Miami Vice - Pilot Episode

[00:00:01] Blank Check with Griffin and David, Blank Check with Griffin and David Don't know what to say or to express All you need to know is that the name of the show is Blank Check Hey! Great start! I couldn't find any quotes for this.

[00:00:27] I mean it's a quotey episode though right? I mean they do say a bunch of stuff. Yeah but what am I gonna scrub through the episode and transcribe something? That's more work than I've ever put into this. Now, now. Not this podcast.

[00:00:40] I put a lot of work in this podcast, but in terms of the opening, you can attest. You go to IMDb, you find a quote. Usually Ben says we're recording and I go wait, wait, wait, wait, I need to look up a quote.

[00:00:50] I do it at the last possible second. So I watch the episode. Can you feel it coming in the podcast tonight? I mean, right. I could do something like that or I was like is there a tagline for when the pilot premiered? But you know what?

[00:01:02] I just don't fucking feel like it. Here's the honest truth. We're gonna give you a good episode and this is a little bonus. We're giving you extra goods and in certain ways this is a mea culpa. Right. Because we gave you a little less episode last time. Sorry!

[00:01:15] Okay. All right here comes Ben. Here comes Ben here. I had to cut the last 30 minutes. There's nothing to be done. Equipment failure, these things happen. It's not gonna happen again though, right? It's not gonna happen again. That episode we just recorded that great episode.

[00:01:31] That's all safe in here. We saved that? Okay. David's tapping on the sound mixer. Well, you know, we've been at it for close to three hours. We've been at it. This is our second episode of the day. We just recorded a real good one, real hot one.

[00:01:43] But also audio boom just moved. Big move from the sixth floor to the 14th floor. Well, no, we don't need to... It's just these things happen. I think this is like, there's a lot of chaos. We've done hundreds of episodes together. But this game moved. We were rushing.

[00:01:57] Every once in a while you're gonna have... Think of episodes. Yeah, you're gonna have audio that's just gonna get corrupted. I think it's still a good episode. I'm sorry that things got cut off. The box office game got cut off. What else do you remember?

[00:02:07] There was some talk of Jesse James. There was some Jesse James talk and then I had a really funny joke where I talked about how Fran took me to the Philharmonic and I realized how they're basically just a cover band. Fuck, we lost that.

[00:02:20] That was a really good bit. I forgot about that bit. Yeah. Maybe we need to work harder. We gotta apologize for the audio. We've got to apologize for the audio right now. All right. Well, maybe I'll revisit some...

[00:02:28] It was also because I had to get it out because we had the deadline and I discovered it last minute. This is the other thing I want to be very clear about, okay? We got a whole ad sales thing in place now. We can't fuck with release dates.

[00:02:40] We can't put things out late. No. And we've been recording a lot. We have. We've had a bit of a flurry. We've had a bit of a thirt. A little flurry. We've had some vacations. Ben went somewhere, I went somewhere. You went somewhere.

[00:02:52] So we've had a little break and then we had a flurry. Right. So we were trying to record things before the vacation and then when we were all on vacation, I thought that maybe I was going to get a job.

[00:03:00] There was a brief panic over, oh my God, we have to bank a zillion things at once. I would be away for like over two months and then of course we were reminded that I am unhireable. My career was over.

[00:03:10] But there was a brief window where Hollywood was like... Do you know who beat you up? Yep. No, can I say what I know about why I didn't get the job? Okay. They wanted to save money by hiring someone local because this shoot would have filmed

[00:03:37] in a place and let me explain this to David. There was a country called England. That's true. It's part of the United Kingdom? Yeah. Why are you saying yeah? Oh, I know the general details. You've heard of it. I've heard of it. I live there.

[00:03:51] I feel like he's... It's come up. Wait, I'm sorry. It's come up. I'm sorry. Rewind the tape for a second. Yeah. You said you've heard of it and then what was the thing you said after that? What? 13 years. 13 years, fellas! I feel like this is... I don't know.

[00:04:05] I feel like it's come up. I'm going to say this, I'm going to say it in the vaguest terms possible because they're a secretive company. Okay? Sure. Yeah. I was up for a thing that would have been on Netflix. Okay.

[00:04:20] That could be any one of literally five million shows. What do you mean? Well, you only have a couple things right on there on Netflix. They were like this... The office. Yeah. They were the office and friends. Right. Right. Were you going to be on one of those?

[00:04:35] Oh, wait. I can't comment further. All right, fine. Fine. Fine. It's probably the office. Fuck. I'm going to comment further. You're probably just going to splice him into season three. I just want to explain this setup, okay?

[00:04:48] They were pointedly like, we think it would be good to have one American person on this show. Oh, sure. I was up for a position that was like, we want an American... It's like an English show, but we'd like an American element. Right.

[00:05:01] Kind of throw the balance off in a fun way. And we were having the conversations about like, do you think you'd want to live here? How many times would you want to fly back? You would live in it. I mean, the bit potential was so rich.

[00:05:14] I was so excited to be able to call in... It was honestly, it seems like the biggest draw for you in total. Unquestionably the hugest draw. The bit potential is going to be through the roof, okay?

[00:05:28] But we were having those logistical conversations that were like, would you rather live in a major city or in the countryside closer to where we're filming or like, it wasn't that, paperwork wasn't beside, but it was like, this feels like it's going to happen.

[00:05:41] They clearly have designed this to be able to hold a hiring an American actor and flying them over and working out the work visa and all of that. And then Netflix announced that they had lost subscribers and then their stock dropped.

[00:05:57] And then within two hours, they said like, yeah, I think we're going to hire someone for me. Wow. So it was... The vagaries of the stock market. Instantaneous. Like they finally had a quarter where they didn't add subscribers and that was that.

[00:06:11] And I don't want to say the job was in the palm of my hands, but let's say... You were... Let's say maybe I was one of three American contenders. Who knows? In the running, right? They write up there.

[00:06:19] And then suddenly the entire notion of the position existing warped. Right. All right. Well, what can you do? Yeah. The stock market. It's the stock market. Can't control that fucker. The industry is terrible and I don't have a career. But the point is... You have a podcast.

[00:06:32] I have a podcast, thank God. And we were recording episodes like Mad and Ben only checked the public enemies thing right before it was going to go out. We'd done most of it and then you were like, okay, let me check in on the end of this one.

[00:06:44] We've been putting a lot of work on your plate recently because we've been recording overtime. Yeah. I mean, my mom was her birthday, she's 75 years old. Happy birthday. Yeah. 75. I know, it's crazy. I forgot your parents had you... A little older. Older parents.

[00:06:58] So I came back and I just wanted to do my last sort of like double check on finishing out the episode, adding in the sound effects. And that's when I was just like, this is unlistable. Even like taking the time delaying the publish. Yeah.

[00:07:11] It was just you guys were... It was like a CD skipping, you said. It is definitely Double Edge Sword where I remember the last time that this really happened was Batman vs Superman. Right. Where we had to release like a very cut down episode. My God.

[00:07:25] Because we were like it was a similar audio issue. It was like... Same thing. This is just not really comprehensible so we save the pieces we can save. And with that one it was all over the place. At least with this, we mostly just lost the end, right?

[00:07:35] Yeah, but there's a little bit of classical music in the middle there. I cut the music because people are complaining to me. Right. But people... Oh so you re-uploaded without the music? It's fine. This is what I was gonna say. Okay? This is what I was gonna say.

[00:07:50] When the Batman vs Superman episode came out, people liked it. And they were like, man how incredible... Could have done with more. Put in the work to save it. And it's now the Double Edge Sword of like people like our podcast enough that everyone was furious.

[00:08:04] Not everyone, but some people. But I think all three of us on Sunday were like sweating it. Yeah. Because we got the text from you and I was like what's going on? And then I woke up to like... I mean we know what the culprit is here.

[00:08:18] We know what happened to the last 30 minutes of the episode. Podfade. Oh it was Podfade. And your times called it. Damn it. Podcasting's over. Ben's not enjoying this. No no no. It was Podfade. I am enjoying this. I mean it's like you know... It was Podfade.

[00:08:33] You know the New York Times... They need to probably contact me. They do. To do a follow up about this sort of new sort of thing in the podcast space. You should probably do a little press conference and sit down with New York Times

[00:08:47] for like an exclusive first interview. But I just think I mean... The first guy diagnosed with Podfade. Podfade? Yeah. I think in a world where two people can't cynically put the smallest amount of effort into producing three episodes of a podcast with extreme entitlement.

[00:09:06] I think they made six. The Podfade people. They made six. Four years ago. Yeah. I know. I mean if the industry can't help them... Doing a podcast about a subject they claim... They themselves admit have no knowledge or expertise in. They put minimal effort into.

[00:09:24] Only to try to make money. Proudly. Grow their brands. They proudly said they'd want to put a lot of work in. It clearly means that this art form is done.

