him say this In interviews Especially at this time period This was like his game He liked to play with himself
[01:10:13] Was he would like look at a normal line of dialogue And try to figure out the weirdest way to say it That Karthup said that? Yeah People wonder why Billy Karthup Didn't have a movie star career He would actually say that
[01:10:23] Right, and it's not even like a Nicholas Cage thing Where it's like I want to find the most interesting take On my character that's unexpected He was like I will look at a line And try to break down What the obvious syntax would be
[01:10:32] And then put the emphasis on the wrong words And try to make it sound natural And it's like just too much work dude He sucks Okay, here's my problem with the movie I think it kills the end Okay, here is You just said the sentence
[01:10:42] Here is my problem with the movie I'm excited for this Cause you know like it's that I need to be a little on his side And I am at no point on his side The whole movie is about A shithead son coming home to his dad
[01:10:58] And being like You fucking asshole with your stories And you're like What else did the dad do And he's like I don't know He wasn't around a lot And you're like That's it? That's all you're mad about? You charmed everybody You're like
[01:11:12] I'm at my wedding with your fucking speech That charmed the room Like this is I have to be on your side for two hours So here's my take To you You weirdly don't More than any other movie I've ever seen You The actual hero
[01:11:26] And by the John August script notes definition Of a hero Right You don't have to worry about this person at all I kind of agree with you Cause it is amazing The movie ends It's a flaw And the movie's moral is kind of like Relax It's like Yeah
[01:11:42] Was it so crazy Once he gets to him telling the story Suddenly Kredup is just in the pocket On a faasie Not over playing it doing it well He knows to sort of show up for that scene Right He's not needed And that's all
[01:11:55] Like pretty tight close up And he's like He's killing that When I was 14 And I was all in on this movie That performance worked for me When I watch it now And I have my troubles I think they mostly come from the fact
[01:12:06] That I have such a hard time dealing with Kredup Because even He's so much on board with She is She's so charming This is her first American film And her linking up with the dad immediately Also underlines how much She immediately turns on him Right
[01:12:20] She's like this is the guy you were complaining about You've played with this guy forever Oh I could Like turn off This guy is Turn off the TV Turn off the TV He's so charming Yes Poor couple Warm cocoa And listen to these guys yarns Yeah Hey Dickhead
[01:12:35] Have you not noticed that your dad Is played by Albert Finney You lucky son of a bitch Now can I say something that I think Griffin you'll agree with And David I have a feeling Might infuriate you Okay Based on what you've said And because of your role
[01:12:48] And your job As a cultural commentator Okay I thought this when I first saw it And Even in the rewatch I stand by it As I was watching this movie And its dedication Towards being sort of a southern Movie The southern exaggerator Kind of this archetype of
[01:13:09] That I think very much Of the American south Of the tall tale He literally brings back The deliverance kid You know the banjo guy In this movie is the kid from Deliverance Is that true? Yeah Oh that's me That being said When I watched this movie
[01:13:22] I was like Oh Huckleberry Finn To kill a mockingbird Sure Big fish You're putting it all The way up there Yeah The idea of the kids Who get themselves so worked up About Boo Radley And sure Boo Radley Is this recluse That's the tradition
[01:13:38] That the story is there But he's a damaged guy With a good heart Huckleberry Finn Who tells these tales And lies to get You know and Tom Sawyer Even more so maybe Watch out for that Telling the lies To get what he wants But he's also like
[01:13:50] A devil may care charmer Sure It's an archetype I love that I feel like Oh has there been A cinematic entry into that As much as How we finish character No because it's tricky Like in this movie In the great southern Novels right A lot of the great
[01:14:05] I mean there's southern gothic And this is sort of the opposite Of that it's more the Sort of southern fairy tale Stuff where you're like Can we talk about What's going on You're like in the movies Like that We gotta put that over there
[01:14:15] We can't talk about it We can't talk about reality Let's talk about like These lovely you know Sort of magical communities And like the trees That we did say We have to talk about Spectre We gotta talk about Spectre We gotta talk about Spectre
[01:14:29] What the fuck is going on In Spectre I just wanna say this There are some rules That you can't mention Is it good or evil That's what I kinda like about it You're talking about That it's like There's something we should Dig a little deeper
[01:14:41] In the second half Once he goes back, sure When she's saying Like you're saying this town Is not gonna change I'm like right Let's talk about it But then they just Don't kinda talk about it I just wanna say Chris Because you're such a good Story teller
[01:14:53] And you were at this point So well oiled In when to take your dramatic Beats in any sort of Story you're telling Or point you're making When you were building up That defense I thought you were genuinely Gonna say Big fish Huckleberry hound
[01:15:09] You took a long beat in between And I thought that was Gonna be your defense Was relating to the Stalkerberry hound Wow And I was strapped in But I didn't know If you could land that plane I wish I had landed That punchline Huckleberry
[01:15:22] Griffin, do you know anyone Because you have known me Pretty much since I started Performing Before we were friends Yes, I was a big fan Of yours from the time I started performing Does it make sense to you I feel like I don't know Clearly in terms of
[01:15:37] Legend building with a wink And a nod Is there any comedian Who came out of New York That has done that more than me In an Ed Blum-esque way No, no And I didn't even realize Because we just sort of Through to you I sort of am an
[01:15:50] Ed Blum-esque guy Who knows how to tell A story that's true And leave out all the Context That's pretty much all my Stand up And everybody who Started liking me Ten, twelve years ago That's what they liked about me And I literally Like the same year that I'm
[01:16:04] Like seeing Big Fish Eight times in theaters My friend and I are scouring The UCB website to figure out Any show that you're in Because I'm trying to explain To people like This guy has these Crazy stories that don't make Sense Like I don't understand
[01:16:16] What his life is In between these stories In the Big Fish kind of way Like just like You guys would be fascinated By this So there's a story We covered for Weird New Jersey It's in the woods Of Northern Virginia People for many decades
[01:16:30] Have been telling tales of someone Called the Bunny Man Who's a man who dresses In a pink bunny suit Sure And attacks people with an axe Oh Some people say that he's An escapee from a lunatic asylum Some people say that he Killed all these rabbits
[01:16:43] And stitched together This really fucked up Not pink like Fucked up looking bunny suit Right And all this stuff And it's a great story It's a great story But what I love the most About it Is you can find a newspaper Article from the early 70s
[01:16:57] Where there were two people Making out in a car In a half built condo development And a man in a bunny suit Came charging out of the woods Waving a hatchet around Yelling something about They shouldn't be developing This area This is farmland
[01:17:13] And kind of threw the hatchet At the car and ran away Clearly like a maniac Yeah But it was real On some level Sure He didn't kill dozens Of people in the woods Right And that's the type of story I've always been in love with
[01:17:26] Is there's a kernel of truth That's the type of story I always try to tell In my comedy Yeah Is And my wife always gives me Shit about this Where she's like The story you're telling Is true but it's not true She wants She's crud up She's like
[01:17:40] Give me the context She's not crud up Because she's not a fucking stick In the mud denying Who she is and where she came from For totally arbitrary Unexplained reasons Yeah But she Especially since we got married And now sometimes The stories involve her Right
[01:17:53] She has held my feet To the fire a little bit more Of like The life at the context That involves me It might make me look crazy Or severe in ways I wasn't Sure I love a good lie That's not a lie Yeah
[01:18:06] And this movie's a tribute to that And I don't know if there's Another one that No, I think that's the thing The themes What this movie is about Is something I am so In on You know What I think is such rich Fertile territory About our relationship
[01:18:20] To stories Sure And how we process The truth and why we Mythologize things So much since that John August Later went on to start script notes as well Right The other scene in this movie That I think is great And doesn't get enough credit
[01:18:33] Is the Robert Guillaume scene Where he tells Really credit the story I was telling Ben That scene's a master's That scene That's John August's Probably the turning point Probably the turning point For a tourkianning That being said Did rewatch it and think to myself
[01:18:47] In a very weird way And I have to assume It's because of like Racial politics and everything Has an actor Ever How would I say it Because I have great respect Has there ever been an actor More criminally underutilized Throughout the course of his career In Robert Guillaume
[01:19:03] Sure, in Robert Guillaume He's always playing like An ancillary Yes In movies And he's the fucking best Even when he got his own TV Show it was still kind of Like the premise is That he's sort of ancillary To the main family Right Like Benson
[01:19:16] That was his role No One of those guys Was criminally underutilized And you watch him in this And you're just like He's an elegant actor He's an elegant actor He's an elegant actor It's a tremendous scene I do
[01:19:28] Like it is a scene where he has to sit down With a fucking grown ass man Who's about to have a child The value of You know, these kinds of stories Is that they make things A little more interesting Billy Crudup is like
[01:19:39] An atomic bomb just went off Like this is You're a grown man Right Understand How hard is that to understand I still think that scene is So good So the Crudup thing is obviously Like what the movie struggles with now Not exclusively But what like
[01:19:53] Makes the movie lumpy Right And I had this realization Watching it last night Where I was like This movie has Sort of the opposite Of what worked so well In Black Panther Okay Ride me out On this one Keep going Which is that like
[01:20:14] Black Panther, the thing that blows my mind Is that Cougler was like I'm gonna take My personal experience My thoughts and feelings Put it into the villain I know the audience is Automatically gonna be on Black Panther side Because he's the hero of the movie
[01:20:27] And he does heroic things Sure I'm gonna try to invest Everything that I believe in Into a character who then On top of that does villainous things So that the audience Cares about the villain Because I'm putting My heart and soul into that character
