Space Jam with James Newman

[00:00:00] Everybody get up it's time to slam now We got the real jam going down Welcome to the Space Jam Here's your chance, do your dance at the Space Jam Alright Blank Check with Griffin and David Blank Check with Griffin and David

[00:00:21] Don't know what to say or do I expect Blank Check with Griffin and David Sorry, but the name of the show is Blank Check Those little pipsquakes just turned to Supercasts Podsters, suffering fuck a tash Their podcast Oh my god that was embarrassing

[00:00:46] I said it was gonna be embarrassing and I did it and I committed and that's all that matters Well the mash up was good The mashup was great That was great that was professional It was enjoyable No, you did great I'll tell you something right off the bat

[00:00:58] I found out recently and this is gonna this is gonna weigh heavily on my performance for the entirety of this episode Okay, sure. I found out I'm not gonna name names friend of mine Went in for a big-time Hollywood General meeting at a big-time animation company

[00:01:14] Okay, and they offhandedly referenced our podcast what in the meeting and she texted me and said like hey It's getting around and I was like I'm furious. Why am I not being cast in all of those? Cartoon shows so now you're you're you're putting your marker down

[00:01:29] I'm saying if you're listening to this podcast and you're an animation world heavyweight Storm into an office and say like I just heard a man do three different looney tunes characters perfectly Well those jobs though that's like

[00:01:45] You have to die to exit one of those gigs right like if you're daffy Right David the context on this I'm gonna get into it so hard also. I did a bad job Well, although those characters my name is Griffin and I'm David sims

[00:01:57] This is blank check with Griffin and David It is a podcast about filmography directors who have massive success early on in their careers and a good series of blank checks Make whatever crazy product passion project she wants for creation pressure project

[00:02:08] And sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they jam baby sure But this is what we do sometimes in between many series you do a little palette cleanse

[00:02:17] We offer up a little sherbet to the audience and a thing we've been doing this in the last year the family choice episodes You brought your brother Joey sims in I brought my sister Romley Newman

[00:02:29] And then we had the siblings unite sure in a ratatouille episode that was rated One of Andy wire's best podcasts of the year. That's true. And that is when My brother came to me. I rate and Said see I'm out of brother right

[00:02:47] Everyone is out of siblings. Yes. Yeah, we're now done where this is the end and only child's only child Yeah, you know I'm gonna get my dad on yeah, I swear in 2019 Robert's gonna make an appearance Robert's choice

[00:03:00] Well now now that we got him in on the graphic design front I think he's got some skin in the game But but our guest today comes to me and he goes first of all Romley cannot appear on the show a third time before I appear once

[00:03:12] Yes, secondly if I get on the show you're gonna hit single digits on the indie wireless And that was the challenge thrown right right we're gonna jump he will out chart Right so today's guest is someone who's been talked about in this show from the very beginning

[00:03:27] True because so much of the shows about the context of when we saw these movies too And this is someone who I saw most movies with for the first 10 or 12 years of my life Why are you mentioning this Why am I mentioning this?

[00:03:42] Is it because you guys are Context is for contests Sure sure and our guest today long-time brother of mine James Newman. Yeah, okay, Jamesy I when I tell the stories

[00:03:52] I often call you Jamesy because that was of the time period and you haven't gone by Jamesy and probably 15 years now I think I ever went by James you were called Jamesy a lot around the house

[00:04:01] I wasn't the one I don't want to make it sound like I was the one leading that charge Well, what's the age difference between you two three years? Okay, sure. I think our parents called you Jamesy a lot

[00:04:12] I feel like when our mother like filled out forms for you It would always be James with an eye at the end Like she kind of I know he just I think she always I from my memory it was always James I

[00:04:26] Which felt very that was her kind of Euro touch maybe and then there was also the thing of changing your middle name My yeah, James's middle name got changed when he was like five because my mom decided she liked another middle name

[00:04:38] Don't you have like a couple of middle names? I have like 27 middle names and James had one between two and 27 right James had one and then five years later She was like this was my backup name for James

[00:04:49] And then made it his new middle name and then used it as a nickname most of which is well I my real middle name is Myron. Okay named after a dead relative I Think that's the subtext there. I think my middle name got a little too Jewish

[00:05:05] I think it's fine. I was a great and so it was changed to Milo Which is a little more like Milo minor binder right Milo from the Phantom told I think that was the thing I was really into the Phantom told booth and when I was reading it

[00:05:16] My mom was always like you know I almost named Jamesy that and then suddenly it became James Milo Newman And there was like this this rewriting of history, but you kept your initial right? It wasn't it wasn't so

[00:05:27] I think that's why she was able to do the sort of like Indiana Jones, you know idol swap Yeah, well, I'm thinking maybe that Milo was somehow short for Myron right I didn't know right. I know it's technically short for Michael

[00:05:40] But like not really our mother likes rewriting history and pretending like that never happened So that was one of her moves where I think she kept the story kind of vague so that you could think like oh

[00:05:49] Maybe Milo is just a new version of my middle name as opposed to a new name entirely But when we were growing up our father worked a lot and so like weekends were very much time with the boys, right?

[00:06:04] I feel like the week with your dad. Yes, right. It was like busy Perception was that he was working a lot. I don't know if my memory is he would work all day He would come home and he'd be really stressed out He would take us to school

[00:06:16] We'd like get morning time with him and then when he came home He'd be so stressed out and then he would like have a mug of wine with ice cubes in it Yeah, and then very quickly retired to the couch to watch political TV

[00:06:28] Interesting like the news. Yes But the weekends were like that was the time where it's like you take them out, right? Yeah We did a lot of stuff together

[00:06:38] The three of us did a lot right and I was the big movie kid and you were really into sports Yeah, our dad worked in the entertainment industry kind of resented it And he loved sports, which was what he wanted to be working in

[00:06:50] So we had like a foot in each and I feel like our weekends were always sort of this oscillation between like Okay, here's a sports thing that griffs lesson to here's a movie thing that James lesson

[00:06:59] Oh, you like movies more than I like sports. Yes a sample weekend might be we go to The all-star sports cafe in Times Square and then we go see move right and we get a little you know and sure Griffin could eat the chicken fingers. That's fine

[00:07:15] Usually trying to get a balance of things We both played like little league and like weekend stuff you did soccer for a lot longer But it was like oh if we're both playing low league baseball then maybe we get to go to the comic book store afterwards

[00:07:29] Yes, it felt like it was always like sort of like a piece of core that had to be weighed on the weekends keep us balanced but this movie became like a

[00:07:39] Huge I feel like this movie is a big formative thing in our relationship because this was one of the first times I remember something feeling totally equal in and of itself. That's the idea here

[00:07:50] Yeah, picking this the film we're discussing. Well, this was like your favorite movie for a number of years Yeah, I think well just the whole thing the movie the soundtrack right? I mean that's this is like the most effective piece of branding in the history of

[00:08:06] Studio filmmaking and famously this movie made a billion dollars in merchandising That's crazy, which is crazy for one film and not a franchise, right? But it was just like Warner Brothers was at this point, but it's to franchise

[00:08:19] Well that was the thing I was saying Warner Brothers was following the Disney example and trying to like hyper monetize the Looney Tunes in the way that Disney had with everything and this was like peak

[00:08:28] WB store which was a place we would also go a lot if we were trying to counteract the weekend, right? So that like the Looney Tunes This is when they start to be on like t-shirts and you have like hip-hop bugs and all that

[00:08:40] That was big when I was a kid too, right? You get this sort of like long t-shirt wanted the jackets remember the Jackets yeah, like with like I wanted a Marvin the Martian denim jacket

[00:08:51] You're wearing the coolest Marvin is Marvin the Martian the coolest. We had them on every man Yes, we had a Marvin mug That was a big thing was like I would get like boring dad stuff for my dad for his birthday with Looney Tunes on it

[00:09:02] Like here's a stapler and it's Sylvester or I think that was a letter opener He had the Marvin mug there were like all those kinds of thing Then I should mention is wearing like a denim jacket that is only missing the Looney Tunes

[00:09:15] WB store embroidery, but otherwise looks I haven't seen him turn around so I don't know Granny isn't on the back. You could sew something on a barnyard dog. You could go deep cut Interesting. No, I'm pure as much as a purest Marvin baby or task. I love task

[00:09:33] Is your favorite too? Yeah, you're good for I feel like yeah, he makes a mess You were also he's aggressive but not mean I was gonna say you are somewhat Taz like as a child

[00:09:43] You were very like you had a lot of energy and you were very physical true And you always were sort of like the joke I make

[00:09:51] Is that when you were like a child if there was like something boring going on you would start playing sports against an imaginary opponent? Like you would like practice moves or some or you know or babysitter, right? I mean, yes

[00:10:04] No, if there was someone to play against you would play against and you had like a basketball Did you have the game? Yes. I did or any other MBA? I mean I played a lot of NBA Jam That's just my NBA Jam NBA live you definitely

[00:10:17] Remember Michael Jordan was not an NBA live too. He's out nor an NBA Jam, right? Yeah No, he would not license it because he held out Yes, well he was in we had the space Jam computer game that was mostly like an NBA Jam clone

[00:10:29] But then in the halftimes or in between quarters there were mini games where you played as Wayne night and you would play that And then I'd wait for the Wayne night and I go okay

[00:10:37] Hand me the keyboard and then it would be like Wayne night trying to find Michael's secret stuff or whatever. That's really cute Yeah, but that was available on DOS, right? It was a DOS game and it was like pretty much just a straight NBA Jam type thing

[00:10:51] Except with cartoon care. Yeah, right? That's a big part of the merchandising I think too is Michael Jordan was so right the most merchandise athlete of the 90s, right?