[00:09:32] And it also means that now the episodes being produced by people who do care about what they do are going to start fading. Yeah. This business obviously built on quicksand. This of course is an episode on the pilot for Miami Vice. But I'll just say... Yes.

[00:09:48] That I appreciate the passion. So I take constructive criticism. Well, it's not really your fault but yeah. There's Podfade. Really just this little fucker right here. But these things happen and anyway you got a bonus episode. So here's the bonus episode. We're giving it to you right now.

[00:10:06] It is our man bonus. It is a Thursday bonus. Little Thursday bonus. It is about something he neither wrote nor directed but nonetheless is sort of intimately involved with. Which is awesome what we like to do. Right. Which is the episode Brothers Keeper. A pilot of Miami Vice.

[00:10:22] 1984, two hour with commercials. Pilot episode for a game changing TV show. It is weird that he neither wrote nor directed this. Written by Thomas Carter directed... I mean sorry, written by Anthony Yerkovich directed by Thomas Carter. Thomas Carter who later went on to direct Coach Carter. That's true.

[00:10:41] He made swing kids. He made save the last dance. Did a lot of TV. He was a TV actor originally. Then became a TV director and then became a film director. Yeah. Off of this. I mean this was so...

[00:10:53] Kind of that classic old fashioned Hollywood like yeah kid you know. But being able to say... You've been around a set. Right, you did the Miami Vice pilot. That's a calling card. It's a pretty true pilot. People took note. Yeah.

[00:11:04] I mean someone I saw some quote that said... David just spilled mints everywhere and now the episode is ruined. Oh, pod fade. Oh my God it was pod fade. In the mixing board they're fading into the mixing board. Pod fade strikes again. Go on. They said... Yes.

[00:11:24] Everything in television had sort of looked the same until the Miami Vice pilot. They were like there was the one big shift from black and white to color. But there was a pretty limited language in terms of how television looked. Partly because of the schedule.

[00:11:40] Like how quickly you have to make these things. Technical limitations. Right. All of these things. And you know a language developed around you know a smaller screen. And then how people process visual information differently. In half hour chunks in you know 12 inch stretches you know whatever. 100%.

[00:12:00] I mean this show is coming after what we say is like the sort of the dawn of you know prestige, golden age. Like Hill Street Blues, A&L swear.

[00:12:11] Like you know the shows where it's like oh like people start finally being like television is kind of an art for life. They're elevating it but I feel like it was always like the thing that's being elevated is the writing.

[00:12:20] The level of the writing or the honesty of the performances. They're dealing with tougher subjects you know or greater emotions. There's more realism, there's more grit, there's more social honesty. But once again that was often the language and the acting.

[00:12:35] These shows still kind of would look the same. You know? And then this is a show that looks and sounds very different. Very cinematic but also we should say MTV. The Music Television Channel. Music Television. What? Wait Music Television? Clearly you're putting a period between those two words.

[00:12:56] Those are two completely separate art forms. Music, comma television. Put them together. What? Music Television MTV had launched in 1981 and had become a sensation. Yeah. And so right isn't that the famous story about Miami Vice is that, wait who is it? They pitched MTV cops.

[00:13:15] Yeah, but I think it was someone came. Anthony Yurkovich who wrote the pilot of Miami Vice and was a producer on it. Worked on Hill Street Blues which was this and then this NBC executive. It's the NBC executive. Tartakov? Isn't it Tartakov?

[00:13:33] Like approached him and was like here's the pitch MTV cops. And Yurkovich was like Miami. Like we could do it in Miami. Like that's a sexy city right? Like, oh yeah it's Tartakov. Yeah he wrote a brainstorming memo that read MTV cops. That's the legend.

[00:13:50] How and when does Michael Mann get involved? It's a good question actually. So you started pretty early. Yeah. I think pretty much from when it's getting in. It's you know. But he wasn't there for that germ moment of MTV cops?

[00:14:05] No, it was Tartakov who supposedly came up with it that he claims like it wasn't like that. I read an article about acid forfeiture and like you know it went from there. Like he tries to downplay the sort of sexiness of it.

[00:14:19] But that was sort of where more visual stylization was coming into TV was through music videos and commercials. Yes, but then yeah. And I guess just very early on the production company is Michael Mann production. So like man it's just involved.

[00:14:34] He's kind of the showrunner I think for the first two seasons. Yeah. After that I think his involvement in Miami Vice is very limited. But it's weird because he was entitled only an executive producer but kind of function like the showrunner. Yeah, I think he was the showrunner.

[00:14:46] Never wrote an episode, never directed an episode. But you watch this and you're like... You wrote one episode. Really? You wrote one episode called Golden Triangle. It was the 14th episode of the first season. Two-parter. We should have watched that. We could have. We could have.

[00:15:04] He didn't direct it. He just wrote it and it's like he co-wrote it. Okay. But I just think this is... It's so much a part of his legacy. Oh totally. Yeah.

[00:15:17] No, but I was just gonna say this is like one of the first shows that's like what if the entire show looked like a music video or looked like a commercial? Which I feel like sometimes people use that as a complaint against things that are pretty. Yeah.

[00:15:31] Yeah, right. Like what should I call it? Luca Guadagnino I Am Love. Sure. When that came out people were like, it's just like a two-hour perfume commercial. I'm like, perfume commercials look good. That's not a problem. Everything else in the movie is good. Yeah, I'm absolutely good.

[00:15:46] It's got a good script and really good acting. They're saying it's a negative that the thing is visually sumptuous. They're saying it's soulless though. I like to say one of those things where it means like style over substance when you're using that insult. Right? Like... But I think...

[00:15:59] I feel distracted by the prettiness. Look there are examples of that but I think most often when people say that they mean I am distracted by the prettiness.

[00:16:06] And this is one of the first shows that was like it was viewed as if you have that much style, you're overcompensating. You're covering for something else. You know? I think that was always sort of the perception. If you're too flashy, what are you...

[00:16:20] What are you covering for? Right. And this was a show that was like no, the flash is the thing and also the thing is the thing. Right. We're going to do both.

[00:16:28] We're going to do like try to write like Hill Street Blues level scripts and have real granite performances and make it all look fucking awesome. And part of man's thing, I'm sure you read this, no earth tones. None. No red. Out of here. No brown. No. No. Neon.

[00:16:50] Blue. Pink. Purple. This show kind of single-handedly elevates men's fashion in the United States. Like people were not... American men were not interested in Italian suits. Right. You know? Anything like that. I mean there was just like, there was a very standard like, this is a well-dressed man.

[00:17:08] Well like Brooks Brothers versus you know, any Italian maker. Let's create a fashion if you want to say it. You know? Outside of a standard formal wear. Yes. Right. That he brought all the Italian fashion stateside which there was not really a market for

[00:17:23] Italian fashion for men in the United States and it bloomed after this. Crazy. But it's just that classic... The shoes. Shoes, no socks. Right. A blazer, maybe like a pastel light blue or pink shirt. Yeah. Maybe not even a collared shirt, right? Right. Sometimes t-shirts.

[00:17:43] Slickback hair and often the sleeves are a little short. Right. Yeah. Skinny tie. If he's wearing a tie. I guess Tubbs has a skinny tie on. Yeah. Don Johnson, you said this in our Miami Vice episode. I think it's accurate.

[00:17:58] He looks like what people think they look like when they're on cocaine. Right. People who are like, yeah man, they're like, right. I look like Don Johnson. I've never felt better. They look like Colin Farrell. Right. They think they look like Don Johnson. Right.

[00:18:09] They look like they haven't washed in a week. Right. Don Johnson. Very pretty. David's taking a bite. There's a pretzel. Here, get a hand, David. He's a snack. He's a snack. And we lost more listeners.

[00:18:27] It was kind of startling to watch us and be like, God damn it. Is that a beautiful man? Right. That is a very, very pretty person. We should say with ma'am, his trajectory is he made the Jericho mile, right? He'd worked on like TV shows before then.

[00:18:41] He makes the Jericho mile and he goes off. He makes thief. So good. So good. Yeah. I forgot we got to do our ranking at the end of this episode. He goes off, he makes thief. He makes manhunter. And then he's back.

[00:18:55] And he's bringing those kind of neon sensibilities to this show, right? The neon noir. Yes. And then he makes... Oh, he'd... No, I'm sorry. He hadn't made manhunter. Manhunter is 86. It's in the middle of this. Okay. He had only made the keep. Thief in the keep. Crazy.

[00:19:17] So he's made a very well-regarded debut and he's made a disastrous horror film that was taken away from him. Right. Yeah. And I had a really good role-playing game that we will continue at some point. On the Patreon. David's... What is he doing? He's slam dunking?

[00:19:35] Two thumbs up? He's doing the two boner fingers? He's pointing to the sky? I feel like athletes do that a lot. Giving it up to God? Right. Yeah, okay. Give it up to the big man upstairs. Fine. I will give it up to the big man upstairs.