[01:20:39] So that he feels like A fully rounded thing And not a plot device Or stakes or something like that Right I think this movie has A weird thing where Tim Burton is making this movie After his father's died Sure When he's about to become a dad
[01:20:51] He said that he had A terrible relationship With his father In a sense that his father Just was like I don't get it Why you drawing so many circles Around the eyes, Tim You know His father wasn't mean But was just like Just the fundamental disconnect
[01:21:03] I openly don't understand myself I had a kid And the kid's just weird And I don't know what to do It's weird Why doesn't he want to play catch Right And he died And he was having all these Sort of mixed emotions about
[01:21:13] On top that he's becoming a father And he's trying to figure that out And he gets the script And it hits him like Kind of bricks But I think to Tim Burton Reading the script Weirdly, Billy Crudup is his father Where he has contempt for
[01:21:24] The fact that the guy doesn't get it Uh-huh Whereas most people Come live in the real world I think most people who would Make this film Most directors would be like Well obviously The relatable human character is the son And the father's a fabulous
[01:21:38] And you have to slowly Over the course of the movie Get the audience on board With the father Right And Tim Burton is so Charmed by the father Because the way the father Makes his world around him Is exactly what Tim Burton Wants to fucking do
[01:21:49] With his art And the son is just some pill You know So I don't think he's openly like I hate this fucking guy But I think it seeps into the movie Combined with Billy Crudup Being such an antagonistic actor Now Griffin I think there might be something there
[01:22:03] That's theory A Okay It's father stuff Is there any world in which you might buy That it's a very similar thing Except instead of Billy Crudup representing Tim Burton's doubting father This entire movie was made as a Reaction and commentary to How America received Planet of the Apes
[01:22:22] That's theory And Albert Finney is the Tim Burton yarn spinner And Billy Crudup represents All of America Who represented The ticket-finding audience of America Who absolutely rejected His most recent yard Right Or Billy Crudup could also Just represent like the studio system Right Like Billy Crudup represents Hollywood
[01:22:38] And he's just like Making some commentary in the same way that I always felt like chasing Amy Made some commentary about clerks And mall rats Right Hey Blank Check listeners I'm Adam Kempinar And I'm Josh Larson We're the host of film spotting Which is basically
[01:22:51] Blank Check except in Chicago That's not true We both talk about movies Sure, but we're not very funny But the movie thing That's the same Also long shows In-depth reviews and interviews Right, Ethan Hawke, Paul Schrader And Beau Burnham were all on last year
[01:23:06] Plus top five lists and other stuff Every Friday since 2005 Ryan Johnson said that nice thing About us once A force for good in the universe He probably regrets saying that Too late, we're keeping it Film spotting Wherever you get your podcasts Have a good show Griffin and David
[01:23:21] The clear thing is that You know, in this movie Tim Burton is relating to both versions of Edward Bloom Sure Because that's the kind of world He wants to create around him And Billy Crudup represents Everyone who hasn't gotten Tim Burton in his life That is fair
[01:23:37] And that's what we I think have I've never thought about it He's the audience star again That's what I'm saying Tim Burton with this movie Tim Burton hates the main character of this movie He does I'm saying it's the opposite of the Black Panther thing
[01:23:47] Where he hates the audience Let me give you some context I want to give you some further context Just about the movie Like, I feel like Sort of matters to the commercial discussion Of Tim Burton One is that Ben is also making the face
[01:24:02] Of someone who absolutely does not give a shit About Big Fish Ben does not like this movie He does not give a shit He doesn't want to give a shit Just zoning out Zoning out to a degree Where he was watching a different movie
[01:24:12] His head rather than just think about Big Fish Assassin's Creed was playing Oh yeah Ben has seen the Michael Fassbender Assassin's Creed movie ten times Definitely I'm sorry to interrupt But I had to call it So you were saying definitely One thing, as you said Is that
[01:24:27] Nicholson was initially going to play this Dad role Right They reworked the script to give it more Dad Because the script Finney is actually not in like a ton of the movie No, they also at For a period of time Thought it was going to be Nicholson
[01:24:41] With CGI de-aging and make up playing both Which is fucking insane Which would have been a no I would have Would pay a hundred dollars to that Remember what Jack Nicholson looks like At this time And imagine them trying to be like
[01:24:51] You're going to eat a lot of CGI I'm a college student Let's bring them back to a Pre-Chinatown age I'm the star quarterback Of my football team in high school Something's got to give Erra Jack Nicholson Right, right He's So eventually And Nicholson obviously is a frequent
[01:25:11] You know, knows Burton well But for whatever For whatever reason that just I don't know, that falls apart And they get to Finney and Right, you know And after that John August resets and he goes I'm not going to do the script They threw out the new script
[01:25:25] Let's go back to the original script That blew everyone away Let's throw out this revamped thing Really? Here's the other thing As you say Burton was like the script Planet of the apes had been this big Miss Agass that he was kind of not into
[01:25:37] Famously when asked if he wanted To make another one He said I'd rather jump out a window Right And the sense is that's the first movie That he feels like He lost control of Sure So he says I want to make a smaller movie
[01:25:48] The budget of Big Fish is 70 million dollars What? This was an expensive move hugely expensive I mean, you got me We built sets You have to make a giant Appear 15 feet tall For extended periods of time You've got Spectre I assume that's an entirely constructed
[01:26:02] There's so many locations There's only time periods They've got like that big house That gets, you know, they push There's a lot of stuff Did they make it back? No That's shocking to me They might have made it back Worldwide I know it did really well on 100 video
[01:26:17] Whatever I mean, no, it's, you know, whatever Fuck But like this is the Burton problem Where everyone's like Well his smaller movies don't do as well So then he feels compelled to make the bigger stuff No, he can't make small movies When he's making a small movie
[01:26:31] Big guys is a small move Yeah, big guys was fairly cheap Plus like $9 million, $10 million You would have to work hard To make big guys expensive Like it's mostly spent in a room Mostly spent in a room If you let him But um, like, you know
[01:26:45] This is your smaller movie? This It made $66 million in America To me watching this movie That's what I would expect this movie to make You don't watch this movie and think Like wow, America really whiffed on that Well, but here's the thing This wasn't a sensation
[01:27:02] I think their big swing is What if Tim Burton can make his forest gump Exactly, I was just gonna say That was the no-cum Let's not forget we're only a few years out from forest gump It's impossible to replicate And insane that it was such a big move
[01:27:13] Agreed, but like Oh, I mean, I'm sure you guys have talked about it Endlessly I mean, it comes up in weird ways But as recently as like If I was case of Benjamin Button Is clear like can we do forest gump again Sure
[01:27:25] Ben Stiller in interviews was like Walter Middy is me trying to do forest gump Stop trying guys Anomalous success I haven't rewatched forest gump Since almost as it came out Have you guys watched it? That thing is a fucking slog in my opinion My sister is 21
[01:27:38] She watched it for the first time a year ago And she went, what the fuck is that? Well, first you have to just sit them down And be like, let me tell you about Baby Boo It has to be the first conversation Where it's like you don't understand
[01:27:50] They were all 30 years old They were passing us the My generation the torch in a weird way Exactly, they were like 30 to 50 years old They'd all watch the fucking moon landings And lived through Vietnam Like you don't understand This movie was hitting me like Yeah, exactly
[01:28:03] Yeah, their lives were like Their lives were like a weirdly negative Base level with moments of cultural victories Yes, right And like forest gump is just like What if a guy lived in every memory That you have of your child essentially You know and walked through it
[01:28:18] And then he has a kid And the kid's Haley Dolos It's this weird epic that is So long so expansive So expensive and so oddly pitched In terms of tone I mean it's being there You know, it is just being there In my opinion But it's being there
[01:28:34] Done with like the self importance Of like Lawrence of Arabia That's the thing So I think they were like But then also it's like kind of goofy And like about a guy who's special Like you're like what? Like if they released this movie now
[01:28:48] Tom Hanks would go to jail He would be convicted and sent to jail It would be regarded as the most tasteless choice Exactly Right, the hippie gets AIDS Like everything about that movie now He's just like Bubba Gump, you think that would fly in 2019
[01:29:02] You think that's gonna fly? When fly would try though The restaurants are still around though right? They are He's gonna father-close that one in huh? Well because people are like I like shrimp Like I like to eat shrimp I know beef with it
[01:29:16] As long as I don't have to be Supposed to a lot of Bubba Gump I went there and on the menu It actually says Their catchphrase actually don't think too hard about it Anyway But you're right Big fish is being pitched Don't think too hard about it
[01:29:29] In the forest gump zone Of like can we make a sort of family friendly But more adult Yes Sort of epic about Father Father in America Not in the same sort of like touchstone way No Do you know like the book that Forest Gump is based on
[01:29:44] Has a plot line where he like goes to the moon Yeah And there's a sequel where he opens a company There's a sequel called Gump Incorporated where he like opens a factory And it's about like capitalism Right But the book is a little more venomous I think
[01:29:58] That's the thing The book is like I think close up Like for tomb Everyone America Like you know It's kind of like fucking America I think the book is like Fifth rate Vonnegut And then they took it and made it into like A real
[01:30:11] Like a box of chocolate Sort of like Sack and family Sure is And everyone loved it I wanna see this eight times It was like the third highest grade In the world It was like the third highest grossing movie in history At history
[01:30:24] Like an out grossed star wars at the time I remember my parents came home And my parents are not very sentimental Or emotional people And they sat me down and said We just saw a movie and you have to go see it This is important Immediately
[01:30:39] Tom Hanks had won Best actor the year before And they were like Well it put us between a rock and a hard place We cannot not give him the Oscar for Forest Gump Once again he would go to jail In 2019 And be like What are you doing?