[00:11:00] And the looney tunes were so merchandise that it was like we're gonna put them together and this is just money This just paints money. It prints it the surprise here though is probably the soundtrack, right? Which is like the garden state of sports moves this soundtrack

[00:11:14] You know, I mean we can look up the charts, but I would imagine This I feel like this is probably one of the ten best-selling elements of the 90s truly right? No, don't be crazy

[00:11:26] Went six times platinum, which is pretty good. Yeah, nowhere near. I mean there are a lot of diamond albums Yes huge album was huge it was huge but I feel like for you guys it was like

[00:11:44] Seismic it was like because I understand I get it I get it because we were talking last night David You and I in preparation for this episode. We were seeing bad times at the L Royale, which we both agree pretty good time

[00:11:57] At the L Royale decent like a decent fun time Yeah, well, I'll right out a little long but like an enjoyable enough time at the L Royale and You were like it's weird that James liked Space Jam that much because he must have hated Jordan

[00:12:09] I asked if James and I can ask James directly now It was a Knicks fan because I was talking about how much I hated Michael Jordan when I was a kid Because I was a diehard Knicks fan and he was that my he was the monster

[00:12:23] I hated him we'd run into him every year in the playoffs and he would destroy us He was the Nancy Meyers of his time. I was a Knicks fan Sure still am sure but I was four years old when this movie came out

[00:12:35] And I think when you're that age and you're a sports fan, it's just you're not you're not hating it No, I totally understand right I had had because I was ten when this movie came out and I had had

[00:12:46] Like now probably watch started watching the Knicks in like the early 90s like three or four solid years of like Jordan Just annihilating like you know and I like I never I always had obviously like I knew he was good

[00:12:58] I wasn't out there saying like Michael Jordan is overrated look at the numbers I was just I just couldn't stand him and so I Would instead what what what I was saying was when LeBron came around sure in the next decade

[00:13:14] Yeah, I was like I'm not missing out on this guy. I want to enjoy it exactly I can't spend another this is my you know the NBA is my sport I can't spend another generation hating its best player Yes

[00:13:24] I mean you were young at the time and Jordan was like Superman where it was just exciting to see a guy be that I mean he was Jordan to my mind is only comparable to Ali in American

[00:13:36] I agree with that. Yeah, I'm trying to think of like anyone who could possibly compare LeBron My argument is I don't care about sports and I cared about Michael Jordan at the time because it felt like a seismic cultural event

[00:13:46] When he was at the top of his game and LeBron is like everyone knows that guy's cool And he's good at basketball. Yeah, I mean it's hard It's hard to compare to you because you know to that point like when I was four

[00:13:57] You know, I'm a big sportsman, but I wasn't like looking like oh well like Jordan actually like shooting the three not that good He was a superhero right right and so it's and and so it's like the perspective on LeBron is so much different

[00:14:08] The error thing was one of the best pieces of branding of all time because it literally made him seem otherworldly It was like this like met a human thing. That's what this movie is playing off

[00:14:17] But the other thing is the fact that he was the first guy to license himself like crazy be the spokesman for a thousand things

[00:14:23] It was like even if you didn't watch sports or like me and you sat in the background and asked when the game was gonna be over He was so omnipresent and there weren't other athletes doing that as much. There was no cynicism

[00:14:34] Right when I turn on TV now I see a bunch of spokespeople who I don't know and someone in the room is like oh that guy's like the fifth most successful Like defense of player in the NBA and I'm like, I don't know

[00:14:45] Right and he's like the the spokesman for Coca-Cola. Oh sure. Well, you have the endorsement thing We're right. Well the NBA is more important now. Yes. Well like Jordan helped bring that along right where it's now

[00:14:55] Right kind of seismic, but the other thing is you have traditionally always been I want to say contrarian But you never love the dominant player the dominant team

[00:15:06] The the thing I say like define your personality when you were younger is like when you were in middle school going to School in New York City You were like a kid who'd wear red sock shirts and hats all the time

[00:15:16] I learned to hate the Yankees right because everybody loved Right, you know if you I mean if you consider yourself like a real sports fan Like it's easy at that age to be like oh that thing that everyone thinks is good, right?

[00:15:29] You know I got news for you But you always liked underdogs you like sort of yeah off the beaten path your favorite team in any franchise and the history of Sports is the Tennessee volunteers right like you've never been the superstar guy

[00:15:40] But Jordan at this age like you used to stick your tongue out all the time because you want to be like Michael Still do right. Yeah, it's like a learned habit. It's like Ryan Gosling's like Brooklyn accent

[00:15:51] Yeah, it's like a thing you tried to affect that now you can't drop I can't I was you know taking notes for this when you concentrate you stick your tongue right yeah

[00:15:59] And that was like it was that he was the the guy you know he's the guy and for me You know our mother was very protective in terms of what we could watch sure and she thought all

[00:16:10] Current day cartoon shows in the early 90s were too violent and cynical I mean yeah, so most of what she let me watch Were Looney Tunes cartoons which are the most violent and cynical things ever made they are they're also yeah

[00:16:25] They're they're like shooting someone in the face and going like I think he deserved that yeah But I watched them all the time because that was all Cartoon Network had so like Bugs Bunny was kind of my Michael Jordan

[00:16:35] And I was like a weird kid who would mimic all of Bugs Bunny's behaviors like there's I might have told this story But they're One of the racist Bugs Bunny shorts that they don't show anymore

[00:16:51] Uh-huh where a bunch of really uncomfortable African tribesmen characters try to cook him alive Sure, there's a bit where they lure him into the big Because they're like oh it's a bath sure and he does this whole routine

[00:17:07] Bath routine I would have to I would only get into the bath replicating Awful out the window been like look we got another kid like hopefully this one will work out better Here is just even if that was more abnormal

[00:17:22] We were both replicating the behaviors of our idols who were Bugs Bunny and Michael Jordan right except yours was you couldn't take a bath Without being Bugs Bunny or racist Correct mine was a successful I've written some bad assays, okay

[00:17:42] From the present so this won't get about 96. Yes, you're saying you were four I was fine in Griff what month did this movie just November November Yeah, you were so I was you know I was going on five. I was seven going on eight

[00:17:55] Toy Story had come out a year before and that had been my that was your movie You're like I like the cinema now right? I mean I was always a movie kid

[00:18:03] But it was just like oh I own this now and I feel like there was the run up to the move I remember we still shared a bedroom at this point in time and you had the space-jam poster on the wall months before the movie came out

[00:18:13] I knew it was in like a sports illustrated for kids or whatever Right, and you put it up and you just would like a like point to it and go like that's gonna be mine. Let's go We're ready

[00:18:24] You were saying you didn't remember seeing in theaters, but we 100% well I didn't yeah I think my I mean my my memory is just watching the VHS, but I'm sure we did where did you see it?

[00:18:34] I want to say we saw it at the Lincoln Square, maybe I can't remember vividly. I think it was maybe the Lincoln Square But it was like a big big deal and then it was like a six-month frenzy of just buying anything space-jam related

[00:18:49] Wow, they had us they had us on the really big And and the action figures for this movie between basketball and racism Love Slavery let's admit this is a movie about I'm blinking a battle against slavery sure right well indentured

[00:19:06] They literally say slaves well they can say what they wanted Let me correct myself. Elmer Fudd says slavery He does gonna sell us into slavery I guess so it's very we'll talk about the cause I was just gonna say the action figures of this film

[00:19:23] It was like you'd get a basketball player and a looney Tune And so it was literally like we get the parents to buy it for us and we'd like split the packaging

[00:19:30] You know there was like something of like this movie was like a breaking of the bread for two kids who usually like different things Yeah, I saw this film at the Barbican cinema, which was an a theater in London

[00:19:45] Okay, so you're on holiday. No, you're not doing the bit again You're correct. We're not doing the bit because we have retired It's up in the rafters along with Jordan Strozzi. So I just want to say you were on holiday and I hope you agree with that

[00:19:58] You're just doing the bit again. I'm not doing the bit you are the bits retired The bit was that you would say I was on vacation if I brought up England that was a core part of the bit

[00:20:07] You're just doing it, which is why I'm saying holiday. It's different. It's not part of the retired bit It's enough enough already I think we'll find a new angle on it, but yeah David you you seem like something's

[00:20:26] Troubling you would you mind speaking on that? Oh, I've just been thinking about talk space It's this online therapy company. It lets you message a licensed therapist from anywhere at any time

[00:20:38] It's just really been weighing on me that how all you need is a computer with an internet connection or the talk space mobile app To improve your mental health even if you've had trouble making time for it in the past interesting

[00:20:48] Can you expand on that? Well, so if you can imagine like fitting therapy into your life Like you know obviously rather than having to go to an office to make appointments

[00:20:59] Cut out time in your schedule for it with talk space. You just have to send your therapist a message You can get something off your chest whenever you need to you can talk about everyday challenges at work

[00:21:07] Talk about life. There's no extra commutes. No leaving the offices. No judgments and it's just about venting your innermost thoughts or I whatever you want to talk about and what is Joanna think of this? I mean we've talked about it humble breath she

[00:21:26] She thinks they're practical everyday strategies for stress management a living happier life that like having a therapist can help you with And talk space just like connects you to someone to talk to right away

[00:21:37] Rather than you know having to carve out a specific hour in the week to go and see them at an office And do you feel like when you're talking to talk space professionals? You wish that you had a promo code well the talk space platform has

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[00:22:10] Promo code check talkspace.com slash check and do you think this is anything to do with a sense of sexual inadequacy? Certainly, I mean that's a topic number one. Cool. That's our time