[00:19:49] Have you ever seen Miami Vice before? I had never seen an episode. I've certainly seen a lot of clips. I feel like maybe I've been channel surfing, caught a bit. I've never sat down and watched a proper episode. I don't think I have either.

[00:20:00] I may have caught an episode or two just in reruns. I was surprised by how successfully this kind of plays as a self-contained film. Yeah. This plays great. Because I always thought of Miami Vice as like, oh, it's a very stylish procedural. Right.

[00:20:14] Which I think it does sort of evolve into. Sure. But this is very much an emotional story. Right. And with some crime at the middle of it. But this is very much a character. No, but it has an arc. It is a classic pilot.

[00:20:27] They kind of don't make him anymore. Right. Like he used to be, anytime you watch a TV show, we're talking into the 2000s, you'd have to watch the pilot first and be like, oh right, this is like a movie. Right.

[00:20:38] And then the second episode might be on different sets. Maybe even actors will have been swapped out. Right. And the second episode is going to be an extremely lame reintroduction of everything. Yeah. Because they shot this nine months earlier.

[00:20:49] They often would shoot the pilot as a backdoor sort of thing where, well if it doesn't work then we just air it as a TV movie. Right. We can just put it on. No matter what we get the value of it.

[00:21:00] So make a slightly higher value, more self-contained, hour 40 minute narrative. Right. And if it works, we do it as a series. Right. And a lot of those would get released theatrically. Sometimes like something in Europe. Yeah. Some TV movies as well, like Jericho Mile. Yeah.

[00:21:16] Like, you know, Bale Stark Galactica was released as a film. Right. Not a bad pilot even though it's a total ripoff of Star Wars. Yeah. Never seen it. But right. I just mean like if you're sitting someone down and you're like, let's watch the X-Files

[00:21:31] pilot like or what. It's like, it's going to feel like a little movie about these two people meeting and having an adventure and you know, like, you know, there'll be some dangling stuff but it will kind of be complete.

[00:21:40] Well that's the weird thing about pilots and this is finally kind of shifting now because of the way the industry works. But you kind of have to make a pilot that works as a complete thing but also simultaneously

[00:21:53] sets the stage for how you could make years of this thing. Right. Which is almost impossible to do both simultaneously. We're like anyone who's watching a pilot, whether it's a focus group or the executives

[00:22:04] themselves, they want to watch it and be like, I feel a sense of completion watching this. I feel satisfaction watching this but also I see the profitability. It's not going to be me but proof of concept. Right. It's got to be both at the same time. That's insane.

[00:22:18] Which is why I usually don't like pilots. They're usually bad. When I was a TV critic, I would often be like, yeah, you kind of have to get past the pilot. And I would admire pilots if they sort of found a way to do what you're talking about.

[00:22:30] Like the Freaks and Geeks pilot is one of the great pilots. Cheers. My so-called life. Cheers. My so-called life is arguably the best episode of the show until maybe it's like last two. Do you have a go-to answer for the best pilot of all time?

[00:22:42] Is there one that jumps out to you? Freaks and Geeks is usually my answer. I think the six feet under pilot. I think the six feet under pilot, that's a show that I am mixed on. But I think that pilot is basically a fantastic movie.

[00:22:53] Like the ending is like pretty phenomenal. You don't really need to make more six feet under. Like they made a show and the show is up and it has a lot of great stuff in it.

[00:23:02] But the way that ends you're kind of like, wow, that was kind of great. Yeah. Good story. Lawn order really set up. There's going to be a lot and per cent.

[00:23:12] And look, they wrote a big check for themselves in terms of having to set up both of those things in one pilot. But I saw that and I was like, I could see this every week. And I got room for the ampersand in the middle.

[00:23:24] Trying to think of other great pilots. The West Wing has a great pilot. Do you like NYPD Blues? I love NYPD Blues. I don't know if the pilot... Ben's talking about NYPD Blues which is a jazz club that he goes to or off-duty cops play the sax.

[00:23:41] NYPD Blues. I'm trying to think of this. I'm trying... Someone thinks they're funny. Someone's in a mood. The Sopranos Pile. That's the other one. The Ducks Leave. Sure. I've never seen the Sopranos Pile. I highly recommend it. The Sopranos Pile is bullet proof.

[00:24:02] It has this whole arc with the ducks in the pool, the ducks leave at the end and you're like... Again, you're sort of like, I understand that this setting things up or meeting characters is going to be more of this, but I do feel very emotionally satisfied.

[00:24:15] But isn't that that weird thing where you're like the best pilots of all time also end on a note where you're like they could have just not made the show. This would work as its own thing. But you wouldn't have met the supporting characters and all that.

[00:24:27] I'm not saying this show would be better off if it hadn't done it, but for a pilot to really work as its own thing, it needs to feel like it doesn't need the rest of a series. And very often there are things where it's like...

[00:24:38] Like when community aired. I was like, I don't really like this episode. I see how it could become a good show. Like I don't think the pilot's very good. Right. Thirty Rock is the same thing.

[00:24:47] A lot of comedy shows are like this sets the stage for what I could see myself enjoying. There's a lot of room for growth. I'm going to give it three weeks to see if they find the tone. Yeah.

[00:24:55] I mean the classic tests especially when I used to write about TV is like, the second episode, write it off. It's going to be bad. Second episode of every TV show is bad. It's everybody restating their business. It's universal. No, I think with the best second episode.

[00:25:07] There might be good ones. There's almost none. The third episode is or the fourth is usually where it's like... Here's maybe a second writer is coming in. They're trying to sort of be like, here's how this show is going to work now. Yeah. You know what I mean?

[00:25:21] Like the lost pilot is a great pilot. It's this action adventure. It's crazy. The second episode is the Kate episode. That's kind of like introducing Kate and like, oh, she's a woman of mystery and you're like, well okay fine.

[00:25:32] You know, and like put apart then the third episode is technically episode four. But yeah, because the pilot's such a part is walk about. Where they're like, here is the limits of our imagination on this. And you're like, holy shit. Like, oh my God.

[00:25:45] You know, like that's what they're going for. I also think that's the point in production where the actors and the characters. They're starting to set a little bit. Their characters. And so A, the writers are starting to go like, oh, here's what this actor can do.

[00:25:56] Let's write to them. And B, the actors starting to take a little more authorship of the character. Which is an exciting thing to see that you don't get to see in plays. Because even if someone's playing the character a thousand times, the text is remaining the same. Yes.

[00:26:11] Or in movies, the idea of it being an ongoing thing and especially in traditional broadcast models, the thing where it's like, episode four is airing and that person is shooting episode seven or eight. And they're getting the feedback of what the audience is responding to.

[00:26:27] The writers, the directors, the actors, and they're reacting to that and going like, ooh, double down on this, drop this. I miss that. This is the thing I wanted to say. The thing is, pilot episodes now are kind of dead. Yeah.

[00:26:42] Usually a show has already been ordered to 13 episodes or whatever by Netflix or whoever. So it's like the pilot episodes really just 10 minutes of plot. Right. Like it feels like this very squishy setup be like kind of nothing happens. Right. I'd say one of two things happens.

[00:26:55] Either someone sells a series and then they just start writing the whole thing. Right. Or someone writes a pilot as sort of a writing sample. Yeah. And they commit to doing a full season off the pilot script.

[00:27:06] But by the time they shoot it, they have already written the other episodes. So they've maybe rejiggered it. Amazon was still doing pilots. It was one of the last Amazon pilots. Right. Because Amazon had that old fashioned like we'll show you the pilot and then a year later,

[00:27:19] you'll see a show. Right. And it's a thing that still irks me where there's shit like that we had to change the suit two more times. Right. Because the pilot suit was literally, I don't think I've ever said this on a podcast.

[00:27:32] The suit they built got partially confiscated by the TSA when they were flying it from LA to New York. Yeah. And someone had to pull a like a fucking like 48 hour mad rush to completely construct an engineer a new mechanical suit for Peter. Right.

[00:27:49] And we just were like, well, we have to film this. Right. And we shot a pilot with a suit that looks like fucking hot diarrhea and where he couldn't hear anybody or could barely move. And then. He does look crazy in the past.

[00:28:00] And then like 10 months later, we were just like, well, the suit's different now. Right. We couldn't reshoot the whole thing. Right. You know what I'm going to do? Right. But that's like what used to happen. That's what pilots were always like, yeah.

[00:28:10] Where it was like, oh, that's weird they didn't realize that character isn't British yet. Or like these major shifts happened in the first couple episodes and now everything is like, no, it's really like a 10 hour movie. Yeah. Well, right. Yeah.

[00:28:22] It's like they shot, they shot the pilot at that school, but then that school got knocked down or another show had it. So the, you know, they finally built some sets. So now every episode the school is going to look different.