[01:30:52] Is he like Like if he came on set and did that Like someone would call HR Yeah Like Tom Hanks is like Talking in this goofy voice And I'm very uncomfortable Right Do you think Getting strangers trough Do you think That at the funeral
[01:31:06] At the end of Big Fish That Billy could have Approached a certain character And was like Hey uh I think I've heard about you Are you uh Mr. Sagi Baki And then Sagi Baki was like Yeah I shot your dad Does he like Catch the bullet
[01:31:28] The bullet does not mention it Clips him Clips him Clips him Very low caliber gun Sure I mean it was Inside the belly The big belly of a little person And you just got to deliver the silver You're not trying to kill your friend
[01:31:41] You're trying to get that silver in there Yeah It's basically like a High grade hypodermic needle Right So inject some silver But can we talk about Specter? Yeah let's talk about Specter Yes I want to hear Because you seem like Well it's alright so After his childhood
[01:31:53] A very strange combination Of frustrated You know the witch is sort of The first big story But the second big story Miley Cyrus Her first screen appearance Is the little girl Who goes to the witch's house With them Yeah she's credited as With by her birth name
[01:32:05] Which is Destiny Cyrus Right is that true That is Miley Cyrus Totally true Edward down Is Miley Cyrus Yeah Wild Completely wild It also I just want to say The witch sequence has one Of my favorite jokes in the movie If you can call it that
[01:32:19] Which is when all the boys Start cursing to show That they're cool And the one kid goes Screw Yeah Yeah A very young man moment Yes Screw Screw But then And the second story Is the giant And him sort of coaxing The giant to like Be cool
[01:32:37] Be cool and have an adventure With them right Like walk down the road With them right Right a man Born with medical conditions That cause him to have The angles of a timber And drop Right Really a really striking person To look at
[01:32:50] Who died not long after this movie Yeah McGorrie McGorrie McGorrie Right Well I realized I looked him up Upon my rewatch He's tiny He was a Howard Stern whack packer Oh really Yeah He was in the whack pack He's also in the House of 1000 corpses
[01:33:06] He's seven feet tall Yeah he's a huge man Yeah Seven six Seven six He had the longest toe That was his Guinness record Longest Which imagine that Imagine being I don't know How long was that toe Let's find out Longest toe Guinness world record Here we go
[01:33:21] You've tried to talk about Spectre at least 11 times And not the James Bond movie Let's see 12 5 inches long 5 inches long 5 inch toe That's a big toe That's a big toe That's a big toe That's a big toe I mean I'm surprised it hasn't been
[01:33:37] Beep but it's a big toe Yeah He's still on there This is today's Guinness Anyway They hit that fork in the road They hit the fork in the road Where it's like take the easy path Or the scary path
[01:33:47] And I know of one guy who went this way And he's never been seen again Right Which is the poet The poet And Edward's like well I feel like I should take the more dramatic path Right I mean like is that his whole reason Right
[01:34:01] And he goes into the sound He's a man who believes that He's destined to live a great life Right and he knows when he's gonna die So he's not afraid of death He's not afraid of death This isn't how I go And so he wanders in
[01:34:10] And what does he find This weird spooky town That's kind of like off the map Barefoot town Barefoot Your shoes get thrown on a wire A little Hamlet It's got fairy lights It kind of looks like an Sort of Instagrammable wedding spot You know what I mean
[01:34:23] Like now It would have a hashtag Now it would have a hash Yeah Now you get like mason jar Lemonade And stuff there Right But it's like this Presided over by Loudon Rainright the third Of course Of course Obviously Who's sort of like the mayor Yeah Is he
[01:34:42] Missy Pyle Who's sort of a Becoming a Burton regular now Right and the second she appears in this movie You're like God he must have been so happy When he found her Yeah when he found out that she existed Right like this is like a Catherine O'Hara level
[01:34:53] Like you belong in a timber 100% I love Missy Pyle I did too And you gotta What are the rules You can't leave You have bare feet Yeah There's nothing to do Most people wear white But that's not 100% They wear in the water Sweet
[01:35:09] The people wear a lot of white clothes They got a lot of white skin I'm noticing here Oh wait The whole town gathers And there's all white people What's going on You seem to lose your abilities at poetry Once you're done Yeah sure Implication There's nothing to do
[01:35:25] It's like total stasis Spectre is really great You're right Which is really What were you gonna say I was gonna say I wonder if that applies to all skills Or just that Character's poetry It seems to be a low ambition town I mean people aren't really working
[01:35:37] You get it It's sort of like a parody of a small town Yeah But it is also a parody of like a segregated town Sure And the movie just kind of glances against that And doesn't know what to Doesn't want to deal with that Doesn't deal with that
[01:35:51] Yeah And instead it just sort of becomes this parable of like You know Paradise is what you make of it You know what I mean Like it's like This place is ostensibly paradise But you McGregor, Ed's not ready for it I don't want to settle
[01:36:06] And when he gets back to it It's too late Like he lost his chance at a pair Right You know like paradise is more than a place You're gonna You have to be ready for it Yeah Okay But it's also like this weird white people Down in Alabama
[01:36:20] But then also What's going on Sure But then also I mean the Hanna-Bombe Carter scene Is like no it was just like a town It was like a small town Of course that That wasn't very sustainable And to him it just seemed idyllic Exactly Yeah
[01:36:32] There's an interesting thing about this movie That I wonder if you two think about Based on where you grew up Which is I think so much of this movie Is also about Choosing Choosing to be worldly When you're from a small place Right And what that means Sure
[01:36:49] And how attainable that really is Which is tough because Dave and I Both spent our entire lives in New York City We never lived anywhere else Yeah So Whereas I'm from Northern New Jersey A place that a lot of people Look down on and make fun of Sure
[01:36:59] Not in the same ways But I feel like you think about The deep south and people Have some cast dispersions For sure And when you're from a place like that Making the decision to leave But also still have pride Of course When you live in a small world
[01:37:14] Maybe you can construct A bigger world for yourself In Legend And that's okay There was a lot of stuff like that That I found really fascinating And kind of beautiful And I wonder about your thoughts on it Yeah Well see I didn't have the small town thing
[01:37:31] But I definitely like From a very young age I was obsessed with this notion of Like I want to live a quote unquote Great life In the sense of like The breath of the life And like the experiences I accumulate And going to different places
[01:37:45] And putting myself in different environments I mean it's a lot of stuff that you talk about Where you know Your sort of self mythologizing Of you putting yourself in all these Crazy situations There's value in that You get the stories out of them
[01:37:55] But I also think there's the thing Of just like I want to push myself into environments I should not organically Be finding myself in Right In the sense of like The jobs that aren't innately The job I should be doing You know
[01:38:08] Like that sort of sense of Edward Bloom Is this guy who's just like I need to live as much life As I possibly can The greatness is in the sort of like But he did it The variety of And this is where I agree with Crudup
[01:38:20] Whereas Crudup is like Wait a second You've lived an ordinary life You went to college You met my mom Then you were traveling salesman And you made money But you weren't around And that's it And you bought a house Like what's so fucking great about that
[01:38:32] You know what I mean Like And I'm not saying I fully agree with Crudup But I get that Crudup is sort of like I've grown up And I've realized my dad Was just a guy who like Had an ordinary-ish life But also to that guy It's like
[01:38:45] Even if half the stuff is bullshit There are some interesting experiences there Absolutely If your dad told you Like did I tell you I worked at a circus for six months You'd be like Whoa, you worked at a circus For six months You served in the war