[00:22:25] I saw it the Barbican would do like children's screenings every Saturday and I would go every Saturday no matter what Like sometimes they'd have a new movie I guess if there was no new movie

[00:22:35] They just show like the railway children they show some classic movie and I saw this movie And I thought it was good and that was kind of that for me. Yeah, I probably didn't see it again for like 10 years

[00:22:44] I saw this movie on VHS for the first time on a porch. I thought he's about to say yesterday and Port it was a porch so it wasn't really heated so I remember being kind of a cool autumn afternoon

[00:22:59] Is it a fall porch? What but where was the TV? She didn't like put the VHS in the porch Was this a video drum house? There's a TV on the porch too of course of your home No, this is that my friend Tim's house. Damn

[00:23:17] Timmy oh we got into some real trouble obvious yeah, it's like you know when I had a friend We'd like play Super Nintendo and then Ben had a friend they'd like Rob groceries

[00:23:31] Kids we put a stick into your spokes so you flew off your bike with the Bay American terrorist who are we talking about? No, I don't want to say his last game. We're not on good terms anymore. Oh

[00:23:42] Interesting. Oh, what happened when did you and Tim break apart? What a we got to a big fight Okay, like last year or right after the porch Is in high school, okay? Were you like dude like it's fucked up that you watch movies on a porch

[00:24:00] It's about a girl The Ben Hosley story was about Lola Bonnie they clearly the story your setting is this happened right after watching You know Lola bunny is a girl. There's some subtle References that you can sort of figure it out. I've seen the movie ten times now

[00:24:16] And I think I finally figured it out but otherwise a girl well There's so much To her character outside of her gender that sometimes you forget even you you start not seeing gender Is this the first gender fluid? This is the first Cartoon character. Yeah

[00:24:32] How many like female looney tunes are there very few I'm like of the classic Yeah, because Tweety is male everyone always thinks that Tweety's female right because he has a high voice not In terms of prominent characters. I mean this is why Lola was created

[00:24:46] There's like granny who own Sylvester in Tweety. I know and that's when granny's in this you're like Did they literally just like sort of think like we kind of need some more like yeah, there's witch hazel

[00:24:56] Who's a sometimes antagonist to Bugs Bunny? I mean there are no core characters who are female There were other like Petunia pig They would sometimes introduce his porkey's girlfriend who was just mostly as a marketing thing so they could have

[00:25:10] Characters to put on female merchandise if he had a female You're thinking of Daisy duck. I feel like in the Disney world. Yes. Oh damn. Yeah, because the Disney would always have the

[00:25:21] The Minnie Mouse Daisy duck right like this sort of the female right and Petunia was kind of the daisy of the world But Lola was introduced for this because when you'd go to the Warner Brothers store

[00:25:29] It'd be a lot of pink Tweety shit because they were like that's the closest thing we have to a female So Lola they were like we need a girl character shaking my head. Here's the pitch. She's a girl

[00:25:38] What's the rest of it dads want to fuck her because she's the most sexualized Everyone like drops their jaw. I know she's like Jessica Rabbit Right, but that movie like the joke is that she's very sexy right and also that movie is a little more grown-up than yeah

[00:25:56] I mean no offense to space jam. It's not the most grown-up movie in the world Not the most no I'd say closer is probably the most closer my dinner with Andre

[00:26:07] All right space jam so we all saw it yes in theaters except for Ben who saw it on a porch on a porch when a man he would later porch jam Falling out with over a girl. We're possibly loaded by me not confirmed

[00:26:25] Yeah, so this movie starts with what was I Mean correct me from wrong your favorite scene I remember you rewinding the opening scene over and over and over again with his dad

[00:26:36] It's an important scene it is an important scene well it is his motto was be like Mike and the the film starts with Basically the message you know You go out back take couple shots, right? It was an early version of the secret

[00:26:51] You know if you if you call what you're gonna do in the future and then you hit ups Yeah, I had buckets some shots The dad played by Paul Walker supervisor in the first two Fast and Furious Tom Barry. He's like

[00:27:06] It was good to see him to he's very young and fit in this movie. Yes. He yeah, he's interesting going going sorry No, he's pretty virile and You know he's got a great scene in like an early West Wing

[00:27:20] He you know he'll pop up in like a TV show and just kind of like kill a scene I just say I watched too fast recently and I was like why isn't this guy in all the Fast and Furious movies?

[00:27:29] Like he he's so good as the like here's the mission, you know, right, right, but this film which Important context this movie is like trying to offer a narrative around the death of Michael Jordan's father

[00:27:43] Michael Jordan's retirement from basketball into minor league baseball in his return to the NBA Like this movie is like we're gonna come up with a clear alibi that everyone can agree on

[00:27:54] And this narrative narrative print the legend is how I would describe this is what you'll tell your children Michael Jordan who as we know is he's from North Carolina Walmingsen He went to school. He went to the University of North Carolina

[00:28:09] The famous legend that he didn't make his high school basketball He was born in Brooklyn, but yeah right because in his hall of fame speech He was like fuck that guy You know he like read a laundry list of like everybody ever wronged him

[00:28:20] But isn't it just that he didn't make varsity as like a freshman? Maybe He was too short as a sophomore and then then he became the star of the junior team, but I was on a team

[00:28:34] But his narrative I think was like that rejection probably like fueled his mania I mean when we were kids. He was just seen as like he was the best. He was a killer

[00:28:44] This is the whole thing here too because part of that alibi they try to provide for Michael Jordan is not just that he You know was playing some baseball. It was basically he became suburban right, right? They're pulling the minivan up to the this nice little colonial house

[00:29:01] Yeah, right and the kids are running out and none of the kids even know who Michael Jordan is right I mean they're the kids are one out like oh, it's like you know, it's Jeffery's dad Right yeah, right and the other element to that Flat front

[00:29:17] The dogs running out it's a real statement of intent to open with the scene with the dad because it's like hey You're sitting there and as children we weren't thinking this but if you watch this movie as an adult

[00:29:26] You're like this is crazy that they're bringing his dad into this film. No, it's crazy Right recently died He was I want to get set James Jordan. He was Killed in 1993 so a few years ago He was shot to death

[00:29:43] By car jackers like I believe was the official like diagnosis of what had happened and then Right after that pretty much Michael Jordan retires from basketball, right now After winning three championships in a row the circumstances of his death were always kind of weird sure and

[00:30:00] What has come to light later is Michael Jordan had serious gambling problems for a number of years All right, and we're gonna leave it right No, no, no Perhaps he was encouraged to step away

[00:30:13] Long-running MBA conspiracy theory probably like you know that people like Bill Simmons will talk about right? Yeah, David Stern the commissioner told him like all this gambling shit It's gonna come to light like you are essentially banned from the NBA for a couple years

[00:30:26] You need to clean up so that it doesn't repeat rose for us because we can't have our brightest star tarnish and so he goes off to Play baseball but his the owner of the Bulls never cancelled his contract

[00:30:37] Like he was oh, he was still a bull sort of plays minor league so it's he's still kind of well He played minor league as he was bad, right? Okay, but Because one thing that's immediately clear about the movie is there they're gonna shit on Michael Jordan's baseball

[00:30:52] They are they're right everyone is laughing. I mean the catcher is telling him what pitches are coming I mean they make Michael like Couldn't get catch up to that one

[00:31:00] One of the things you would die laughing at as a kid was the bit where he gets back into the dugout And all the guys are telling him how good his strikeout was like when you fail you make fail and look good

[00:31:10] I wish I could fail like you Michael and now ESPN produced a documentary about Michael Jordan playing baseball in which it is posited that Michael Jordan actually Displayed a fair bit of promise as a baseball. I mean he was

[00:31:22] You're absolutely right. He played double a baseball and like hit home runs and had not played baseball in true Was not even I mean, I don't know I mean my impression is that he was not even like some hot shot baseball prospect out of high school

[00:31:37] I don't know. I don't think so because a lot of other than that was his dad It always wanted him to play a lot of athletes will get drafted to play baseball at high school and go pro another sport

[00:31:45] And maybe you know, you know those sort of flirt with baseball later in life or something like that That was not the case here. I mean he was basically saying This extraordinary athleticism that I have in this drive, right, you know could that translate to

[00:31:58] Bo Jackson was he before He was before Yeah, just before I mean, you know, I mean everyone's always said the Bronn would have been a good running back or what I like

[00:32:11] You know, he's probably got the body for football or something running back as you know, maybe not running back like but It wasn't Jordan wasn't they hit on him also that the strike zone was tough with him because he was so tall

[00:32:22] Well, that's it's that's the that perspective is sort of crazy because he you know Michael Jordan on a basketball court doesn't seem that Part of his appeal he's a shooting guy, right But he you're right. I don't want to shit on him too much. I mean the numbers

[00:32:37] He had 200 and double a he hadn't played baseball in 213 with three homers and 51 RBI I'd like to see the splits too because the narrative is that he started hitting a lot better towards the end of

[00:32:49] So, yeah, you know maybe he would have figured it out, but he was also like Like I just wonder how that conversation went when they were developing this movie where they were like Are we allowed to just kind of make fun of the baseball thing or not?