[00:28:32] But even if it's less clean, I feel like we're all guys who like being able to watch that evolution happen. Like it's fun. There's something exciting about watching a show figure itself out in a way that can only happen in that model.

[00:28:45] I've been watching all of Seinfeld and like watching the evolutions of it. The Seinfeld Chronicle. Yeah. That was the pilot. Elaine's not in it. They thought the only female character was going to be the waitress. Kramer's called Kessler. Yeah. Weird.

[00:28:57] And he's just like kind of like a smoke. He's just like a little weird. Right. And you watch like over the course of the season they're like, what if the hair is like a little bit taller? Like every episode they pushed the hair a little bit. God.

[00:29:10] And yes, I don't know who it was, but someone was like, can we have a woman in this that's not just an all knowing waitress? Like who's like Seinfeld, you crazy. Right. The waitress character sucks. She's not good. Yeah. God, she must be like, right?

[00:29:25] Isn't she like the, who was the, you know, Pete Bester, whoever the fifth beatle. Right. I thought it was going to happen with Malaney. Oh, so you'd watch it like Stratosphere. That I would be like the seventh friend or the sixth friend.

[00:29:36] People would be like, you know, weirdly Griffin Newman was once in it. Then he was written out due to incompetence. Yes. We assume. Right. Who knows? You know, Griffin Newman. He hasn't been heard from again. He walked into the sea. Right.

[00:29:46] I was going to make a joke about why people wouldn't know my name. And walking into the sea is nicer than committed some sort of awful slaughter. Oh, God. Yeah. All right. Miami Vice though. Miami Vice though. Great pilot. Great pilot.

[00:30:03] And it even feels like when that theme hits. Yeah. Wait, what are we going to say, man? Arista development pilot. Good pilot. Good pilot. And then it's introducing you to the format of that show. And it's stylistic. Yeah. But good pilot.

[00:30:15] But episode three I think is bringing a buster is like when you go like, fuck, this is a great show. They figured it out. So it's your, it's to your point. Right. That one I watched and I go like really good pieces. There's good stuff here.

[00:30:25] There's some shows where you show someone the pilot. They're like, I can't wait to see 50 of these. Yeah. Some shows we show them the pilot with the caveat of like, okay, so this is going to be intro and we're going to get there.

[00:30:34] You know, well, well, you know, you're going to settle into this show. I'm going to the bathroom now. I got it. You're going to the bathroom. Jesus Christ. This is what we're going to talk about. What are we going to talk about? We're not going to do bitch.

[00:30:46] Okay. Real talk. Real talk. We're going to see Kong later. We're seeing King Kong tonight. We're seeing the big boy himself on B way. It's about to close. It is closing to not great reviews. No, and a massive, massive financial write off. Yeah.

[00:31:07] No, I don't think they, I don't think that they walked away with money. No, no, they walked away with negative money with anti-money. Yeah. But I think you said, I got to see the big boy and I said, I got to see this puppet.

[00:31:20] And so we have met in the middle. We're going to say, we got to see this big, big public. Well, I tried to get tickets to the island. You want to go to school? I want it. And it was so expensive. No Airbnb.

[00:31:33] This time of year in August? Like tiptoeing into August? Yeah. It's like prime travel season. Right. Tons of people love to vacation on school. Yeah. So it just, this felt like the more accessible thing. And the show is doing so poorly.

[00:31:49] They are actually paying us to go see. Yeah. Not because of this podcast or the platform. No. We were just walking down the street and someone was like, please, please. They literally just gave us $50 to say, please come back here at seven tonight.

[00:32:02] It almost felt like a monkey paw situation. I'm like, have we inherited some sort of curse? Well, that's the thing I'm, I don't think we'll be cursed. I don't either. I think we're going to have a great time. Honestly, the thing is we're really cool.

[00:32:12] You know what I'm saying? It's a big fucking puppet. It's like huge. I'll tell you what my concern is. I think we might have too good of a time. I'm going to have to like keep going back till it like closes finally. Yeah.

[00:32:25] And you have very, very limited window. There's like 10 performances left. Why don't you talk? Oh, are you talking about the big boy? Well, you'll never know. Okay. Well, I'll listen. No, no, you won't. Not this one. I mean he could take it out. No, it's staying in.

[00:32:40] Kong, we're going to see him. I know you're seeing the big boy. I tried to get to the island. It's called Island. Okay. Very expensive. Sure, that's like a $2,000 ticket. I hate to repeat that joke because you're not going to be allowed to hear this episode. David.

[00:32:54] You ever been to Miami? I have. I shot in Miami once. Oh. For the television series Graceland. Right. You were on Graceland? I was on Graceland. You went to Graceland. Oh my God. Yeah, my best oldest friend, Derek Simon, his first paid job as a writer,

[00:33:11] was on the TV show Graceland, and he convinced them to hire me as a southern redneck. That's right. Cool. A threatened woman with a shotgun. Oh. I'm a little slow. I throw flies into a bug zapper. Okay. With chopsticks. Sure. Hmm. Probably my best work. Cool.

[00:33:36] What was it called? I was there for several days. It was called Sense Memory. Yeah. Oh boy. And if you folks know the tens of sense I have made off of that episode, those residual effects. Tens of sense memory? Tens of sense memory. How is Daniel Suñada?

[00:33:51] Didn't work with him. How is Aaron Tavit? Did not work with him. Who'd you work with? Vanessa Ferlito. Oh, she. Pleasant. Okay. There you go. Reese Coyro, did you work with him? No. I think Vanessa was the only regular I worked with,

[00:34:04] and then it was a lot of guest stars. Yeah. These Southern brothers. What was Reese Coyro just in where I was like, oh, that was Reese Coyro. You know, that was a entourage guy. I don't know. What was it? Oh God, I'm going crazy.

[00:34:19] Have you guys been to Miami? No, never. I've been to Tampa. That's the only place in Florida I've ever been. Ben, I have been to Miami. Whoa. Unsurprising. Yeah. I've partied in Miami. You? Yeah. Wow. Party in Miami. I had a very good time.

[00:34:35] Let's just say I partied all weekend. Did it sleep much? Yeah. If you catch my drift. Yeah. You were done Johnsoning all weekend is what you're saying. I was having fun. It was dancing. It's got a great club scene, great food. Yeah.

[00:34:49] Wait, but have a good club scene over there? Miami. Have you heard? Miami, Florida? Oh right. Of course. He's in the bone sketch of Tim Rott, of Think You Should Leave. He's the bones of their money. He's the other guy. The bones of their money. Right.

[00:35:02] Obviously, when an NBA team rolls through Miami to play the Miami Heat, the bones of their money. They die. No, but it's just one of those things where like people will kind of make jokes about like, oh, I hear they arrived last

[00:35:13] night and then you see them and they're kind of like, they've been up. David once again for the Listered Home doing a great entirely physical bit. David was like someone lazily dribbling and throwing it out. It was funny. I don't know what to tell you.

[00:35:29] David did it very well. He was yawning and dribbling at the same time. Very precise physical humor. Yeah. But I don't, I think Miami's rep in the 80s is probably different, right? It's probably like... Well, it's a major hub for drug activity. I mean, that's the big thing.

[00:35:46] I mean, I'm aware that's why it's set there, right? That's why. Because a lot of drugs come in through Miami. But like, I don't know. I don't know. I feel like Florida has only like grown and exploded in population over the last 20. You know what I mean? Yes.

[00:35:57] It's only become bigger and bigger and bigger. I don't know. You know Miami is like going underwater. Our pilot discussion, right? Miami's disappearing. The world's terrible. It will end. So is the island of Manhattan. I mean, it's an island. We got a little more time.

[00:36:11] What are you talking about? Yeah, we live on an island. No, I think so. That's why I'm on island time. That's why I'm always late to record. Oh my God. That's fucking good. What if that's his excuse? Like, sorry. I'm on island time. Jesus. I live in Manhattan.

[00:36:25] I'm on island time. I'm in Manhattan, boys. I'm on island time perpetually. I was born into island time. You were. You were. So was I. It's actually rude of people to think I'd show up on time. It's out of my control. How do they? Lay my mom.

[00:36:38] She didn't get on a plane. Popped me out somewhere else while she still had the chance. I was born into island time. Do you have dual citizenship? Well, it's a sensitive subject. Okay, we want to talk about it. Continue with your-

[00:36:47] I would have been able to get dual citizenship. Do you have dual citizenship? Well, it's a sensitive subject. Okay, we want to talk about it. Continue with your- I would have been able to get dual citizenship. Do you have dual citizenship? Continue with your-

[00:36:57] I would have been able to get dual citizenship to the UK if I'd gotten this job. Really? Yeah. Why? Because my mother's- My mother's British by birth. Wait a second. What do you mean? I'm sorry, what? Like she was on vacation. I don't know how to do this.

[00:37:14] Hold on, hold on. No, no, you've got it. You've got to stick with it. You've got it. Hold on, hold on. Your mom. Because your mom we've all know is kind of like classically like- It's like a French- I think it was a French lady. French lady.