[01:38:56] You were traveling salesman You met these people Well that's also why As you bring it up And as we talk it out The one moment with Crudup Outside of the ending with the dad The one moment where I start to really sympathize with him
[01:39:08] Is the scene with Helen Abonnam Carter When he goes He's having an affair Right, that's the explanation He's looking for for his father It's one of the only ones Where he's not just sticking The unspoken thing that he finally speaks And maybe that
[01:39:21] Maybe the movie would have been well served For something like that To come out a little earlier Versus just him going I don't like you with all your But you understand his resentment At that moment You understand it really For the first And I would say only time
[01:39:32] The depths of it Way more than your dad just Crushed a wedding speech You're being an asshole Who doesn't want that He's so upset about that And he's like I really hate that You show-boated at the wedding Yeah, and which is also I get it
[01:39:46] You're making it about you But they didn't That wasn't nailed that hard But that idea of him Going my dad might have actually been It's not just that My dad's an exaggerator It's that he might Have been a real shitty dude We kind of feel like
[01:39:59] Here's the thing about this In the first ten minutes A scene where Billy Crudup says I just always assumed That my father must be covering For something like that He says it to his wife And here's- that's my fix for this movie Or right, it's like
[01:40:10] You need to build that in sooner Because when he says it It's kind of a powerful moment When he says it to Helena Barrett And then when she responds And is like Oh, we're jumping right into it Right, but then You already know
[01:40:20] Like now this movie's been going on too long And we're too in on Finney For that to be the twist Because that's the problem Is that Burton loves the Finney character He loves the life of this guy's living He doesn't want it to be questioned
[01:40:30] Whereas the story Helena Bonham Carter tells Is basically a story of like No, we didn't have an affair But we did have this relationship That kind of like just sort of- Was intimate, emotionally intimate Right, like that was in the air
[01:40:42] And eventually we didn't really act on it And that was that But it was a moment A weird moment in your dad's life Where he was maybe pondering Like oh should I- Spectre, should I You know like And the movie kinda
[01:40:56] But like if you had built that in a little more I feel like it'd be even more powerful When he- You know when they almost kiss And he says no Sure And instead it's more just a fairy tale Where he's like no, you know
[01:41:06] Jessica Lang's the only lady for me And you're like alright Right, yeah, Jessica Lang The definition of doing a lot with a little Doing a lot with a little And again as an Oscar watcher Everyone was like Lang's getting a nomination Look at her, she's luminous
[01:41:17] And instead like she is great in the movie Just as you say Right Anytime she's in it but she's barely I do have to ask And I feel like this is something We'll cover at some point Did it get any nominations? One, best score Best score, that's it
[01:41:28] That's it And people thought like Even when this movie came out And it didn't- Okay so it's not gonna be the Runaway sensation People were like But probably like Finney And like some design element Design and effects That almost feels like an aggressively Anti Tim Burton
[01:41:43] It felt kinda backhanded And it's weird also that this is The first and only Danny Elfman Tim Burton's score to get nominated Right Like he had done so many iconic scores With Tim Burton And then this movie where people thought it would be
[01:41:56] An across the board Oscar player They're like Did it win for score? No It lost So three that's the little Well you know what we'll get to it Finney really should have won for this though This year And also because it's like
[01:42:08] This was the last big bite at the apple he had Finney never won an Oscar is a shame He also never went to the Oscars And thought they were stupid Sure So props to him for that That's pretty rad I had forgotten he won the SAG
[01:42:19] For Aaron Brockovich But did he not show up when he won? He was not at the Oscars He's not at the Oscars The SAG he won though Oh I don't know I was trying to find a place to see The SAGs were barely a thing back then
[01:42:28] It was literally like a 6 year old ceremony I think it was the first one No no no it's 95 is the first Don't don't don't Don't fuck with an Oscar watch You can talk Burton I can talk awards Stone Cold Sims Born on those Oscar boards Entering this studio
[01:42:41] Is a real exercise I fully cannot believe you ever Dane to do it You're a busy man with things to do It's like I feel like I can just Barely keep up Oh sure And then there's moments where Where you're like oh I'm left at the roadside
[01:42:57] Well some people will I said this on the podcast But some people will say Like I'd listen to your podcast But it's you're like speaking A far and like Like if I turn it on I just don't know what you're talking about I mean this is why
[01:43:07] Not to get too insider-y The episode JD Amato is one of the only other people I know who can keep up With conversations this Insincere He's up he's lapping us off You know like yeah He's on another plane That's when his track training comes He starts sprinting
[01:43:22] But I just want to say The movie was ignored by the Oscars But like the Golden Globes Nominated for Best Picture And for Finney The BAFTA's nominated for Best Picture For Finney Like all the other sort of Pre-curses were like It seemed like right
[01:43:37] Yeah and I think it might have been One of those things where the Oscars Don't like Burton They don't They never have And also because the movie Kind of flopped after all the hype Maybe it was that sort of like That thing's a stinker
[01:43:47] Gordon has two Oscar nominations And they're both for animated films And they're for animated films That people don't like Which was more like Frank and Weenie and Corpse Bride Come on yeah Where it's sort of like They have an animated feature category They have to fill out five
[01:43:59] But not even for design And effect stuff for as early as stuff I mean a couple Batman won a production design Oscar Two of his films have one costume Yeah Right Anything for Scissorhand No Scissorhands No Beetlejuice No What right Sleepy Hollowins production design Allison Wonderland weirdly wins
[01:44:18] Is his most winning film Winning costumes and art direction That sounds right Yeah Which is a garish movie You guys don't You know this on the top here We're disgusting people So Throw us in jail My girlfriend signed you to Spectre Send you to Spectre
[01:44:36] My girlfriend grew up watching Red Dwarf I don't know if either of you Ever watched Red Dwarf I grew up in England Okay I fucking grew up in England Of course I watched Red Dwarf That thing was fucking incredible Right Red Dwarf rules
[01:44:51] Red Dwarf is like a silly sitcom Sent on a spaceship Very very like cult popular Have you ever heard of him? It's like a working class Sanitation guy in a British spaceship Who as punishment They put him in cryosleep And he wakes up three million years later
[01:45:03] And humanity is dead Okay And now he's stuck on a spaceship With a hologram and a computer And a cat person A cat person Do they watch movies And make fun of them No it's not mystery science It sounds very similar Pre-mistry science theater
[01:45:15] Like early tip of the 80s And it was one of those things that like Just one of those British sitcoms That they would do like Four episodes every couple years You know Red Dwarf would come back And you know Cool thing about the big gout
[01:45:25] Is the deal in Britain Where they're like Yeah we got them back together But also like the show weirdly has You know has like a lot of plot And like by the end is quite convoluted Like But they've done like ten seasons Over like thirty five years
[01:45:37] How come you're allowed to do that In Britain where it's like Hey I know we haven't made anything In eleven years for this one series But let's do it Easter special Holiday special Let's do it Easter special For this thing that we've seen in eleven years
[01:45:47] I believe still the most watched television program In British history is the only fools and horses Like a random Christmas special For only fools and horses Which is like a like Venerable sitcom about two guys Who are like alright You know like drive a van