[00:33:15] And he obviously said have at it Okay, so We all agree without drawing larger conclusions that he was at a time where his image was in danger, right? No, no, no, I'm saying in terms of in terms of the stuff that didn't become public that

[00:33:33] That there was a scene is to his personal life that could have okay So I in a sense, you know, he could have in retrospect 20 years later He could have ceased to become no exact

[00:33:45] That we all know but his career would have been I want to step away from In no, but in 1995 Michael Jordan releases the greatest press release in the history of press releases two words I'm back. Yeah, literally the whole world melts down with happiness

[00:34:03] All they wanted was for him to be back and like when he came back it was like it was so huge Everyone was still worshiping at the feet of Michael Jordan

[00:34:10] Can you let me offer my hypothesis which doesn't negate what you just said? I mean it was yes go on Okay gambling stuff swirling around yeah, right they go hey maybe step away for a little bit

[00:34:21] So much of his image is based in him as a spokesperson that he can't totally disappear off the grid for a little time So it's like right so it's like let me move to a different sport

[00:34:30] Let me stay in the news cycle be discussed in this kind of way Try to get my life back together a little more clean it up

[00:34:36] So I come back to basketball and when I come back to basketball people are gonna be twice as excited as when I was previously playing There it's possible that you know also I would like to just put I'm not saying this is accurate

[00:34:47] But to put out the narrative the most generous narrative possible Michael Jordan. This is someone who? You know did not have I mean was successful as a player But did not have a lot of postseason success early on in his career. They could never beat the pistons, right?

[00:35:01] As we know is a fanatic Sleep Mars yeah, they were the bad boys Rodman was definitely on was a grant grant yes grant yes No Later You're right in 91 he breaks through the pistons finally he gets to the mountaintop Yeah, when's the title we all know this David

[00:35:39] He's like I can just keep winning titles and then his dad dies yeah, and it's just like you know what? Maybe he knows all this is just you know one possible extension Maybe I was along he's like if I if I keep going out

[00:35:50] I'm not gonna be able to hit my level cuz at that point you're just competing with yourself He did say his dad's murder was a part of it And then later I have a little bit of gambling info I can give you

[00:36:01] But go on to competing with yourself and you're competing with history. Yes Yeah, he says I gotta be a 10 all the time There's a candy bit of brand management here in terms of making sure he retains his value

[00:36:13] Is it maybe took Kobe Bryant about six months after he? Possibly raped a woman to be back in in ads and yes He'd be the you know top place and he is was not Michael Jordan as much as he close enough

[00:36:26] Emulated Michael Jordan. He's not Michael Jordan. That's why I'm saying yes I think the big thing was they didn't even want things getting out I think he I think he saved a haircut no pun intended exactly he saved any sort of

[00:36:39] I mean he was famous for there's so many stories and there's about to be this espn serve oj Simpson Like in the style of the oj Simpson thing like 10 hour documentary about Jordan and I imagine he's gonna

[00:36:51] Apparently has full access to him and we'll maybe delve a little more into this stuff Which is one hour is just on the Hitler mustache and the Yeah, but um that like you know NBA players play cards all the time especially on the planes

[00:37:04] They like to play cards and if you play cards with him He would just be like Merciless like there was just no friendliness. He just wanted to annihilate everything for you know in the context of this film He's also famous for having ruined

[00:37:18] Mugsie Bogues's jump shot one's calling him a midget as he was about to shoot and mugs He didn't want to shoot anymore. That's like baseball I'm done shooting that that scared me so much

[00:37:30] I'm not even gonna get in that position but that's why it was kind of amazing at the time the reputation was like Michael Jordan, I'd buy underwear from Sweden And there's an important point to be made he is he's probably the last athlete

[00:37:44] Where there would not be a simultaneous counter narrative about oh well I heard from someone who know that was not out That's the only reason I offer my hypothesis because I think there's no way he could have lost everything

[00:37:55] But he was so at the top in terms of his use at competing with himself if he steps away He makes sure that the excitement only grows when he comes back rather than just having a couple seasons where he is Plateauing yes, it was owing at the top

[00:38:07] It worked people liked him growing and the other it was so good for his yes Did you take that step away and then come back everyone was just like oh my god?

[00:38:14] He's back. Thank God like you know he had started getting spotted at casinos, which is when like they were like Well, he was famously spotted at casino the night before like an important game not not even I think it was like a playoff game

[00:38:27] And there are stories now that people tell where they're like I once won a million and a half dollars for him from him on the golf course Sure like he would like make bets per hole, but he's he's very wealthy

[00:38:38] One of the wealthiest people alive. He's quite wealthy The other thing I was gonna say though is I think part of the pitch of this movie is okay So now he's back Michaels bigger than ever

[00:38:48] We want to make a movie to explain that whole time period sell it as part of this family man Why did he leave the NBA because he loved his dad so much and he made a promise

[00:38:57] And he wanted to buy a mini then and he was back home and he was with the kids and all of that It was all about the family right it was all about the family

[00:39:04] But the other part is the first 30 minutes of this movie are really focused on the baseball and the family Yes, they're Jordan. It's all George And I forgot how much it is just sort of like of the era studio sports comedy before the loon tunes come in

[00:39:17] It's like let's make major league with him failing But he's an underdog and it's kind of sweet and uplifting right so that because he looked like a shitty bad baseball player

[00:39:25] Because he was the most dominant NBA player of all time when he showed up in baseball and he was pretty good It looked disappointing. He wasn't good. He was We already it wasn't it was impressive. He wasn't good. He could play baseball

[00:39:38] My point is though if they make the movie part of this like oh, it's like nice and sweet that he tried to play baseball He tried really hard. It sells it as he never had a dip He was always the best even when he wasn't dominating the league

[00:39:50] He was the best guy well and can I say something? I think if you shut this movie off 30 minutes in you say What movies are you gonna make next? I think he's really good agree

[00:40:00] You're pointing at me like I don't agree with you. I agree. He's good. Yeah I think he's good in this movie some people like when LeBron just announced that he's making space to him, too

[00:40:09] I saw some snarky tweets along the lines of like well, he's definitely a better actor than Michael Jordan Now I think I agree with that because LeBron was very good and trainwrecked like he definitely legitimately good act He's obviously got talent

[00:40:20] But like I do feel like Michael Jordan's reputation in this movie is that he is Stiff or bad or what? You know like he's kind of a I think it I think it flips a bit When he's acting with people it's an impossible

[00:40:34] Especially in 96 like what was it like you know We'll talk about it There were established actors who have belly flopped as hard doing these types of like movies like this Like you watch the first Garfield movie and no one knows how to touch Garfield

[00:40:47] You know like shit like that and that's all professional actors I think when he doesn't have anyone to play off of but he had done so many commercials at this time and Joe

[00:40:54] Pica who ostensibly directed this movie was his main commercial guy. Yeah, like he's in a zone He understands he knows his brand and he was understated too in the first 30 minutes He was funny but understated and the other thing is he looked amazing

[00:41:16] He's like Marlene a detrait telling you he's a good-looking guy. He looks really good And they play that scene where he's eating fast food in the hotel with Wayne Knight. He is shirtless Yeah, no he that is they know he is but I'll say this about Michael Jordan

[00:41:31] He's one of those people that is so famous that when you see him It's partly you're like yeah, this is a good-looking guy. He's in shape yada yada But you're also just kind of like wow that's Michael Jordan

[00:41:42] It's like that's a stamp he had such a notorious profile like literally just literally well It's almost like if you're in a relationship with someone for a long time Like it's not the same as when you first Michael First time I heard someone say Michael Jordan was handsome

[00:42:04] One of the reasons he was so big was he was just like a perfectly symmetrical man, would you say that? Michael Jackson or Michael Jordan who was the more famous person at this time at this time Jordan Jordan right his peak Jackson

[00:42:18] Yeah, I think at this time you would probably say Jordan just because Jackson was Yeah He was such a world superstar he was the way the NBA You know marketed itself around Any other countries up until he became a guy. Oh okay pretty much

[00:42:39] I was gonna say you're saying how famous he was and and his profile was famous and all of that The craziest flex of like Jordan's power was the Michael Jordan cologne

[00:42:48] Which at the time everyone thought was a joke sold so fucking well and the logo for that bottle was his head from front on In silhouette and you recognized it. It was just a bald head with ears and a neck and you were like that's Michael Jordan's head

[00:43:01] Right, it wasn't even in profile the bridge of his nose or anything Like it was insane how much the iconography of him as a person was ingrained in this is also This is not as big as the cologne

[00:43:13] But also today's earlier point for a guy who spent his entire career kicking the shit out of the Knicks Yeah, just open a steakhouse in New York. There's like I want that guy's steaks Yeah, I mean and he did kick the show the next he did whatever man

[00:43:30] We you know John Stark stunked on him and that's like one of the greatest moments in my entire life Of course, I know when I was there with you and that's an important Michael Jordan retired

[00:43:37] The Knicks go to the finals the Knicks go to the finals, but then we lose Fucking rockets and like that was like the most devastating moment of my life And then how are the Knicks these days I mean they're like they're horrible

[00:43:52] Let's let Griffin take this. No, I think we can say it in unison sure They're very bad, but they are committing at least to being bad Rebuilding slowly Giving me that line before but at least it seems like But we're still allegedly but you know lunatic owns us

[00:44:15] The Knicks are hoping they can get enough good young players and they can keep their owner Enough just sort of playing music at City Winery and not be playing at City Winery They can attract an established star to come play with their young guys

[00:44:27] We need an established star Can I actually talk for a second? So I have this theory Jim I think that everyone in the NBA just does what the Bron does like the bron just sets the pattern every single time

[00:44:37] So when he builds his super team people become into super teams, right? Everyone's into super teams. I like he goes back to Cleveland And there's that whole narrative of like oh, maybe should you know should people go back to their hometowns?