[00:37:26] So we assume- French lady. French lady, friend. She's born in France. This is the twist. Born in England. Wait, but okay, so then she was- Was she on vacation? Or wait, no, her mom. Because she wasn't out yet, but- My grandmother was married to a British man.

[00:37:44] Wait, what? What? Right, right, so. Who was my mother's father. Right. And my grandmother left him for a French man. Oh. And took my mother with her. And so my mother identifies as French. But I am technically a British boy. Oh, my God. What?

[00:38:04] It has never come up on- David, come on! David, it has genuinely never come up on this podcast. Is that true? We've been friends for five years, have I ever explained that to you? I think you might have. Yes. I think not.

[00:38:15] That's never come up on this podcast. But it took- No, the podcast for sure. No. No. What? I can't believe it. And the UK passport, if I spend enough time there. If I worked there, if I was there for long enough. Really? I've looked into this. Okay. Cool.

[00:38:30] I'm not saying this job would have covered all of it, but it would have started the thing in motion. I swear allegiance to the queen though. You willing to do that? Yeah. Queen Adda. From Up над Slime. Oh my God. Woo!

[00:38:44] I was trying to think of a queen character. I respect- And that was the- And that was the first? Shave it as She's not even a queen in the movie Isn't that uh Julia Louis dry it is

[00:39:05] She's a little purple and she's got kind of that like that little that jail desauciness Well, it's that thing where like it's like female cartoons Yes That way you know, she's a lady

[00:39:21] Queen Adam the princess at it. I haven't seen that movie in 20 years. I do know it's a masterpiece What a cap of a bugs Yeah, no, right, right

[00:39:34] Well, anyway, I that's crazy to hear I can't believe I'd love it for you to have a British passport. Yeah, there she is This is why I was gonna say yeah, you're talking about sometimes you show up out to someone and you're like

[00:39:47] You'll get good later, right? Yeah, there are also things like Studio 60 on the Sun says strip sure everyone's like fuck this they're hitting the ground running and The show can't sustain itself There there are other phenomenon where like a pilot is so hot

[00:40:03] Yeah, but the networks go crazy for it and then the show is like canceled by episode five They're absolutely are there are warning signs in in like the studio 60 pilot for example Yes, but also sometimes a pilot's too good. There's nothing left to do afterwards

[00:40:18] And that can happen. Yeah, you can have like a really sexy pilot and right You know, you never figured out what your show is week-to-week, right?

[00:40:23] Now I was surprised that the Miami Vice Pilot is so much an origin story between these two guys with so many twists and turns in terms of What you learn about them and what they learn about each other, right?

[00:40:34] And that it ends on this noteworthy I guess we'll be partners But also like all this whole systems kind of fog We'll get that in a second but like it almost resolves all of its own thematic concerns

[00:40:46] Within this one hour and 40 minute thing it does but it has the promise of like well If nothing else we can work together, but it's all in that way. It's such a good blueprint that there's a part of me

[00:40:58] I'm not surprised because of course we're talking out Michael Mann Who's a lunatic and never does anything the easy way, right? But Occam's razor you would go well Miami Vice movie do for Miami Vice Pilot what you did for LA takedown

[00:41:11] Right, and he's like no I'm not gonna I mean probably partly because the Miami Vice Pilot It's more famous, right? But right instead of doing an origin story kind of like here's how these two cops get together

[00:41:22] It's like no not only will we drop you into the middle of their relationship Well, we're dropping to the middle of a scene It's seen we'll drop you into the middle of them doing their job

[00:41:31] Their relationship has almost no tension anymore the movies just about their relationships with other people 100% they won't interact that much Right whereas this move this the brothers keeper begins with Don Johnson losing his partner it begins first with begins first with um, you know

[00:41:50] Philip Michael Vincent no Philip Michael Thomas film I always get Jan Michael Vincent the three names Philip Michael Thomas confused Philip white Michael Thomas you're right. It begins at the who's very goodness Yeah, he's great

[00:42:03] I feel like his legacy is now one of those examples of like oh he was like a David Caruso Where his like ego got too big because of the show and really that's his legacy

[00:42:13] I feel doesn't like direct movies and stuff like he has a whole directing career really yeah I feel like he had a legacy of asking for like a pay raise and it became difficult

[00:42:23] I feel like there were behind the scenes on Johnson is the one that they almost replaced right he actually was like You're gonna give me a big pay raise You know I think it was like

[00:42:34] Three season you know whenever the show is like just absolutely scorching. I think it's cool that they set up He has multiple tubs and his apartment okay? Yes, I was a little bit wrong about this okay Mark Harman

[00:42:46] I was trying to find the person they were like we'll just replace you with Mark. Yes, which is sort of like As much as Don Johnson became sort of a famous has been yeah, even though he had like Nash bridges after this

[00:42:56] He was like always around always worked But like he did kind of become a famous has been like it does feel like Mark Harman's a little too cute right like you know you need someone who kind of has that thing of like yeah

[00:43:07] He might just shoot you right you know yes, it'll live the life already. I Got it wrong. I was confusing Philip Michael Thomas with Someone else I'm forgetting who okay, but you know some another Caruso type who's like I'm too big for this and made

[00:43:24] Caruso is the one where like he lasted a season right there's he was so hot so fast Yeah, he was like well clearly I'm out of here I knew he didn't leave the show Chevy chase thing, but I thought that he was always threatened to leave the show

[00:43:36] I was conflating that with I knew there was some weird story with him Here's what it is Philip Michael Thomas is the man who coined the term he got oh

[00:43:46] Yeah, I knew that right. That's right because he Babe Roost I'll called his shot that he was gonna be Yeah, I'll do I'll win all four. I'm also he's not a director

[00:43:56] So I was thinking of the other triple barreled guy from Starsky and Hutch right who's the director of running man and shit now What fuck a John Michael Glazer? But glazers in there. Yeah, I think it is

[00:44:13] Great Paul Michael Glazer. I was two out of three and bad baby You were two out of three and he directed didn't he direct the running man? Yeah, the running man and Kazam something's gotta give he's an actor in that one plays the ex-husband on the Wikipedia

[00:44:26] It just says Thomas Queen Yakima He got you know meaning Amy Grammy Oscar Tony references plans for winning all four and then in one of the cruelest sentences on any Wikipedia entry ever He has not as yet

[00:44:41] Been nominated for any of these awards. He's been nominated for one Golden Globe I believe but has not factor into people's choice award and a Golden Globe nomination It's not nothing. He's a voice in a lot of Grand Theft Auto

[00:44:54] That's what it's saying that he now does a lot of voiceover work He also was weirdly part of the psychic readers network He was the spokesman for the psychic readers network and was only replaced by Miss Cleo Oh miss Cleo's alleged and he sued

[00:45:10] For breach of contract because they'd replaced him all right, it was originally the Phillip Michael Thomas psychic readers network Interesting career sure now I feel like he's a guy where they joke about the fact that he didn't you know really amounts anything after my advice

[00:45:25] Especially because the E got thing. He is so fucking good in this terrific I was like stunned by how good his performance is Also, I did know That his origin was like yeah, he's the New York cop who's like an outsider But I totally forgotten

[00:45:40] When this pilot opens in New York, right? Another thing that man jumped in the show. No no talk about that, right? He's like a New York street cop sitting in a shitty car in a shitty neighborhood

[00:45:53] These guys come up and try to mug him and he takes up it takes out a snub no shotgun. What's been looking at? Okay back to my advice Yeah Joe Michael Vincent sitting in a car in the into fucking merciless streets of New York City sure classic

[00:46:13] Michael Mann neon noir These guys try to mug him. He's got a gun this guy's desperate But I'll say starting in New York really helps make and make that hard cut to Miami feel really appetizing

[00:46:28] Yeah, well and also I think I would like to rewatch it actually just to see because like Miami Vice famous theme Famous opening theme by John Hammer great music in general You know, I went on a few dates with John Hammer's daughter really? Yeah

[00:46:48] How was it she I messed it up she was great well you miss something up with the girl now She's engaged in doing well But like this I just I'm sorry we've now landed on my my favorite Potential recurring segment for blank check

[00:47:07] David pups his arms to the Miami Vice team while Ben recounts romantic regrets David is just fucking flailing And Ben is really in his head. You can tell he's got that far off look. He's thinking about All the women he's loved and loved This is Ben is red

[00:47:30] Almost as Castillo But I feel like in the in the first episode sure the theme is extended and we kind of just like build into it

[00:47:39] Yeah, you know what I mean? It's kind of awesome. It feels like the opening to aliens where it like takes a long time to come together Oh Um So that I just like opening title. I do too this another thing I miss

[00:47:52] I think you might agree with me this pilot is best. It's good when people are talking Yeah, it's best when no one's talking. Yeah, and there's just music and they're just driving People were not doing on TV at the time

[00:48:03] That's the energy and the look that man was like plugging into this where he's like we can do we can do something like that It's okay. Yeah, you know because the script is solid It doesn't have the same sort of like diamond cut dialogue of man's best work

[00:48:15] It's got some fun lines right but it's like it's all of his pet themes Yeah, but it doesn't have his cronkets cronkets hole like where he's like

[00:48:25] Why is this amateur out? You know all his kind of like complaining and it's sort of like wise ass line like the little force It's okay. So if it's a little stock TV cop stuff But I think Johnson's good. He was this guy yeah who

[00:48:40] Had done some pilots. Hmm. He was kind of in that mode where like networks are sort of like this guy seems a little washed up Like I didn't want to hire. Yeah, he seems like a bad choice Nick Nolte Jeff bridges with her first choices

[00:48:52] Yeah, sure great that was never gonna happen They were like what if we got a big movie star do TV and they're like are you kidding me? It would ruin an actor's career were he to go back to TV

[00:49:03] Don Johnson also is like one of those guys with like one of those wild ride Wikipedia pages Or it's like one early life two acting three music for world championship powerboat racing well five personal life 5.1 Relationships and family 5.2 legal problems. You know what I mean?