[01:46:02] And do odd jobs It's like their Sanford and Son It's Sanford and Son I mean Sanford and Son is based on Stepdown Son which is a British sitcom Oh right Yes British sitcoms man They're the best This was the point I was going to make about Reddorf Okay
[01:46:17] My girlfriend grew up watching Reddorf And she was like look I don't know if you've ever watched this I really found memories of it I've been curious to rewatch it And see if it holds up And she's like do you want to watch this with me
[01:46:25] And I'm sitting there watching it And she kept on feeling like Am I putting this on you Or are you not really into it Sure are you into this or are you not really into it And I was like No I'm like really into it Creighton Creighton rules
[01:46:35] Well Creighton doesn't come until season That's true He's only in episode one of season two And then season three comes around Creighton's fucking great though Creighton rules I agree Creighton slaps We're watching the show And she doesn't believe I'm into it
[01:46:45] And then I start correcting her on facts And she's like What do you mean you're correcting me on facts You've only watched eight episodes of this show Sure And I grew up watching it And I was like When I get into something Right you're all in
[01:46:58] I can't have measure Like you showed me two episodes And then I spent four hours on the Wikipedia page And then reading the links connected to the Wikipedia She must have felt good that you liked it She did it was a nice moment
[01:47:09] Yeah that's like your version of a compliment But she did say she was like I'm so into the lore that now I know more than you Right but she was like You really do go hard on shit Right And she
[01:47:18] I'm sure there was a part of her that was like Oh cool you've taken this from me You're mansplaining a show I watched with my father Is that your only I introduced you to a thing that you're now Looking at me Was at my left I'm positive
[01:47:32] I was trying to like Casually be like Actually Creighton doesn't come until season three Does she like other British sitcoms? She's more sci-fi person Okay She's a big fan of Blackadder Well Blackadder fucking rules I don't know That's the top of the mountain
[01:47:47] Blackadder is the top of the mountain You must have heard of it though Like Rowan Atkinson And it's like there's only four seasons Each one is better than the last Each season was 25 years after the previous one Yeah and each season is set in a different period
[01:47:59] Of British history with different characters Played by the same actors But the same dynamics He's like a type that keeps recurring in history Right It's like there's another blackout Right The modern day police force Sometimes that type is like Well that's the thing blue line
[01:48:16] Can I tell you a Rowan Atkinson tangent Please I once In 2012 I sort of notoriously lost my mind Fell off the wagon This was the Bonnaroo episode? No this was the Adderall stretch Okay Are you making the show at this point? Yes
[01:48:33] There's a stretch of Gethrich on public access In 2012 where if you Summer of 2012 you can watch me losing weight Week by week You can watch me losing weight Is that sort of fairly early in the run Which random were we on? We're probably wrapping up on Andrew Okay
[01:48:49] And the Melissa Thank you so much Thank you so much But I had a friend of mine At the end of that summer Who's a filmmaker You guys probably Do you know Antonio Campos? He's a good friend of mine And Simon Killer was out Doing the festival circuit
[01:49:05] And it was at a festival in Rio de Janeiro And he pulled me aside and was like Dude I think you're Kind of going off the deep end I'm going out of town Why don't you just come to Brazil with me And he wasn't like
[01:49:17] It's not like Rio is a place to lay low He was just kind of Right I don't think of that as like A chill place But he was just kind of like You and I will do some soul searching Talking And if you want to party
[01:49:27] We can party And if you want to just like Chill out and get back To be in yourself But New York is not good This is one of those stretches Where we all have Where New York is not good for you
[01:49:35] You just need to go off the grid For a little New York has to be a pressure cooker Better was It's a social thing as much as The city thing Yeah I had I was dealing with a bad breakup I was dealing with a bunch of bad decisions
[01:49:44] All this stuff Dealing with a rough random Very controversial random Rough random Had to really help that kid He's such a nice guy He's a nice boy Audience is what he is My own brother called in And like shit on a kid Who's 20 years younger than I
[01:50:00] He's like in college My brother's like Get this fucking pretend she's down I'm like Greg you're pushing 40 He's a boy Get him on my fucking screen So I go to Brazil And I mean it's an epic, epic journey We have a male ballet dancer
[01:50:15] Hand me a giant bag of cocaine In front of my friend's mother Secretly I have to decide if I'm going to do Cocaine for the first time It's crazy We're partying in favelas It's like it's wild It's like wild You robbed a bank
[01:50:30] With a big safe that you strapped To the back of a car Me and a guy named Rocket Took down a guy named Lil' G Like it was nuts It was really nuts We watched that last night by the way One of the best movies to come out
[01:50:42] Anyway, so we're Antonio has some family down there And we go His mom was in town Because she was a producer On another film in the festival With this family Up at this mountain top tree It's crazy It's so beautiful And he has this distant cousin
[01:50:58] Who's like the most beautiful woman I've ever seen And Antonio's mom decides she's going to be Like human tinder And just hook me up with her own relative Like she's trying to pimp out her relative She starts like really talking me up
[01:51:10] And she starts telling everyone we meet That I am regarded in America As the next Woody Allen That I'm as big as Woody Allen She keeps telling everybody This guy's a comedian He's as big as Woody Allen He's not on an international level But in America Right
[01:51:26] Which is not true It's undeniable She's claiming that In America Undeniable Not that I have a Woody Allen vibe Not that that could be a thing That in America Right You are unimaginable Yes Any Hall era Woody Allen level of fame Not true
[01:51:42] And this beautiful cousin of my friend Is sitting there Not speaking I assume she only speaks Portuguese I later find out this is because She was pretending to only speak Portuguese So as to not have to speak to me Cool She knows about Woody Allen At one point
[01:51:58] Yes She knew it before the rest of us At one point When Antonio's mom tells this cousin This guy is actually a comedian in America Her face lights up She turns to me And in perfect American accent English She goes, oh my god I love comedy so much
[01:52:12] Sure Have you ever met Mr. Bean? And I said no And she was like I love Mr. Bean Mr. Bean is my favorite comedian ever And she went on a very long rant About her love of Mr. Bean Sure And it did develop into a flirtatious thing
[01:52:29] Between the two of us Nothing ever happened And we became Facebook friends But Mr. Bean is the glue holding together Mr. Bean became this weird glue But I've never seen someone love Mr. Bean So much Is Mr. Bean that worldwide beloved? Yeah, it's insane
[01:52:48] I think it's one of those things where like In America We've always rolled our eyes at him Yeah, it's a little like Because they did like the much later Mr. Bean's holiday sequel And people were like Why are they making this? And they made like $2 in America
[01:53:00] And $3 trillion worldwide But like Mr. Bean so much to the point Where it almost got me a hookup Did she want to talk about Blackadder Was it just Mr. Bean? She's not a Rowan Atkinson man I do not think she knew the name Rowan Atkinson
[01:53:16] She thought his name was like Fred Bean or something She thought that was a real documentary Right Yeah, she thought that was Harvey Bean I think But I mean she was all of a sudden Very very open to hanging out with me Wow Because you knew from Bean
[01:53:32] And she was an artist And I went to her art exhibit in Brazil And it was her It was all oil paintings of Mr. Bean You can't even imagine Really? It was her doing videos of herself Standing in abandoned desolate places With a somber look on her face
[01:53:45] And having the video glitch In a loop over and over again Which me in 2012 My dream like You're like we're cooking like gas A beautiful mysterious Brazilian video artist Who explores abandoned places And doesn't want to speak to me That's my dream woman in 2012 Oh she's a Beanaholic?