[00:44:47] Is there the hometown narrative and now these go to the Lakers the new narrative in my opinion is like you need to Rebuild the solid gold franchises That's why Durant and Irving are all being attached to the Knicks I agree

[00:45:01] Let's put I would I would say it as I think LeBron gives everyone else permission to do what they already want to do So right they don't exactly he does the things that people

[00:45:12] But I am I gonna get hammered for doing this and he does it and now everyone's like well Yeah, I'm everywhere. I feel like if someone like Durant Irving goes to the Knicks You'd have to be Durant Irving

[00:45:22] Like it would be a lot it would be implausible because the Knicks are back could never see it and they're horribly run But he could give that argument of like look the Knicks are so important to the NBA

[00:45:30] I want to I want to be the guy who makes them good again Like can I say this people will buy that people never used to buy that Emotionally, I agree with you. I actually don't think it's implausible. I think we're so ashamed of ourselves

[00:45:43] I think we just feel really bad about ourselves and we think My face also like it's like if say Kyrie came he'll just like get injured His limbs will be splattered It's better than it was

[00:46:00] It's definitely so rock bottom like training for Bargnani that was that was my rock bottom with I will just I will just finish this There is a there's a dumb narrative Mostly forwarded by the local sports press in New York that you can't rebuild in New York

[00:46:13] Oh, the fans won't do it. They won't do it. Of course. They'll do it They're just they're obsessive and if you give them any sort of hope they love it

[00:46:20] I know that's sort of seen as a disappointment the domestic box office when you look at the actual production costs It's pretty good We talk about basketball, we're all talking about the exact same things. Yeah, no definitely So first 30 minutes, I think pretty good domestic sports comedy

[00:46:39] You got Joe Pica who was like the dominant commercial director of his time right Joe Pica Who like won the DGA lifetime achievement award a year ago never made another feature hated he'd made one movie before this Oh really?

[00:46:53] What was it let me find the name of it let it ride Richard Dreyfus Terry Gar, what was that? 1989 okay, so some time in between it's a light comedy about a guy a gambler who experiences day Where he wins every bet he places?

[00:47:11] Oh, and then he met Michael Jordan and my mother was like big fan of your movie. I like that movie. Yeah It was a good movie teach me Alright, so Joe Pica right directed all the Jordan commercials when other basketball players started going into sponsorship I

[00:47:26] In re-watching the movie for this podcast I chose to watch it with commentary which I had never done before and the commentary for this movie is Insane really is it by Pica? This is early days of DVD when I think they're still experimenting. Okay the commentary is

[00:47:41] Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck but also Billy West and diva Bradley Baker who played the voices of bunny and duck in this movie But also they're like, yeah, sometimes this guy joke Pica's gonna come in and say something It's clear that they recorded a commentary track with Pica

[00:48:01] And he didn't have enough to say to fill up the entire movie which is only 71 minutes. No long movie. So then they recorded West and Baker doing bits as the characters and that also didn't sustain itself

[00:48:14] So the voice actors host it and every once in a while they literally do Hey, uh, it's Joe Pica again And then he offers a fact and they act like he's walking in and out of the studio

[00:48:27] For the commentary to get into really dry. So you're telling me that you did the foley work on this director's comment It sounds like me doing a dumb fucking bit and he comes in and just talks about compositing Hello, uh, hello, it's me Daffy duck great Sure

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[00:51:14] You can try it for a month day. Oh, maybe we and now it is me pep a lapio get out of here. Okay. Yeah, you're not welcome here Okay, and I just want to quickly remind any animation producers listening to this podcast to hire me for no reason

[00:51:28] whatsoever so the commentary is insane And uh, Joe picca when he uh occasionally walks in we'll talk about how he's best friends with every basketball player in the movie Because he worked with all of them previously and at the very beginning of the commentary

[00:51:42] He goes uh people ask me so you directed this movie and I say uh parts of it Weird because he didn't direct the animation. Oh, okay, and also I think Ivan Reibing kind of took over this moment interesting

[00:51:54] Um the first 30 minutes definitely feel like they're directed by a commercial director because it has that thing where like every single shot Is the most dynamic shot imaginable like a lot of canted angles

[00:52:04] And like extreme wide lens close-ups. Okay, like it looks like a commercial. It's very like yeah Yeah, it's very colorful colorful and those scenes of him like you're saying like returning to his home Like in the dog and stuff that just feels like mtv video shit or like

[00:52:20] You're about to be sold a board game or something and a lot of like snappy comedy Like everyone he talks to is some day player who's like rare and to go

[00:52:28] The guy's in the dugout. I mean wainight obviously is like a ringer and can we talk about that for a second? Yeah Do you think wainight auditioned for this or is that an off-roading?

[00:52:37] That's a straight off because you have to think at this point wainight was running the table on the 90s Yeah, because he's he's late in science fell

[00:52:46] Right, well, yeah, dress apart right then he's on Seinfeld and mad about not mad about you a third rock from the sun Yeah, he's on both of them at the same time. Well third rock starts this year. Okay, 96, but yes

[00:52:57] He's huge. I think they wrote like we want think wainight in This is And you know, I mean he is number two on the call sheet no doubt no question Right because he's third build in the movie behind jordan and bunny, but bunny is first built

[00:53:14] In the opening credits. Yeah in the poster it was swapped No, it wasn't bug's bunny michael jordan Bug's bunny is top build which is in my opinion weird Yeah two reasons one michael jordan very famous and a real person

[00:53:28] I think jordan's number one of the credits thing because I know he's not and and and number two Uh jordan's in more of the movie like that that's the real beef. I have with it

[00:53:38] There's another argument for jordan being first build was is that he's an actual person I mentioned that yes very famous real person right those things going for him But also like bugs doesn't come in for a while and this is a short movie

[00:53:51] Yeah, this is a very short movie. It's not a long movie quite short It's like a one real because this is a movie like if it was a real sports movie Like if it was Hoosiers, they would play a lot of games. They would suck at first

[00:54:01] Not only is this a short movie, but there is an hour of setup right so then there's a game So if you watch the first hour you'd like this might be like a two and a half hour movie

[00:54:08] Right because they're gonna have to like play a season or something They're gonna get in there and you know I timed it. They're gonna practice. They're gonna be like Yeah, I want this. I'm the one no. I'm the one, you know all that Hoosiers shit

[00:54:17] Yeah, I literally timed it from the moment when they finish Introducing the players at the big game to when it's halftime is five minutes Five minutes elapsed in the first half of the game Well because honestly the the monsters are kind of dramatically inert because they're just like

[00:54:33] Big monsters that crush you at basket like it's like they're not that interesting to watch if they're just beating you Has any line Summed up our podcast better than I mean, let's be honest. The monsters are dramatically inert Uh, yeah, there's a great line by me

[00:54:47] Yeah, no, they're just dominant and so it's like the only once they figure out how to beat them the movies over So like the game is mostly a series of like blackout gags of them getting beaten

[00:54:59] Well, I was gonna say isn't it interesting that they had to go steal mba player's talent just so that they could beat the Shit out of looney tins. They do not play basketball. They do not play basketball at all. No, they just crushed me

[00:55:11] Why couldn't they just go get the talent of you know, well this is a strong person wwe wrestlers Or why not just hire the other players much as bugs hires Michael Jordan, but why not have them play basketball?

[00:55:25] I don't know you just see like I agree you don't know and you don't know which this movie is a failure as a Basketball movie in terms of like there's not a lot of fundamentals on something else. I noticed too. Yeah Michael Jordan playing basketball in this movie

[00:55:39] mediocre so so that looked like 60 percent at most Yeah, well, you know because just the way he was cutting the way he was dribbling that was not an intense

[00:55:48] And then you cut to the real footage of him at the end and he and he's playing you're like, oh, yeah Michael Jordan all right and you got the credits. Yes. I'm pulling it up right now

[00:55:56] The thing I wanted to say is that in this movie great opening credits just Point of fact. Yes. This was filmed in a summer in between seasons. Yeah, right Uh, this was right after the season. He had come back into late. Yes. He comes back in 1995

[00:56:12] Second building the opening credits I'm going backwards Michael Jordan. That's so weird. Why did I think of it the other way? Because the poster has it flipped. That's fine Well, that's how it should be. Uh-huh because Bugs Bunny

[00:56:26] Doesn't get as much screen time in this movie. Great. So that's good. Yes So why is Bugs Bunny force bill on the poster then? I mean look he had a better track record if the box off is at that point in time

[00:56:37] And better agents he had Mike ovits There's there's the forgotten end of 95 season where Jordan comes back right and they lose to the magic

[00:56:44] Like they don't even make the final right and they were hoping they could juice just at the end of the season to get to the championship And they don't right

[00:56:51] So he apparently had a big complex where he was like I need to really come back hard this season prove people I haven't lost a step Right, so he agrees to do this movie

[00:57:00] But on a very tight schedule, which is one of the reasons they wrote in the other basketball players Who he's stolen the power from so they had other live action actors They could cut to once he's in looney tune world right he would only shoot until lunch

[00:57:13] Right they built the soundstage, which is just a green screen space They had actors who were not the voice actors who sort of were improv actors who would play the parts against him

[00:57:23] And then they had really big stunt guys who'd play the monstars, but it wasn't real basketball, right? It was no it's like choreographed right exactly But they also largely a cartoon. It wasn't real basketball, right? I just want to clear up with you guys

[00:57:37] They actually just filmed a game. Yeah, it was just a regular game right. Yeah, they played the monstars, right? Yeah But the crazy thing is part of michael jordan's negotiation was They had to build a full proper regulation mba court on the Warner Brothers backlog

[00:57:52] Interesting because he needed to use any downtime. He had to practice right to practice Um, and he would go to the gym at lunch. Is that the the court we see no, okay No, the court you see in the movie is 100 cgi weird anytime. He's on the court

[00:58:08] It's him in a much smaller cgi space with actors, right? They built a full court that was never utilized on camera that was his contractual demand so that he could play ball And be ready for the season not miss a step