[00:49:21] You just look at it the chapters and you're like oh He was married to Melon Agriphith twice and the first time was when she was a teenager Then they got divorced then they remarried about a decade later and had children 13 years later

[00:49:33] That's so weird, but I mean like he's one of those guys where it's like Here I'm reading. I'm reading spouses Spouses spouse one married 1968 annulled 1968 No, name name whoo house to the unknown woman spouse to Melon Agriphith spouse to

[00:49:52] married 1973 annulled 1973 what we what Melanie Griffith married 1976 divorce 1976 and how old was she in 1976? I'm guessing 16. I'm guessing she was born 1960. She's born in 1957 Which would make her 19? Okay, right? Yeah, okay? Okay, don't you just you just barely made it

[00:50:20] Melanie Griffith married 1989 divorce 1996 like two Melanie Griffiths and then Kelly flagger married 1999 They're still together so I guess he kind of finally just took it easy I don't know that is insane that he has to Identified spouses married in annulled within the same year

[00:50:40] Before he met the woman he would then later remarry successfully and that there no marriages in between the two There's 13 years in between where he's unmarried everything you're he had like a partner in there somewhere as well

[00:50:55] He's the father of Dakota Johnson, of course who is now the star of movies. Yes I'm a big fan of hers. I think you Dakota great. Yeah, love to come on seems like weird energy

[00:51:09] He seems he's kind of fun now in this like old like, you know, we're like People are kind of digging him up for a scene right? He's in like a Django Django, he's very good knees pinning down, right? He's in the he's gonna be a knives out, right?

[00:51:23] He's in a couple of the s craigsawler racist movies. Yes He's good in them though. Yeah, but it was one of those things where I think he was viewed as like Oh, this is a guy who's gonna make the leap from like

[00:51:34] TV to movies and then it didn't really happen Really, I always assumed that he was just like a schlocky TV actor That was always the vibe of his joke but in the 80s It's like you know the hot spot or right, you know

[00:51:49] What else we got here? I feel like his legacy was Dead bang if you heard of that one and on Frankenheimer He was a little bit of a Rick Dalton asked figure right where everyone's like oh man

[00:52:01] But when Miami vices his movie career is gonna be Rick Dalton For people because brand new this episode of Quinn and Tarantino's once upon a time in Hollywood Leo de Caprio Right is like that. Yeah, I think Rick Dalton's even more on the downswing

[00:52:15] Is that guy where it's like eh? He kind of had his bite at the apple yeah, man shit. He might just be a heavy now Yeah, right like right casting him as a leading man would almost just make us look bad

[00:52:28] It also his next big thing after my advice The only thing that really kind of stuck was him going back to TV Like ten years later and just being like now. I'm just the old cop now

[00:52:38] I'm like the cop who isn't cool, right? Yeah, 100% now. I want to watch the Nash for just There's like a big each Marin in that one. I think he later joined. I think he said maybe really yeah, I thought he joined later Okay, and John Johnson. Yeah, I

[00:52:55] Was getting ass bridges and Marshall law confused Marshall law was Chuck Norris. No no no because he was Walker, Texas Ranger Yeah, a Beck cheech Marin. I guess these are the French titles. Yeah, that's it. Oh, no James Gammon Love James Gammon the coach from major league

[00:53:14] Jamie P. Gohman law with Sam Oh hung and our senior hall Arsenio hall created by Carlton Q's Right at Carlton Q's and I believe Damon Lombloff both worked on Nash bridges at least Q's did yeah Q's was one of those guys who did schlock right lucky stuff

[00:53:29] Right a lot was more this sort of like I'm the kind of like the weird side right but those CBS cop shows Walker Marshall law in the 90s and Nash bridges, right? We're running the table

[00:53:40] And that's yeah, then he found that zone and now he's hit a certain pocket of I think people who grew up with him and thought He was the coolest guy when they were watching

[00:53:48] Miami vise when they were 13 now cast him in things right. That's what it feels like I mean all these guys like Ryan Johnson and Tarantino and McBride and and Hill are All in the age range to have been like don't just that's the coolest guy

[00:54:02] That was the yeah the guy was fucking he was he was like right the alpha male of American culture for a year, but he was viewed as like sort of like a Cursed pilot actor. Yes, there's certain people who get that

[00:54:16] Right right right they like do like six pilots in a row as a lead and they go like pageant Bruce is he the commonality here Is our audience has turned off by them until they get the one and at that point?

[00:54:27] It's like this is their last shot the network doesn't want to hire them right they hire him and It's it totally makes the show it does. He's great. Yeah, he's great, but I do think the best I like for the pilot

[00:54:38] I think it's a lot of fun to watch when you're it's incredibly easy to watch Sure is like you've I threw it on and I was like immediately like oh, hey

[00:54:44] Yeah, what's going on here? You know like tell me more right tell me more about the shotgun in New York Like yeah, right don't really care about the drug deal You know like the details of everything that's going on I'm like I get it

[00:54:55] There's a bad guy from Columbia, but the thing they're all tangled up in his net Right. That's interesting is in a an hour and 40 minute pilot I would say it takes until the halfway point for them to really to meet to meet yeah

[00:55:09] 100% because like these two guys independently tracking the same deal right Also, it has the advantage that it uses Jimmy Smith's Who's gonna be on LA law in a couple years, but he's still kind of like this like face

[00:55:24] God, you know what I mean and what a face and it's what he's in the what the first five ten minutes ten minutes, right? He's got two scenes essentially he's Don's partner. Yeah He's gonna get married right he's getting ready to get married

[00:55:36] I think he's getting married they're gonna have a kid something like that Yeah, he's like so he's nervous about that right and they sort of starting a family is the point right and And then he blows up

[00:55:46] He blows up because they're making a deal with a guy who has turned on the big drug door They were trying to take down right what does he say price of business or capitalism, right?

[00:55:56] You know that that he has turned on him and is like I can get you a better deal And they're like this is not helpful. This is not what we're trying to do here They realize that that drug lord Ricked his car up with a bomb a bomb

[00:56:09] Smiths dies in it and then there's some really good Don Johnson just broken sort of like the scenery goes to the diner You know to where the wife is a waitress is phenomenal and the guy you see the boss

[00:56:22] Like stand in the way block anyone else from entering the room like that. Oh, yeah It's good stuff and they don't cut to coverage. No, like she collapsed She's like wailing and he's like doing that thing where he like bear hugs her

[00:56:33] To just try to like support her and you just stay in this wide shot of the guy standing by the door It's him in the kitchen of the diner with her

[00:56:42] He's good at being broken all that eddy stuff is fun. We're like he's got the divorced wife, right? It's like man I Like you you're just a fuck up and he's like I know and that scene is like

[00:56:53] I like now this shit is like the most cliche like if you did a pilot now where it's like he's like kind of a jerk He's an absent father. We don't be like get out of but this anti hero stuff is right new right?

[00:57:05] He's dark. Yeah, I also family. I'll say a move that I think is really good Crocodile in his boat. Well, we'll get together. Sorry. I like it. Oh, yes big difference. What's it called Elvis? What took that out of this movie? Oh

[00:57:21] Yeah, kind of nuts that they were at even the end. Fuck that. Why would you have an alligator? I just feel like Michael is like what he can't have it how cool fuck out of you

[00:57:30] I also think he probably vetoed the alligator solely because he knew it would be satisfying to audiences I don't know. She's giving us a look. Do we have to wrap up soon?

[00:57:41] Who's waving us come in Rachel is a Rachel. Hi, Rachel. Do you have a podcast to do? Okay. Oh, yeah, we're almost done. We're almost done. We're gonna be done. We're just you can put this computer here Are you doing Rachel supremely over?