[01:54:02] Yeah and she loves Mr. Bean She's getting high on that scene You have described my 2012 fantasy human But wait But in the end of the day You just left Rio I did I left Rio That was your specter But then I came back to America
[01:54:17] And immediately got together with my wife Sure And everything sort of leveled out I mean this is your big fish This is your side story Your Jenny Yeah Get that Look at that Look at that David That's a good story Sorry about that Real tangent
[01:54:34] I didn't think it paid off That was a fantastic tangent Are you crazy? Pay off is quite bad That was good That was a good path I mean if it had just ended with like And then it turned out she was a werewolf
[01:54:44] And the sad clown had to shoot her Like you know Side bottom Side bottom So funny Mr. Sagi Bottom He's only got the one line Right where he says like This is my associate Mr. Sagi Bottom And he goes I don't know Yeah
[01:54:59] He doesn't say anything else during the negotiation Like maybe not Honest to God though If that's not Danny DeVito do you think this If it's not Danny DeVito do you think The studio cuts that whole storyline Or certainly is an expensive storyline You know what I'm saying
[01:55:12] Like I need three elephants Right Like you know all this shit Popcorn needs to freeze in the air He needs to be able to push it though That's a good visual I like that I remember seeing the movie with my
[01:55:23] I wish Allison Lohman had a little more to do Agreed Wait who's Allison Lohman She's the young wife You know And she mostly just stands there looking pretty Right And you're kind of like They really nailed Jessica Lang's hair On her Like they really like matched that well
[01:55:38] I remember one of my like Eight times seeing this movie Watching it with my father And when it was that montage Of him trying to get the one piece Of info a month out of DeVito Every time they would cut to a different
[01:55:50] Attraction or a different gigantic animal Or a different giant set My dad just went Jesus Christ how much did they spend on this This is kind of the plot Like this is a montage In every establishing shot in the Montage is like
[01:56:03] So they had to rent a total world Sure Yeah we get it it's a circus Yeah cause he's in the Motorcycles driving around him In the cage Which also I have to say My wife Is a performer Sure Who has done a lot of aerial stuff
[01:56:17] And there's a lot of crossover With the circus community That is an extraordinarily dangerous thing Right Yeah And to stand your leading actor In the middle of it Crazy Did that real do you think that was A real practical thing or was that It looks like it
[01:56:30] It looks like it It certainly doesn't look like Fake at all Like I've always That's one of those things Where I'm like Shitting my pants right Everyone on set was just like Yeah Let's get this shot okay Mm-hmm Uh Bikes go Like you know Yeah
[01:56:45] Um anytime we're just like No we need another take You couldn't see Helena's reflection In the background Because there's also the thing When he's like Got his head in the lion's mouth It's clearly like an animatronic lion That's a fake lion
[01:56:59] They spent a lot of money on an animatronic lion They were like You and can stay in the middle Of a motorcycle cage right The only place behind the pines Has the motorcycle cage too And that's just the thing Where I'm like That's not real Simpsons happen
[01:57:12] It stresses me out That's fucking insane Watching stuff like that stresses me out Like it's hard to drive a car Now I'm good at Like I'm fine at it So hard that I will never do it Right but like driving a car Requires your attention
[01:57:23] And you are level and going forward Like imagine just the Looking through the eyes of the guy On the motorcycle Right It was just like Yeah I'm just not gonna see Anything except like cage Yeah And as they pass each other There were two in there
[01:57:39] Yeah there's two in there One is bad enough Yeah it's bad Wasn't even that big of A global thing It basically is like It can hold you and McGregor Yeah And then two motorcycles And that's it Speaking of Would this role be as big If it wasn't DeVito
[01:57:55] If you didn't have a name actor Who gets you know And Danny DeVito billing I saw the Big Fish musical They did about ten years after this Where John August He wrote that too Re-adapted Because this is well suited To a musical because it's Vignetti
[01:58:08] Any movie that's Vignetti People are like Broadway musical Like this is basically Just a bunch of songs Like you know I think the musical made One fatal flaw Which I will say in one second But the DeVito character Was weirdly big in the musical And it stood out
[01:58:22] When it wasn't played by DeVito Was he kind of the emcee Of the musical or something Like would he sort of like No it was just the same thing Where that section Went on weirdly long Did they have a sake bottom? No Great question
[01:58:35] No I don't think they did I'm not seeing a sake bottom In the credits here Was it on Broadway? It was You saw it on Broadway I saw it on Broadway I saw it on Broadway One time One time is enough Here was the thing
[01:58:48] I think the musical could have done The mounting self-consciousness You feel about how many times You saw it in the theater A gentleman's ape Same theater every time Or you move around Give me another hint of that I want to keep crying
[01:59:01] Did you test it with different sounds It's the same Of course I did Trying to think where Some of the places I saw it I think I definitely saw Kips Bay at some point Kips Bay has a Star Wars VR machine They have a whole VR thing
[01:59:15] Oh they had it They used to have the whole IMAX basements They don't have the VR I forgot the big fish musical was a flop I forgot Wow it played 98 performances That's a disaster Did he win Best Actor? No Who was Norman Leo Butts Who's won like 17 Tony's
[01:59:30] It got zero Tony nomination He didn't get nominated? Blank Because he's Bloodline That was the big thing He plays What's the name of Mendelssohn's character in Bloodline? Fuck I never watched Bloodline Cause that's I mean we all know Director Orson Krennick
[01:59:48] They're good people but they did a bad thing We all know that about Bloodline Danny Like to me Bloodline Every time I watch it It's just everyone's been like Danny Danny's a problem Like the whole movie The whole show Those families Danny
[02:00:02] It did make you feel like you grew up In that town with them And everybody knew from a young age Danny's no good Eric Alright sorry The thing I was going to say about the big fish musical You have one guy playing Edward Bloom at all ages Yeah
[02:00:15] I know Are you pointing at the runtime back? He's pointing at the runtime We're almost done It feels long to me and I've been in it Yeah We're done I have Nothing left to say about Big Fish We were going to play the box office game
[02:00:29] But what do you want to say about the musical? About the musical Norman Leo Butts plays Edward Bloom at all ages So there's kind of an impressive Norbert Leo Butts plays the character at all ages So there's a skill piece element of like
[02:00:44] You're watching a guy sweat and run and transform And go back from the bed and this and that There was a moment watching it where I went Oh fuck this is what they should have done The entire first act should have exclusively been
[02:00:57] Edward telling the stories to his kid in bed Which is kind of how they structure the first act Right because yeah the movie, yes that's fair And you don't see adult Will at all until act two That act one is just here is
[02:01:09] It's weird that the movie literally starts with old You know, crud up being like You're a fucking fraud and you The wedding speech was too long and you're like Build up to this I don't get why he's mad
[02:01:20] Because the act two played young Will was a lot less antagonistic In the Broadway musical but you go There's an opportunity here to just open with Act one is full on Broadway musical It's fantabulous stories Act two is when reality crashes
[02:01:32] But isn't the problem then that it's the princess bride It's just the princess bride which is iconic at that Kind of, it's like princess bride It's a little like into the woods where you have the second act Where like the fantasy falls away
[02:01:45] Because even as you just said him telling young Will I had a vision of him sick in bed Like it immediately brings it out I will say the musical is still mostly that It's just not exclusively that It's mostly the superstructure is
[02:01:58] Him telling the stories to Will as a bedtime story But then old Will interrupts And I was like save old Will for act two Like keep act one purely in fantasy land I think would have been cool
[02:02:11] And then act two comes up and it's a totally different time It's reckoning with Right Yeah, it's not a bad idea I thought, yeah If I were to revive The musical Yes, that's what I would do The ending of this thing
[02:02:24] I mean there are a couple things it gets at First of all, crud up gets out of the way And then it just delivers this thing clean I think he does a great job Right And from the moment it just starts tickling in
[02:02:33] Where you're just like they've set this up so perfectly The dominoes are perfectly in place He's kept on saying I know how I die Right Tell me the story And he doesn't know And you see him start to figure it out