[00:58:19] So he would only work a couple hours a day Good for him But the other thing was any other actors who were working on movies at the Warner Brothers lot at that summer Where like this is my chance to play basketball against michael jordan

[00:58:30] So like famously like george cloney played against him when they were doing batman and robb But he would just murder you yeah, it's the thing. I think it like he wouldn't be like, oh, let me take it easy on you

[00:58:38] Because you're george cloney. No, he was like he was like training right? He just He's that kind of right. Yeah, but that was like the thing was like, oh my god I get my chance to say that like jordan dunked on me, you know

[00:58:48] Well, and that's part of what is going on with I assume With the casting of this film too. I mean murray says I want to be there Murray's part was not written into the script

[00:58:56] I should say my intel on all this is is yeah, please film draft a directed by evan rightman produced by joe magic His main partner This film was produced by rightman and rightman was really kind of a key creative force behind this movie once they had the idea

[00:59:10] Because it was there had his fingerprints all over. Yes, there had been a commercial with Bugs bunny and michael jordan that was a super bowl ad I believe yeah that did really well And then they were like oh fuck. Let's just make a movie out of that

[00:59:23] The 90s right and so That they were like we should make it actually funny. Let's get Ivan right man He's like the top comedy guy right now and they were sort of instrumental in overseeing all of it Right

[00:59:38] I about a year before this had started doing a routine where I would do an impression of the guy who piss Space ship. It's a good routine

[00:59:44] Which got me into the Montreal just for laughs festival in a very weird turn of events because I was not qualified to get in otherwise I hadn't done that much work And I wasn't performing regularly at any theaters or any of that

[00:59:54] But that routine ended up being kind of my entry into the industry Which then led to nine months later me getting cast in draft day Which I would say was a straight line in terms of me running off the momentum of having gotten into that festival

[01:00:06] Right. I was doing stand-up routines While filming draft day because I wasn't working every day. You became a sports based entertainer for about two to three years Yeah, right Um, but that was like my money bit

[01:00:18] Uh, I would try to get up and do like unpaid featured spots at the comedy clubs in Cleveland while we were filming draft day okay, and uh One day Joe magic producer comes To set leave set early to come see me

[01:00:30] Do my act which at the end ended with space jam as a closer and I was like, oh fuck. He's in the audience He's gonna be insulted by this right because the bit was it's a dude on a week long cocaine bender

[01:00:41] Who thinks he's about to be fired the stupidest idea in the world on the verge of a mental breakdown? And he just starts screaming and ripping his clothes off Uh and saying that he can get the movie produced by the next monday, right?

[01:00:52] Um, and it's just like stream of consciousness meltdown stuff And he came up to me afterwards and he went, uh, you know griffin I uh, I produced space jam

[01:01:01] And I was like, yeah, I know and he was like, I know the guy who pitched the movie and I was like, yeah, and he went pretty And I went out to drink with him for two and a half hours and just pumped him right right

[01:01:13] And one of the things he told me was murray was not written to the script at all Okay, they wanted the movie to be funnier Sure They had way night, which is the reason why the way night character was created which makes me think

[01:01:23] He's just falling over and stuff right big comedic, you know type of the time Okay, we want a little more comedy in here. Yeah, right men obviously very good friends with bill murray freaking collaborator He knows that murray is obsessed with basketball. He loves the bowls. Chicago guy

[01:01:39] Jordan up until this point right and he says look jordan likes golf You love golf. We're gonna do a golf scene. You come you improvise do whatever you want for just do some shit

[01:01:48] Right by the way in addition to gambling uh golf also a big part of a lot of the jordan Or like yes 36 holes before a game, you know for 16 in the first half his wrist is

[01:01:58] So right comes out in the second half figures it out wins, you know that's So they say hey murray you can come you can improvise for a day do whatever the fuck you want They end up getting a lot of usable stuff

[01:02:07] Which is why the golf sequence is so long because he has like four or five good bits and also larry bird is there Which is he's friends with jordan and picca had worked with i mean it was like this correlation of How do we feel about birds performance?

[01:02:18] Unbelievable I think it's good too. I do. I think it's really good. He's sort of like He's sort of playing into his image as well, which is sort of like the stiff like the kind of like

[01:02:28] Well and a little bit of I do not want to be here. Yeah You know murray's great line in this movie Which is like one of our big family jokes that we quote all the time murray keeps on pitching to everyone

[01:02:40] You know the mba is going through a crisis players are dropping left and right You're gonna need new talent from exciting and unexpected places and never keeps on going bill It's not gonna happen right he thinks he's gonna get drafted and uh michael rejects him

[01:02:53] And he goes is this because i'm white? And jordan goes no no larry's white and he goes michael larry's not white larry's clear It's a good line. It's great. No scripted dialogue no role for this film They shot that

[01:03:07] The end of the film the way they were going to beat the monsters was roadrunner Which is why roadrunner never takes the court the entire time. He's not in it. Yeah They were like they need some special thing to push them over the edge

[01:03:18] Which in a lot of way makes more sense than what happens because the monsters a massive massive lead Beating the shit out of the tunes and then stop beating the shit out of the tune

[01:03:27] They kind of keep the score a little secret. I feel like for this very reason like it right liek No, you cannot account. Yeah, you cannot keep track of the game in this

[01:03:35] They make a couple baskets and it's tied right we're down 60 but but you know roadrunner at least like all right You sit you're at halftime you're on the whiteboard. You say how do you know?

[01:03:44] How do we match up with them? Let's get roadrunner, you know one problem though. No hands does lack hands I guess he'd use his wings Beak or whatever

[01:03:54] All right. Yeah, just could run to another spot on the court and then you kind of like flip the ball to someone You kind of bounce it in right? Yeah The monsters are big and o fish so that was like one advantage

[01:04:04] They would have if they had like clear and they didn't want to bring speedy guns all back because he was Sensitive which is why I kicked him out of the studio immediately because I don't want that on my yes

[01:04:12] Sensitive is one word for it. Yes a sense of subject Um and at the last minute they were like, oh fuck, you know what we should do We should just have bill Murray come back

[01:04:20] Which is why roadrunner has almost no presence in the movie because he was designed to be saved for the end Right, they called him up. They were like, can you come tomorrow? Which is why Murray has that joke where they're like, how did you get here?

[01:04:31] And he's like producers or franny called me up had a teamster come drop me off here um They like the story the craziest element of production this movie was trying to get him a jersey overnight

[01:04:42] Because the only physical jerseys they had were the ones for jordan and he's Murray. I mean, I don't know his height Right different. I would say a different height than Michael jordan

[01:04:51] Probably the joke is that he's number 22 right that he's only one less right. He's you know what he's six two So he's not much shorter than he's not that much shorter than this is weird

[01:05:03] Chevy chase six four dan accurate six one those fnl guys are tall. So fun fact the difference in height between Bill Murray and Michael jordan, so if they were matched up yeah is equal

[01:05:14] To the difference in height basically between you and mugsie bogs and mugsie bogs played in the mba If you were guarding mugsie bogs, the line would be significant height advantage for griffin Well, that was our mother liked mugsie bogs because he was

[01:05:27] And this is so right, why don't we why don't we talk for a second about the other guys the other guys because You know in a way, I mean mugsie bogs was not one of the best players in the mba, but

[01:05:39] The thing that pica said was in terms of designing the cartoon monsters They wanted the greatest diversity of physical types. So it was supposed to be we'll have a couple big famous guys

[01:05:49] You know a tall guy stocky guy this and that but they knew they wanted a little guy and they wanted a big guy So mugsie was obvious because he hired the shortest and tallest people in the league No, you know who they hired

[01:06:00] George mirazan right who's the same height as shan bet and what happened is George mirazan went on vacation Okay, and they couldn't like mirazan. They just like goes back to romanian or whatever

[01:06:10] And Joe picco was like, I don't know. I think he went back. There was another war there or something Literally what he says in the commentary. That's insensitive. I don't know who gives a shit

[01:06:18] He literally says that in the commentary. I don't think there are any wars in romania That was the joke he makes he is romanian. Is that right? I believe so I can look at it I mean the way his name is spelled I can look him up

[01:06:30] But it was literally no one could get a hold of your George mirazan and a week before filming They were like who else is tall and got shan bradley, which is why shan bradley is innocuously in this movie

[01:06:39] Yeah, well, so right. So the team that they suck the talent from is uh, mugsie bogs um, charles barkley Larry johnson patrick ewing shan bradley so two centers to power forwards And a tiny point

[01:06:56] Definitely something I picked up on and and but they use this to turn into five giant monsters It's not like the monsters resemble the people at all not at all

[01:07:04] Like they're just five big monsters again if their job is to beat the share of people they picked mugsie bogs Right as one of their you know, did I did you guys pick up on the fact that

[01:07:13] The monstars they start out small their nerd looks at that point to be fair Right, they're very tiny and you're like i'm not intimidated by them, but then they get the talent They do they just take their talent they get big

[01:07:26] Uh, and I I have to say I like that transformation. You're into the small life and getting back Yeah, because when they're small you almost turn off the movie and walk off the porch Oh, I honestly I was like I mean I I mean I love michael, but

[01:07:40] I don't want to watch the rest of this can I try and he's like hold on hold on We'll fight years later from now Can I try to as succinctly as possible state the the logic of this movie?