[00:57:56] Rachel's carrying a computer. She's doing okay We've been recording too many episodes and our episodes are long I'm just eating fundamental facts about our existence right now Can I say I want to ask you guys this so but yeah, Rachel will be done in like 15

[00:58:17] Double thumbs up from Rachel. Thank you. Sorry. Thank you, Rachel. Sorry, Rachel I'm getting very sick of my brain your brain because of the amount of time we're spending recording this podcast Okay, like what I'm like God

[00:58:31] I don't want to hear myself. Oh, you're getting sick of hearing yourself talk Yeah, wow that's a miles that is a mile to the point where now when I have inner voice thoughts

[00:58:40] I'm just like shut up. Okay. I've spent a host of like checking my listening to this. Oh shut up people love it People love it So not me. Uh, we were talking about

[00:58:55] No bueno, the other thing is you forget people are listening to you once a week you're present to you every day every Too much time yeah Elvis isn't in it. What was I gonna say? Oh the move I like is that

[00:59:13] He shows up but you didn't realize that all this was happening on the day of his son's birthday Right, he shows up with a box. It's such it's such hacky corny shit But this is what I like the wife starts giving him the business

[00:59:24] Oh look who decided to show up just in time everyone else at the party is like putting on their coats The parents are taking their kids with them. I love that Don Johnson doesn't defend himself at all. Yeah

[00:59:34] Yeah, he's got like the best excuse in the world which is my partner died today I had to deliver the news to his wife, right? And he's like no, I am a piece of shit

[00:59:44] Yeah, I'm gonna let her call me a piece of shit even though I have the one good excuse and he like walks in He could kind of trumpet here the kids excited you showed up of course

[00:59:54] I wouldn't miss it for the world and he's just dealing with the kid on his level and he waits a couple minutes before He tells him that the partner died at which point everyone in the party immediately shifts from viewing him as the deadbeat to being like

[01:00:07] Yeah, I think that moment's really strong That's fair. That's a moment that feels nuanced in a Michael man way Whereas the rest of that scene feels like that right the stock type sort of like

[01:00:19] Get out of his own way but the thing I responded to most is just I mean obviously the very famous I mean probably the most famous thing about Miami Vice scene in which they

[01:00:31] Silently drive to what could be their deaths and the the Phil Collins in the early night right in the in the air tonight Plays over there, you know, and it's just like that's I feel like that's what people still remember about Miami Vice more than anything

[01:00:44] Feeling that's when I was the most locked into this thing and that is that does feel like the Michael man magic where he's like you're allowed to do I like Yeah, I demand you go right. I don't know what else to say about this

[01:00:57] I really like it but like I wasn't really compelled to watch more No because I feel a sense of resolution watching this That's the weird kind of that right and also it's so notorious like Miami Vice season one was great tons of Emmy nominations

[01:01:10] The only reason I want to keep watching. Yeah, I want to get to Eddie Eddie Edward James Olmos because he's not in the first three episodes. Yeah

[01:01:18] He shows up but he's like their new lieutenant like episode four right and he is by acclimation best actor in the show He's the only one who won an acting already won an Emmy

[01:01:25] I went one two like everyone loved him because they're there just feels a little stagey. Yeah, he's fine He stays in the show I think but he's okay. He's whatever. Yeah, like John deal shows up You know like the cast is not yet built out

[01:01:39] Right so I would sort of be fun to see that but season one amazing season two. Okay. There's three more seasons But like you can check like Nations happening right right in the ratings drop. Well, oh see season four. Yeah All the pretzels

[01:01:56] I got the last pretzel. It's right here. I'm making me thirsty. Oh boy I don't know do you want to say anything? I'm done. Yeah I know I the thing I like is that it's not an odd couple narrative. It's not like they have friction with each other

[01:02:11] There's the initial friction of like wait a second like that moment when the whole the whole deal gets completely fucked up By like the backup coming showing up five minutes too early Yeah Tubbs on his own separate mission

[01:02:28] Interloping, you know right that like Johnson's got this all figured out like here's my victory lap I could take it all down and everyone else is like not communicating with everyone else and they fuck it up

[01:02:38] And then it's the thing of like wait you're a cop too. We got to figure this out I like the reveal that that Tubbs is has taken his brother's name to sort of avenge his brother's death

[01:02:48] Yeah, that's pretty that's a pretty fun twist like sort of like a nice third act twist, right? Right, yeah, right when they look him up and they go like this guy's dead

[01:02:56] And he's like this is the traitor and he's like no man like it's just right and there's no way else I could have done this I had to take my brother was the good cop like right and you have those flashbacks to the deal going wrong

[01:03:06] Yeah, those are cool. Yeah, I think all those are really good And it's nice that it sort of just ends on they catch the guy Yeah, the guy immediately gets bailed out, right someone read it said that that's a pretty common way that the show is pretty cynical

[01:03:19] Yeah often they don't get their guy You know what I mean like you know it had that kind of vibe Which is he appreciated that about the movie because the movie right, you know, they get Yaro, but they don't get the big guy

[01:03:31] They can't the it's gonna just keep gone keep on going right is like the Incredibles 10 Yeah, I like that a lot but I yeah, you know, I enjoy this I feel like this feels like watching like

[01:03:43] You know a little a little man bonus thing. It feels like watching Jericho mile or watching Right that's on our picture. Yes But but it's weird that it's not him and it's still so influenced by him and that the influence of this show

[01:04:01] Changes the entire landscape of television to make television feel more like Michael Mann movies We've already talked about any or you've got steady cam shots and that's when it's really done Man, you love you are best best

[01:04:15] That's a we best we were saying before recording this my mom only watched two TV shows when I was growing up And they were you are in Seinfeld And it was like she was like I don't like TV

[01:04:26] Like two shows of the night right these are the two shows worth watching now We're done with Michael Mann. It's been a blast. I think it's been fun

[01:04:33] We're almost done with me as a hockey as well. Oh, yeah, we've been recording like crazy. Yeah, I love to keep ahead Yes, but um Time for your rankings man It's 12 movies if you include Jericho mile time for your rankings man Add another end to that Um

[01:04:57] Go please okay, boys crazy for this or should I go first you go Yeah, I don't know me. I think I'll be someone you go first number one heat Number two Miami Vice number three the insider. Mm-hmm number four collateral. Mm-hmm number five thief mm-hmm

[01:05:14] Doing great. Okay number six manhunter mm-hmm number seven Ali mm-hmm number eight last of the Mohicans Number nine black it Number ten public enemies number eleven Jericho mile number 12 to keep Okay, let me see if I have this done correctly people are gonna be angry with me

[01:05:36] So there should be 10 and 12 in total if you're including Jericho more Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna do this and people aren't gonna like it Okay ready mm-hmm Number one thief Wow

[01:05:58] Wow, I'll say it's the one that's lingered with me the most rules and I got so empty when we did that one I was like fuck this is gonna be like this

[01:06:05] But I haven't that was the biggest rush I got and it's it's kind of just a perfect little thing Sure, it's weird to say that he hit at the hardest at the first time out But it was also such a perfect distillation of everything he does well

[01:06:17] Number two you heat. I'm not a moron. I'm not gonna deny heat I'm just saying for some reason thief works for me a little better Number three the insider sure mine number three too, which I kind of think would be my number one

[01:06:30] If not for how bad the wife character is Okay, sure, you know it's like there are a couple things in the movie that are so bad That almost are outweighed by the fact that the rest of it. I like the most out of his entire over

[01:06:45] Then I go man hunter Okay, okay, then I go Ali. Okay Ali I feel like I like more than most Probably because of how many times it played my home growing up With my weird brother Nine-year-old who's obsessed with Michael man's Ali then I go collateral

[01:07:05] Collateral is what where we were at what number are we here? So we're at three four five six six great Number number seven is public enemies All right, that's this is where I'm at at you. Yeah, Miami vice should be above okay come on

[01:07:21] Then you're really not gonna like what happens number eight blackout never ages back What's number and those two are kind of split by a hair? I think public enemy says higher highs

[01:07:33] Black hats more consistent. Sure. I like both those movies more than most people then I go Miami vice Yes, yep. Yep. We're pretty much the same with me then I go Miami vice

[01:07:43] Then I go last mohekins movie. I'm just not crazy about and here's the thing not my kind of movie I think it's well done when we did the episode people on Twitter and I want to I want to shut this shit down

[01:07:57] We're saying that they thought the episode was dragged down by Dana Stevens lack of enthusiasm a couple people said It made me very angry me to because I don't want to make it sound like it's too many people

[01:08:08] Dana's a fucking genius and they were also like oh man the boys weren't flipping out for this movie because their guests didn't like it as much First of all fucking relax Second of all we don't end our episodes with like a fucking star rating

[01:08:23] We talk about the episode we talk about the movie. They're all it's not my favorite movie I like it less than Dana so if anyone I'm dragging the episode okay you drag her You know, I know it was only a couple people but it made me very angry