[02:02:44] There's so many good Finney performance moments where like When he tells the story It adds in the detail about taking the other route Because church traffic Right And they cut to Albert Finney and he's like beaming Because he's like including a superfluous detail Completely unnecessary detail
[02:02:59] He's giving coloring to the story now And then just the fucking idea I don't know if it's because I'm like a megalomaniac or whatever But the idea of at the end of your life You see every person you've ever known
[02:03:10] Is like the most profound thing in the world And then once you turn into a fish Yeah, I mean that's the dream, right A big fish You see everyone you ever knew You get a lady in the water That was the implication though
[02:03:22] That what he saw in the eye Was him connecting with his son Right That's how I go Yeah I mean that's what always took it He gave it up to you to decide, right? Sure, of course It wasn't about the story
[02:03:32] It was about the stories that bring it together Just him saying exactly And then Albert Finney doing one of the best Death pieces of acting I've ever seen Where you literally just see the life leave his eyes Shock it They're just like we're in the hands of
[02:03:44] And they're just shocking the ability to just die Any time I see that in a movie And Albert Finney at this point in his life Is probably what do you think he is He's younger than I think he is He's like 67, 68 But still I would be like
[02:03:56] If I'm 67 I'm like I don't want to face this It was creepy man Yeah, he's really good at it His bed acting is really fucking good throughout the whole movie That scene where he makes the face When she's not looking at him and he's in pain
[02:04:09] And then he's like back to the... It's just like heartbreaking shit But then also when you have the moment Where Will starts telling the story And he goes okay so it's like this I wake up and suddenly everything's different And they cut to fantasy version of Finney
[02:04:20] In Will's story and suddenly it's like Albert Finney with full verb And he takes off the thing And goes like let's get out of here He's just like that's my fucking guy I love him, I love him in this movie I think it's a great performance
[02:04:34] Should have won the Oscar I'd be fine with that I think that's like a great best supporting actor Winner in a year that was a notably bad Best supporting actor field Billy Crot up should have won the Nobel Prize For lack of chemistry Oh
[02:04:51] And it plays out like a slot machine It still destroys me He loves to say pays out like a slot machine It's a thing I read someone say In reference to Shawshank Redemption I'm like God I gotta find an opportunity To say that
[02:05:03] Which is another movie like this Where you're like It sings long and then at the end You're like I guess it was kinda worth it You needed to spend that much time in jail Yeah Pays out like one could say it pays out
[02:05:14] Alright let's play the box office game Unless there's anything else you want to do You know what I'm saying This behind us man Guys it's 3.30 Alright Okay I gotta hear it at one Okay God Other stuff to do today Number one I'm officially getting anxious Cause I'm really
[02:05:35] There's a window though Look look there's a window There's a window There's a window There's a window Outdoors though It looks like somebody's cubicle And that guy's not working by the way What is he doing He's reading Gmail Who knows Researching Oh boy
[02:05:51] So this is the wide weekend This is the wide weekend We've done the initial weekend Cause that's something that I can So Sony goose up the numbers in the early estimates To be able to claim that they got number one And then when the estimates came
[02:06:02] When the actuals came This is January 9th, 2004 It lost to week four of Return of the King That's correct Right Return of the King was running the table I mean there's no shame in that And that's the year at the Oscars Return of the King wins everything
[02:06:15] Certainly every like design Visual effects Oscars of any movie 11 Oscars Doesn't lose a single thing it's nominated for Really? Yeah Return of the King just annihilates everything anyway Cause it was all the goodwill from the Celebration of Exactly So like you guys did it
[02:06:30] Has Lord of the Rings And I don't know because I was in college when they came out Has it held up as an institution Yes The way that Star Wars has Amongst young people It has to the extent that it had a prequel trilogy
[02:06:41] That people didn't even like as much And it still survived I liked those Hobbit movies Okay When we do Jackson we gotta have you back for One block bit Yes please On Desolation of Small I kind of have a saucebob for them too
[02:06:54] So I would like to tell them You're not into them I tapped out after one He didn't even see two of them He only saw the first one Which is probably the weakest for you Kids still get into Star Wars And they're always gonna get into Harry Potter
[02:07:05] Is Lord of the Rings The same thing culturally I think Lord of the Rings has always played a little bit older And I feel like you have a lot of people Who still every year Gotta watch the extended trilogy It's an annual tradition It's a Christmas tradition
[02:07:18] For multiple people that I know Like unconnected people I was almost fired from Weird New Jersey Because I went to Trilogy Tuesday Which was when Return of the King came out You go to the theater and watch all three My boss was like
[02:07:30] I cannot believe you did that I will fire you He was serious He's like I'll fire you Number three at the box Big fish is number two 13.8 million Yeah Number three is It's a comedy with one probably An actor we all revere It's one of his low points
[02:07:49] You know, family comedy But comedian and actor I feel like Okay, so 2003 family comedy It's not Super by the Dozen It is Super by the Dozen He doesn't have like four kids I'm glad I got that I'm glad I got that A wild runaway hit
[02:08:07] Usually this game people just sit and watch you play Yeah, no that was a good fall Super by the Dozen, huge hit 140 million bucks That's towards Does that mark the beginning or is it just in the early wave of I want to buy a new painting Steve Martin
[02:08:21] This is when he starts getting My house is getting a wing Fancy you're in his tip Right Because 2003 is cheaper by the Dozen and bringing down the house And they're both huge hits And they're both movies that you go He must have been holding his nose
[02:08:35] And just checking eBay There's some Picasso for sale that year He's selling Sotheby's in between takes Yeah Will you throw in a Basquiat? I love this painting Do you remember that thing a couple years ago? This was paid for eight banjo tours around the country Yeah
[02:08:52] Do you remember that thing a couple years ago Where like 90 Second Street Y was like A conversation with Steve Martin And then it was just banjo right? No, it was just paintings And people like walked out And he kept on being like, I'm sorry
[02:09:04] I just, this is what I want to talk about I remember that Like he was very apologetic And people were like tell jokes And then people were even like I'd settle for banjo You're verbally describing a visual medium We paid money
[02:09:19] And we traveled all the way up here It's so shockingly hard to get to What? It was the real 90 Second Street Y It was the real 90 Second Street Y Yeah Have you ever been in for Mount Kisco? Have you ever been in for Mount Kisco? No
[02:09:34] He is like of I feel like of my Big, like Mount Rushmore Idol is the only one I haven't I will say too For all the jokes we've made Plains, Trains and Automobiles is Probably, I think it's my Second favorite movie Outside of like the Star Wars stuff
[02:09:53] And you've said, I mean it features My favorite comedies are Gross Point Blank And Plains, Trains and Automobiles You have said before in this podcast Plains, Trains and Automobiles Is your wife's favorite actor of all time? That dog who got froze up She recently It's number one
[02:10:08] That dog who got froze up In the back of the pickup truck My wife respects no actor more than that dog When you think about it though That's a dog in the cold And he nailed the timing on that heart And he's up against Steve Martin
[02:10:18] And John Candy This is intimidating She recently declared her second favorite actor Should I ref... Please, big reveal This is Scoop Guy who plays Thurman Merman And Bad Santa Great kill I just saw that for the first time Oh, that's a real gethard movie That is...
[02:10:34] I mean, that's up there I immediately was like Oh, that's number three It's supposed to be a weird forgotten movie Because it was a hit at the time People liked it But it kind of just went away I couldn't believe it I always thought it was just elf
[02:10:44] Just like, I always thought of that And elf as like very similar No, it's like a very dark one Oh my god It makes me laugh It's from the director of Prum Dude, when And Ghost Rule When he hands him his report card
[02:10:56] And Billy Bob Thurman looks at him And he's like, Thurman Who the fuck is Thurman? Are you Thurman? And you realize He doesn't even ask this kid his name Until we're like a solid 75 minutes Into this movie That is such a funny joke, man He didn't even...