[01:07:51] Go on looney tunes exist in a real world that somehow is also televised to our world when kids are watching Looney tunes are plants. It's at the core of the earth and kids are watching looney tunes live apparently

[01:08:01] Right, it's like right whatever they're up to is actually what right is happening at that time The only reason michael jordan has retired from basketball is because he's a great man who loves his family, right? Yeah

[01:08:11] And like his dad always wanted him to be a baseball player, I guess okay meanwhile out in space An alien denny devito who cannot stop smoking cigars right is seeing plummeting sales of his Mr. Swack hammer, right? He's like alien michael isner who's like we're not hip

[01:08:26] Park sucks can I and I want to you might know the aliens are morons Because it's like moron mountain. I'm sorry the plan is called moron moron mountain The aliens are called nerd lux because they're little nerds. Yeah, they are little nerds, but they're also dumb

[01:08:40] Right, but the the alien race is not the morons. Okay. I don't know what race swack hammer is Right, they doesn't seem related to the nerd lux. They're different right

[01:08:49] It's weird how little we know about swack hammer considering that he becomes one of the most beloved characters in the history of animation Right, um, but swack hammer sees this kid mocking the park is like fuck this. We need a new attraction

[01:09:01] They accidentally sit on a remote control Show the looney tunes and he's like that's it We're going to capture them from the center of the earth right to make them attractions here

[01:09:10] So that our tendons will go up right nerd lux burrow into earth everyone sees a spaceship fly overhead doesn't freak the fuck out Burrows into the center With ray guns and they're like we're holding you hostage. You have to come with us

[01:09:23] Right looney tunes make up a bullshit excuse that they can't be kidnapped unless they are beaten in a game Right, they choose basketball because the nerd lux are short and have no arms Right then the nerd lux steal ability Through a magic basketball and they're new

[01:09:40] Alex mac powers to turn into puddles right which sends the mba into chaos Yeah, because they don't know how to play anymore, right? They're putting tops over stadiums. Can I interject for one second? when

[01:09:53] Maybe this is a reach but did you find it interesting that a basically what looks like a virus Invades five random mba players right and they immediately go to the forum in los angeles Where the cdc has basically shut down

[01:10:08] He's like fumigating it right like what five years after refusing to johnson had hiv I thought not a single player is on the lakers who's here, you know, because it's it's a nick Uh

[01:10:22] Barclays on the suns at that point right a couple hornets. No, uh, yeah, barkley was on the suns two hornets Johnson and bokes are on the nick and i'm a maverick Yeah, no it does feel very std-ish. I don't believe that they would

[01:10:34] They're showing the lakers to you know, yeah, random lakers team. It's been like i don't know coach Bradley was on the nets He goes to the mavericks in 1977 that was vladi diva right? Yeah, you see vladi diva one point for that poll. Yeah, good job

[01:10:47] Thank you. He's good in it. He is good. Who else isn't that scene where there's a lot? You know, I know that other guy's face and i'm not sure he is the guy with the earring

[01:10:54] But uh, but I don't know that seemed a little weird to me. It feels very weird It's also weird that they really deal with the fallout of it as if there's a virus only affecting basketball

[01:11:03] I don't think anyone's watching this movie being right. It's weird that they go to the forum Yeah, I get what you're saying right that that's where they pick to fumigate first

[01:11:11] But the one brilliant piece of plotting is because michael jordan has retired from basketball. They don't steal his talent Uh, amarasha del harris right? Uh, yeah, yes. I know it's weird

[01:11:24] Part of part of the sub part of the film is retired and people are like he might not have talent anymore He might he's like you got you still got anything. He thought he was a baseball player

[01:11:33] It's funny. Oh, let's fall dany ainge some of you hear some of the basketball players So the looney tunes have to steal michael jordan who agrees to abandon his family and his professional obligations for no reason

[01:11:43] Having no skin in the game because his kids like the looney tunes Sure kind of yeah, he he essentially promises to take their place You know near the end of the movie which why yeah, I know he didn't really have to do that

[01:11:57] They cut to a cartoon nightmare sequence where michael jordan is literally in chains and doing autographs until he dies correlation this This movie comes out in 96. I believe in 01

[01:12:09] michael jordan tentatively agrees to go to north korea to see kim jung-un and backs out out of fear of being kidnapped and enslaved essentially by the Korean leader who was obsessed with the bowls right and that's when rodman starts going over north korea, right?

[01:12:27] Yeah, right who essentially want you know if in a world where he kidnapped michael jordan it was for it would have been right He would have taken that place. Yeah, that is fascinating in 2001

[01:12:36] Yeah, do you think kim jung-un saw space jam and he was like finally a strategy? It's kim jung-il. But do you think he saw this movie and was like well, there's a blueprint for how I get him here

[01:12:47] Probably yeah, it's in line with a lot of smokes and cigars open a theme park Dave you know his character also gets a massage during the game. Did you yes? There's also that weird cut to uh dan castellana and uh

[01:13:00] Patricia heaton. What's that about? Yeah, weird scene especially weird that she's not sitting in the middle Now it's before it's pre-middle. I know I thought she'd call her shot. Yeah, but that's like a you know

[01:13:12] That's like a weird scene they're freaked out by the the nerd luxe and trench coat Which is played off like he's some sort of weird masturbating flasher like right that is the joke

[01:13:20] This guy is doing weird things right and in a trench coat and their lumps moving around and all of that Um, yeah, so they steal all their it's funny when they lose their talent. They also show how they can't like

[01:13:32] I just really like the Patrick Ewing is really good at being bad I have a question as a nix fan. How did you feel that about Patrick them questioning Patrick Ewing's virility? I mean, by the way, it's a great scene. It's an adult moment in a kid's movie

[01:13:46] Yes, it is and also not only is just that the question just the idea of like a Freudian analyst Is an adult moment even though I think when you're a kid you do that is your image of a shrink is like a sort of

[01:13:57] Bearded guy with a german accent and a red leather chair. Yeah, there's a big right and uh, Charles Barkley jokes about dating Madonna Yes Once he gets very defensive about his mother so barkley is very good in this Funny guy great. He's so like charismatic

[01:14:12] I think the only one of the NBA players to get single card-willing and they give him more to do And he has it on scene. I assume they they used him a little and like

[01:14:18] That's right. Rules. I find that scene actually emotionally affecting where he plays street ball The kid is excellent on that scene who goes go on get out of here. Yeah, you know I'm real. I like the lunchbox Barkley

[01:14:29] I was such a big barkley fan because he was in the west the nix didn't have to deal with him as much I just loved him like I love it at that point Excuse me sir Charles Um, but just to answer your initial

[01:14:42] I think they use Patrick for that scene because Patrick just has such a good reaction phase. Yeah, like he's like You know, like he just is good at furrowing his brow. He's got such a big forehead And like Barkley Ewing and Jordan

[01:14:55] Pica had worked with so much that he knew how to get like funny out of those guys He knew how to make him comfortable But even when you're watching the montage on tv and Sean Bradley is doing that weird like Staccato walk where they've like lost their rhythm

[01:15:07] They don't even know how to drink anymore I would say in a movie that stretches You know, basically like three setups out real long real thing I would say this is one that could have been longer. Yeah, I would have liked to have seen more

[01:15:20] This is the most purely funny stuff in the movie is basketball players don't know how to play basketball anymore Always funny them missing the pass or whatever like it's their face with them with the therapist them and the doctors

[01:15:30] Like all that's church. Yeah. Yeah promise. I never did day Madonna. Yeah Uh, and then I don't know what's happening with the looney tunes then it goes deep into the looney tunes thing All right, so I don't like the looney tunes

[01:15:42] I don't hate them but like I would watch looney tunes when I was a kid, but I never was like an obsessive about them They're the grist comedians of all time. They're bad

[01:15:49] No, I got no beef, but it's just like so when they're doing looney tune stuff in this I think even when I was a kid I was just like Oh, right now they do looney tune stuff

[01:15:56] But according to you this is bad looney tune stuff. It seems bad. There are a couple weird factors I mean on one hand the people directing animation clearly were big fans and like all the background characters

[01:16:06] They put in are like deep cuts and there's certain visual gags like when the scoreboard is like it's tough to watch ain't it folks Right, like things like that feel very much as a classic right? Yeah

[01:16:16] But the weird thing is Warner Brothers had like in-house people who usually did the voices for these things And they weren't producing that many new cartoons. They weren't doing new features or any of that But they put them in commercials and shit, right?

[01:16:27] Mel blank famously used to do every single male looney tune voice Grace he was the greatest voiceover artist of all time and he did all of them Right And when he died which was late 80s. I want to say I can look it up

[01:16:39] It was always scattered of like this guy does two this guy does three this and that yes Here is more um For this movie all the regular guys Humblebrag all the regular guys assume they were gonna get the roles

[01:16:54] And because Ivan rightman was coming in and their thumbs up in each other on the humble brag Rightman comes in and was like no, we'll cast funny people Okay So they suddenly threw out everyone who had done the voices normally and just auditioned like everyone Okay

[01:17:09] And so it's like billy west and debat bradley baker and all these people who hadn't played the looney tunes before But they're voice actors Right And they do the voice as well

[01:17:17] But also they hadn't really lived in those characters and they were like just improvise a bunch of shit The script doesn't matter just improvise a bunch of shit Right So there's a lot of the scripted jokes that the looney tunes have are improvised by very cynical voice actors

[01:17:29] Which are why there's so many meta jokes about the industry There's that argument they have about them not getting a cut of the licensing Right There's the thing where daffy like kisses the Warner Brothers branding on his ass They like like shit on disney Sure

[01:17:45] There's like a lot of like inside baseball like ha ha ha hollywood stuff that kind of fucking sucks That was just like voice actors riffing and in that commentary track. They're like, yeah, I'm surprised they kept all of this in

[01:17:56] And also just putting them in like putting out more flood with like a headband and having him be like a cool baller Feels like those dumb fucking sweatshirts where it's like here's tass with crisscross backwards jeans