[01:08:33] Okay, cuz I have to be real estate dancing Then I go the keep and then I go Jericho Cool, it feels like you got to put Jericho my last just cuz it's like no much of a movie put that above the keep

[01:08:49] There is there's undeniably something about there's something about it. I fully agree with that anyway I know is the episode out. What do we what are we? Yeah, right? Yeah, right on the computer one more thing

[01:09:03] What we're gonna play the box office game from public enemy. Oh fuck. We're gonna do it again. Yeah, okay? That's what we're gonna. Okay, but I'm gonna ask for one more thing I'm good. I'm gonna prep something while you're doing that

[01:09:14] So this is also now a test of memory because we record a public enemies episode Maybe ten weeks ago for a while. Yeah, ten years ago. Yeah, it was probably ten weeks ago We did that one fairly early in the recording. Yeah, okay number one

[01:09:30] Mm-hmm on July 3rd 2009 It's a sequel Transformers revenge of the fall see I think I'm gonna do too well in this well Let's find out number two forty three million dollars forty two sorry forty two one of the worst films of all time

[01:09:45] Probably may go base worst movie eventually the phone is is so so bad so bad. Oh forgive. Yeah, unforgivable You're glad anyway, then they made five more Number two animated film new this week 41 million dollar opening weekend. It's I say it's dawn the dinosaurs number three

[01:10:04] Number three is public enemies. That's right also opening 25 million. Okay, so it's just like if you'd heard it the first time You're not missing anything number four. Uh-huh. I think this box office game was pretty quick actually I did too

[01:10:18] I think I had these I remember this weekend. Yeah, number four romantic comedy In its third weekend, it's making 12 million. Oh the proposal Number five comedy. Mm-hmm, and it's fifth week. It's made 205 million dollars We did it I'm trying I'm trying to find

[01:10:43] The ratings for the pilot episode of Miami Oh, I don't know if you'll do that but here to come give some completion because we recorded spirited away today. Mm-hmm Also opening 64th on three screens

[01:10:59] Making five thousand dollars is Nea of our dollars is I hate Valentine's Day Wow one of the more demented movies ever made Truly truly truly truly truly bizarre movie nursing if you ever have the misfortune to watch it. I'm

[01:11:13] That's too bad and that's that's a little teaser for the fact and directed by Nia Yeah, that's her only in time. She directed right I think so It's a little teaser for the fact that our spirited away episode

[01:11:25] Of course has a 20 minute tangent about my big factory quieting course fantastic Yeah, it's the only one because she also co-wrote Connie and Carla and my big factory quitting to and what about my life in ruins

[01:11:37] My friend didn't write that she didn't write that. No, that was a near of our dollars vehicle They took another script and put her in it The only other thing she wrote was what come on a factory wedding to no I said that already

[01:11:52] What's the other thing she's not oh? She co-wrote Larry crown that's right. She put a crown on it. She did okay. I don't know if this is gonna work But I'm gonna try to do this Okay, the night of September 16th 1984 Okay

[01:12:10] I'm talking primetime slot seven o'clock to eleven o'clock The big three networks ABC CBS NBC right what do you think the top program of the night was my enemy fight This is weird okay, you know what it is. What is it?

[01:12:34] It's a different show called ER starring Elliot. Yes flash are East slash. Yeah, yeah, which weirdly George Clooney was on weird. Yeah, well, this is the was a comedy It was a sitcom set in an emergency room. Yeah, Ellie Egoold Mary McDonald conchata feral

[01:12:50] Yeah, that's a she's an oxander. That was a big show. It was not it only ran one season It didn't make it very far, but when it launched it was like Elliot Gould back on TV

[01:12:59] Yeah, Mary McDonald like you know big show it gets a 23 in the ratings Huge okay, and that's the pilot episode. Yeah airing the same night as Miami Vice, which is number two with 22 Point eight million okay, so very close. Okay the third highest rate show

[01:13:18] September so you're not giving you're not doing a time slot. You're just doing the night I mean the time slot there are only three shows. Yeah, so what's the third show? That's on CBS Okay, fine. What was the third highest rated David?

[01:13:31] ER was on from eight to nine and maybe vice was on from nine Oh nine to eleven right correct two hours, okay? Yeah, so they weren't in the same time slot but they're on different networks right? Yes, yeah, but what was Miami vice up against?

[01:13:45] The movie some kind of hero, okay, which got a nineteen point five back in the day people watch TV And the Denver Broncos Cleveland Browns game, so that's not interesting. I'm asking you for the top

[01:13:56] Ratings of the night. They don't have to be in the same slot. Okay. I'm asking you for the night What do you think the third highest rated thing was of the night?

[01:14:03] I'll give you a hint wait. I have a guess what 18 nope. All right. Give me a hint We kind of covered it on the TV show on the podcast before I kind of covered this TV show on the podcast before kind of We've talked about it extensively

[01:14:21] Because of one of the movies we've covered So tired to the extent that I would say we kind of have covered is it give me more hints. I don't know We covered it on this very mini series

[01:14:35] This very on this very mini series. We covered what was the third highest rated program of? the night September 16th 1984 Michael Mann has connections to two of these shows both the Miami Vice Pilot What is it crime story nothing to do with you slash are well?

[01:14:56] He wasn't connected to the show at the time, but later it would become a big part Of his filmography. Oh He had no involvement in the series as it was airing Okay, and in fact it's still airing It's still airing in fact it's still airing but

[01:15:13] It would later become a very crucial part of his filmography See this is kind of fun right very crucial This is a real stumper and this is fun And you're gonna get so excited when you figure it out and everyone loves this is not the Simpsons

[01:15:24] I'm trying to think of shows that still oh 60 minute twenty two point one baby, of course That's number three number four already spoiled is the movie some kind of hero. What is that movie even?

[01:15:37] Kind of nineteen point five that's insane. I'm sick. I think it's about some kind of Hero okay, and it's a Richard prior movie. It must have just been like for the first time on TV

[01:15:47] Yeah, and then here we go the number five can you guess the number five? No, it's on NBC. Uh-huh. So is the lead in at 730. Oh, it's 730 Jesus. Yes

[01:15:59] NBC it's a sitcom 30. It's a sitcom and I mean big rating. It's a new episode. It's part one of three One of three. It's a Sunday night It's lead in with silver spoons and I'll say pretty good pairing these two shows together

[01:16:12] There's there's a real vibe to this block David has given up He is surrendered his loading bullets into a gun He said you were sick of hearing you yeah, we only have one more episode and then a six flags trip great

[01:16:28] We don't look at what's now silver spoons did pretty well got a 9.6 But this one was blowing the roof off the door blowing the roof off the door. What the fuck am I saying? I'm tired of my own voice eleven point five and

[01:16:42] There's rumors now. They're gonna reboot this show for Netflix with the original star Rumors now they're gonna reboot the show for now Flix I have a guest start. Yes, punky Brewster nailed it. Yes one episode. Yes triumph

[01:16:59] I loved punky Brewster. You can't pay it pod fade this shit. You know what I'm saying rebooting punky Brewster with Celine Moon Probably I think adopting a kid or something. Is she gonna be punky? Yeah, she gonna wear different color Converse is

[01:17:12] Hell yeah, I think now she's gonna be the parent. Yeah, it's like Degrassi or whatever All right, well how many oh Jesus an hour 20 minutes we done okay get the fuck out of here Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate or you subscribe

[01:17:26] Thanks, Andrew go to our social media lame on coming for our theme song Joe bonaparte rounds for our work Go to like is that red dot com for some real nerdy shit good a tea public for some real nerdy shirts go to our patreon

[01:17:38] For some real nerdy commentaries. What what are we what are we up to now? What's what's the next one? Well, we got the six flags. No, no guardians is next though guardians will drop on Wednesday or whatever right or August 1st Right, right?

[01:17:52] Guardians with David early gardens of galaxy volume to David's holding onto the table or rock in the house drops today right it's August 1st right and And then the next episode unless anything goes drastically wrong the next episode is gonna be assuming nothing goes

[01:18:06] Horrifically wrong we're going to six flags things going wrong. It's gonna go better than good We're going in your jersey The only question is and you're gonna have to tune in you're gonna have to throw down your money on patreon to get the answer

[01:18:16] Well David wear a Bane mask a Batman cowl or Joker makeup. I'm I bought love Mike I have a 3d Mike. I have mobile Ringing I'm you guys are gonna get your rigging Asses

[01:18:34] Knocked off by how good this we're gonna bat me on the ride based on the Burton film and Ben There's a Joker roller coaster there that David says he has one ago Because it's a little too twisted

[01:18:46] Because why don't you want to go on it? I don't like roller coaster. Well what part don't you like? Yeah Nothing's gonna be out soon the Joker he's gonna be back That's it. That's it you're done. Okay, and as always the Joker's