[02:11:10] You're like he's been living in this house For the bulk of this movie And they insinuate it's been for weeks maybe And he just now is like Wait, what's your name? He didn't even ask him his name Thurman, man So Halley Bullets He hurled like D'Niro Pacino
[02:11:24] Together for the first time Would be the dog and Thurman Merman Yeah, yeah, yeah If you could get a two-hander Who is that dog and Thurman Merman? Who is that dog? He's like James Dean here And did it very little He went away He left us wanting more
[02:11:38] Watch that scene now That's a great scene I know I can conjure the image of the dog Watch the timing, watch the comedic timing on that scene And some of it's the camera cut, sure But the dog carries his weight And you don't expect the dog to have
[02:11:51] His mouth all froze up like that And he keeps a straight face He deadpins it hard And he's not, doesn't look like he's just looking for the treat He looks like he's looking for the moment He was in it He was in the moment It's all froze up
[02:12:05] Speaking of froze Oh, number four Come on Come on, babe Chris Girlfriend's calling It's someone who assumes we wouldn't still be taping At this point She is sorely mistaking Number four is a cold movie Cold movie? It's got cold in the side of it Cold mountain? Cold mountain
[02:12:27] Cold mountain You seen Cold Mountain Civil War Didn't see it Homeric epic Another big like this is going to run the table at the Oscars And then it kind of kind of snubbed it Other than supporting it They did give Renée Zellweger her Oscar That's right
[02:12:41] Weird movie, I actually kind of like it It's got this great scene where you got those You know that Southern Revival sort of thing Where they sing these songs And they use their voices and instruments And it requires like many, many people to have any impact
[02:12:55] Where like they're all just sort of making like Percussive sounds with their mouth Fucking love that shit I made the argument on Twitter recently Like that's in Cold Mountain or that's the other movie There's like a big scene in Cold Mountain Where they're all singing like
[02:13:06] I was trying to guess That was his hint for number five Yeah, yeah Number five is something's got to get Is the movie that just Oh okay The Nancy Meyers classic Yeah With Jack Nicholson Yeah, so I have a big question I guess Sort of insubmission, everything we
[02:13:22] And this has been a wide ranging episode We've gone deep into a bunch of different little I think we did a great job Yeah, we've taken a couple stops at different towns At the side of the road, right? My question is As you said
[02:13:34] You will soon be a father For the first time Yes You're looking forward to sharing Star Wars with your son Yeah As you said Now do you feel like For you The original trilogy is the thing You want to introduce him to that
[02:13:51] Or do you want to lead For your son with Kit Fisto Because if you start at episode four You're depriving him of Fisto God damn You just called into question everything that I know about You thought this podcast was done We had nothing left to say
[02:14:09] And I asked you the existential question Of your life Look Do you want your son to meet Kit Fisto or Luke Skywalker first That is the question I guess I just fear that if I hold back Fisto For my son
[02:14:24] And then he comes to realize at some point That Fisto was there the whole time He's going to view me like Crudup viewed Albert Finney It all ties together That's what the Moise Pazzo But they're making the decisions as a father
[02:14:36] What kind of world you want to raise your son in You know, if he could be that way I mean till, you know He'll have some trouble But he'll come around He'll figure it out He'll realize what a great man you were
[02:14:45] Is he going to put his emphasis On some weird sellable stuff What if you get a kid And the kid talked like Billy Crudup I'd be like Fucked up in his kid How bad would you react If you had a son someday Griffin And he looked at you
[02:14:59] If you're eating dinner And he's just like Hey dad can you pass the salt Dad, stop that shit Stories that you're telling all the time Don't you feel like Because this was the period where he was The MasterCart priceless guy And that was so much of his job
[02:15:14] Was just like listing things With atypical rhythms That he just got so caught up in that game Because there's literally What can you say about a credit card Like, you know It's sort of like an e-beer advertisement Where it's like It's the same product as before
[02:15:28] So you remember what a credit card is It's that, that's what we got And he just had to keep doing those Spots over and over again Maybe that ruined Billy Crudup At this period of his career Now I've just rewatched Almost Famous and he's pretty good
[02:15:38] He's very good He's very good He's very good in that What else has he done What else am I not thinking of Left Mary Louise Parker Eight months pregnant That was a big career move for him That's true famously Yeah You know, he was in this movie
[02:15:50] Called Waking the Dead Which he's quite good in He was in this movie called Jesus' Son Which he was sort of like Seen as like an up and coming Marquis Idol Where it's like This guy's handsome He's a good actor He's got all the tools
[02:16:01] Like he's gonna be big Yeah, but then Almost Famous was like His first big studio Bideth the Apple And then this is kind of Like the next one And that's it Yeah But also people So truly despise him For the Mary Louise Parker thing
[02:16:13] That his name is Mud in Hollywood Right And he just becomes a character He left his long-time girlfriend Eight months pregnant Yeah For clarity Right Which was just seen as Like such a despicable move Even in Hollywood people were like Yeah You can't do that Yeah
[02:16:27] And so, you know Then by the time he's Emission Impossible 3 Which is only two years later Right Or three years later He's kind of the pill He's the pill And he's like a fucking character Actor And like Only a couple years after that He's Dr. Manhattan In Watchmen
[02:16:41] Right Where it's like I'll play the mocap thing Like I don't give a shit I don't even have my face Said it a thousand times I still think He would be my ideal Dr. Doom casting Really good Every thing you've said that A thousand times
[02:16:56] I said it a thousand times I'll say a thousand more Everything You've never said that to me I think I have definitely said that to you Really? In what world do you need to be You say that a thousand times Who's listening to you say that Unfortunately
[02:17:08] No one's listening But I'm saying Several people listen Why it just really could have Everything that's irritating about him In Big Fish Is what makes him a good Dr. Doom No way But he's a poisele Dr. Doom is a strong Yes Dr. Doom's a king Outside of Magneto
[02:17:24] Maybe the most justification For villainy in the Marvel Universe I think he can do that But the key to Dr. Doom Is that he's just driven by Petty Rage The fact that he thinks He should be like the leading man Right, but he needs charisma
[02:17:37] He needs to command a room He can do it That needs to be like That needs to be like Christoph Waltz Well that's a little too obvious Because of the accent Yeah, and it's just He's played like every fucking villain That exists at this point But sure
[02:17:50] I also think Victor von Doom Has to be a failed heart rob Who's angry that he's not Like a superhero You know I don't know about that He's an ice-cold sociopath From the day he enters college At kin to read Next to read Richard Because he's like assuming
[02:18:04] Like, well I'm the golden boy Right Ultimately though What's fueling Dr. Doom Yeah Is that his mom has been captured His mom's soul has been captured By Mephisto Right Have you ever read the Dr. Doom, Dr. Strange crossover? No It was notoriously hard to find
[02:18:19] When I was a kid They have it on Marvel Unlimited though It is awesome Really It's all about Dr. Doom's Dr. Doom also deals with Magic and the Mystic Arts Well because his mother was a gypsy Yeah Discrated by his father And he's kind of It's incredible
[02:18:37] Cheenfully pursuing that Well worth reading I want to read it I'm doing this thing where I read Marvel comics year by year Right now On the unlimited app Do you pick one series Or do you have a number of series That you're reading as if you're a kid
[02:18:50] Taking them all up to smart Take a guess This guy take a guess Which one he's doing Like I'm not going to read ever Like you'll learn Like I'm in the 70s now Where it's like some things Like okay I don't need to read this
[02:19:00] Like you know I don't need To read some failed You know But right now Through the entire 60s There's really only 12 Marvel titles So you're trying to live the experience Of being a Marvel fan That's exactly what I'm trying to do So you're reading like Journey into Mystery
[02:19:14] Oh yeah Oh yeah Tell us who's astonished Yeah Wow All that shit The 60s is great It's pretty unbeatable You know and you can see the one The heroes that are hitting better Right And you can see the ones that aren't And like their villains kind of
[02:19:27] Suck you know and like You can see you know in the early 60s where they're like Ant-Man is one of the core heroes Yeah And then slowly they're like Ant-Man is not that big a deal anymore And then Ant-Man is just gone You know he's in the Avengers
[02:19:38] But that's it And then they make him like An abusive like asshole Well that's I haven't gotten to that yet Right okay Namor they're like Namor is crucial And then they're like Oh fuck it no one likes Namor I guess Namor is gone
[02:19:49] And you see him get bumped from the front He's like he splits a title with someone else Then he gets bumped to the back And then he's gone Namor is so cool Namor is great I always like Namor Yeah I always like them
[02:20:00] But his solo titles are no fun It's boring No but he's great He's like he's a great Fantastic Four ensemble Him dropping into the Avengers or whatever Fantastic Four is great But him going down to Atlantis Like the other Namor characters Are they doing a Namor now?
[02:20:14] They talk about it Cause it seems like a no brainer With climate change, global warming Yeah well that's what Aquaman kind of was Yeah I didn't see it I wanted to see it But could not convince Halley on that Ben you want to give it a quick review
[02:20:26] Ben is vaping Fucking rules Ben is vaping Yeah I was vaping It's good Yeah I loved it It's awesome It's like such a fun movie You know where I'm gonna watch Aquaman On a plane? Of course As soon as I saw the trailer Again Halley Bullet
[02:20:43] We watched the trailer and Halley Bullet Just went don't even ask Don't even ask No This will wait your appetite Chris It's got a lot of sea crime I gotta go home guys That's it We're done New book, lose well We were talking comics all of a sudden
[02:21:02] Broke Harris What do you mean? I'm about to new book New book It's all okay Let's give it that BC bump I would love that We'll sell 30 more copies You got your podcast Yeah beautiful anonymous I got some moves on making coming up That I think you guys
[02:21:18] That either represent a severe career downfall Or are the coolest thing I could possibly be doing In 2019 I want to talk to you guys about off mic Okay turn this episode of the mics off Let's just say
[02:21:31] That I used to think I could make a better TV show Than some other people And now I think I could make a better TV network Than other people Thank you all for listening Please remember to rate, review, subscribe Thanks to Antriguedo for our social media
[02:21:43] Leigh Montgomery for our theme song Joe Bonapet rounds for our work Oh to Blankysoutread.com For some real nerdy shit Got a t-pull for some real nerdy shirts And as always Let's end episodes so we can hear this