[01:18:08] Yeah, you know, yeah, but kids liked it kids like argue though that daffy His bits are really good daffy kills it in this movie Daffy kills it and they just understand the daffy bottom of the totem pole thing

[01:18:20] Right the bit when he comes out and the audience promptly stops cheering. Yeah, that's really great. That's good Right like stuff like that is fun, but then you also just have like

[01:18:30] When he like dresses up like rodman like there's some of that shit is dumb and lola is the worst Lola is like one of the grossest Crassest like we don't understand women This is targeted marketing characters of all time her characterization as she comes in

[01:18:45] Everyone acts like they want to fuck her they give her a wuga eyes, right? Then they say doll. Yeah, and then her only bit of characterization is doll makes her so angry. She dunks Yeah, well, they they also make them they seem very proud of the fact that

[01:18:59] After all that like they didn't think she could play right but she can right there like there's a real Look how progressive we are the woman is good at basketball and she's tough, right? And then I feel like she just doesn't come up again

[01:19:10] I mean, she's there. There's the moment where bugs almost dies and she gets emotional because apparently they're in love No, no, no, he saves her. Oh, right. He saves right and then right almost gets crushed in the process does get crushed almost dies

[01:19:23] That's when they play uh for you. I will the love theme from space jam. Uh, yeah I'm by monica. Yes. Yes. It's a shitty shitty character. Yeah, it's a shitty character. Anyway after that they play the monsters

[01:19:36] Yeah, the game it's not like there's like anything else. No the game last 10 minutes There's no training montage. No the closest they get is the scene where they have to clean up the court

[01:19:45] Right, but like every sports bit shine. Yeah, it's kind of funny. Yeah, they spit a bunch, david They're all like, oh, we are gonna clean this up and then Taz spins around

[01:19:55] It's like lemony fresh like all those jokes are very like here's billy west on a bunch of coke like riffing shit You know what suck The voice actor for foghorn not very good. Not good. Not a good

[01:20:07] There was like I love fog horn and like there was not a lot of good stuff One could say I did better in this very episode. John ham does a better Bill farmer Oh, who's not a bad voice over in general also does silvestre. Yeah

[01:20:18] And you're somebody same, uh, but the first half the game takes five minutes It's literally just a series of blackout gags of them getting. Yes. Somebody's is weird Because he's a mustache, but then the hair goes all the way around his eyes

[01:20:31] Well, it's tough when he has the hat off to render him Because the idea is that his face is mostly obscured and shadow under the hat There's like hair. It just sort of keeps going big eyebrows eyebrows

[01:20:43] But it links like ones eyebrows do not link james is giving this a real furrowed sort of like one could say He's almost linking his eyebrows in frustration looking at him But you don't link your eyebrows to your yaddaa mustache

[01:20:55] No, he also looks kind of like gossamer famous looney tunes monster gossamer Hair monster gossamer. Oh sure Right. Yes. Yes, right. Okay. Well, no gossamer Yeah, he's the big red thing. Yeah. Yeah

[01:21:09] Great character. I'm gonna look up google the assembly sam without hat. It looks bad. You don't want to see it You won't like it. I mean doesn't he take his hat off in this movie? Does he there's the weird pulp fiction reference where he and

[01:21:22] Elmer fudd suddenly become vince and jewels and and shoot one of the monsters teeth out of his head I guess he just has more hair. Yeah Yeah, okay. Okay Got it That the pulp fiction thing is weird, right? But that's like

[01:21:38] The hot movie from the kids remember that sucks for me. Oh, no, it definitely I'm referencing commercial campaigns and right brand loyalty and all of that But it was them trying to like boost these characters also. Why is marvin a referee? He's a looney tune. Yes

[01:21:53] seems well now you're You might be going too deep It's like What you say someone might knock on your door day Well, I mean there's a bit of a conflict of interest because he is a looney tune, but also they're playing against aliens

[01:22:07] So you could see how they'd be like, you know, you don't want to fight against your own guys. He's unbiased, right? Yeah He's unbiased Nerd looks are his cousins Yeah, the first half they get crushed the second half they beat him

[01:22:22] He gives a big speech they all fall asleep then they find michael's secret stuff Which bugs has put a bunch of water into a bottle taped it up and then is able to suplex a bunch of muscles Right, right. So then they all come back and they're good

[01:22:37] Right, but it's just water. He tells them that he make you know And I had remembered as a kid that speech being a lot more It's but it's like a total throw away. It's a total throw

[01:22:45] You would get a kind of making fun of the hoosiers thing of right like, you know It's within you all along but it's not really like that And daffy's just like yeah, but you got any more like right like that's like the joke

[01:22:57] But it's a weird sports movie where you don't have any sort of training montage and the game is almost kind of irrelevant until the final crucial moment is that murray has to take the place of uh,

[01:23:07] Fucking someone else uh, everyone else. Well, way night's been crushed turn to a balloon Every other Weirds visually very creepy tweedy's in an iron lung beaky buzzard is is wrapped up head to toe

[01:23:21] We all know these characters. Um, but that's when they set up the idea. How did you do that to Wayne night? It's cartoon lamb, baby Anything can happen right which then becomes the the deuce act's machina

[01:23:34] But none of this makes so yeah, so Jordan beats them. He does the cool thing with his arms That's cool. Has air in yeah Well, the other the other way to griffin describe it in more detail. No, no, no, what is james gonna say more Murray comes out

[01:23:48] Out of nowhere sure You're expecting like wow, he's gonna it'll turn out. He's good. He's gonna or he's gonna do something Right, right. He comes in he sits down says let's just do a give and go

[01:23:58] Gets the ball chest pass back to jordan done. That's it. He does have the great one He's just a body. There's no there's no I thought maybe he'd have a play You know It is great when he's running down his

[01:24:11] His strategy that he doesn't know any of their names and he goes I give it to the duck He gives it to the bunny. He gives it to the girl bunny. You take it to the hoop. You dominate

[01:24:19] Yeah, why isn't there an announcer character? There is the two mice. Oh, yeah. Well, they're not they don't make any impact on me I feel like a good sports movie. You want a nice announcer It should have been foghorn foghorn could have made that thing sing

[01:24:31] Yeah, I'll say we're tired I mean sure, you know, whatever it is. Yeah, right. Yeah Um, no the the mice the bit is just that they have like yeah Pipsqueak voices and then they like clear their throats and sound like whoever. I'm sorry I don't mean to

[01:24:46] Like stop the podcast but I've been watching you do all these voices and it's like amazing It's almost like if you were a big time animation studio executive Right someone who produces. I don't know primetime cartoon shows

[01:25:00] Sure, and you've told other people in meetings that you listen to this podcast Maybe it starts like look through the fucking the pitch packets. I mean, wow. Yeah, I'm sorry

[01:25:09] Right. Well, no, I would I would say too that to what we were talking about at the beginning of the podcast This was sort of a compromise movie for us. I think I also spent a lot of time when I was young

[01:25:19] Hoping that at some point the dam would break and Griffin would be like, you know, it's kind of cool sports Oh, right It's supposed to be the way to chisel away

[01:25:26] Right and I this movie was the closest I ever got this would happen and I would get excited that I might have Yes, something you know my brother might be like But the problem is That we go see this

[01:25:38] Uh-huh, and he's just good. I mean it's fun. I loved it. You know, I love seeing this as my brother But right exactly the take it's never there's too much looney tunes for you to actually have to you don't have to go deep on the Sports

[01:25:48] Right, but that was always the thing it would be like I mean I remember the excitement you would have and it would Like work when it was like oh shack is in a movie right because I like shack but then you could never get to me watching

[01:25:59] Let's just watch a game Right because it was always like hey griff. Have you seen shacks teammate too? Like, you know this yeah This has never been a genie. He's never lived in a boombox Right and that was the problem

[01:26:09] And this is the thing with me and my brother too because right I could get my brother into like maybe you'd collect Cards like, you know all the periphery of sports But right if you ever just like let's just sit down and watch this game Right

[01:26:20] Yeah, no you didn't because you were a big like baseball basketball card guy And then I was big into collecting cards But I would collect cards that you couldn't trade with anyone

[01:26:29] Because no one cared about the right. Oh, I got the full set of the small soldiers cards That's like great now. You just have them all You bought them there was no economy for small so I got to baseball cards actually that was my thing

[01:26:41] I was a baseball card person yeah basketball cards for some reason didn't hold as much baseball cards are the I mean that's it and then and then that's the classic You know and there's so many baseball players too. So you could really just

[01:26:53] Right and my dad had old baseball cards he used to like let us unwrap A lot of those to collect You used to even do that maybe I like the ritual of the unwrapping

[01:27:02] I mean there was that one remember that baseball card store we would go to a lot That was on like mcdougal Yes, that was it was like pokemon 2 and some others right this was even before pokemon when

[01:27:13] Literally they only sold sports cards. It was like I'll get a pack Because then I'll like the rush of the trade opening it right when I was in my really deep Shoplifting phase I would steal basketball cards all the time

[01:27:24] Okay, and me and my friend had this whole system where we would just get a whole box And I would distract the guy and then I put it in my pants and walk out and then would you resell the box?

[01:27:34] Yeah, and he got a paul pierce rookie card one time a whole box in your pants. Yeah All right. Yeah, it's I mean you're a big kid You're also You're lucky ben that you already have had a reputation for having a famously square crotch Was it good?

[01:27:50] The usual ben hausley bull But then you try to walk out and just be like, I don't know and he never caught us God if I always owned a fucking sports card store any 10 year old 12 year old walks in

[01:28:01] I would just be like my eyes are on this kid until they leave the store Like I would just assume they were all shot Especially human Bart Simpson Especially fucking Edward furlong over here Um Yeah, uh

[01:28:13] Well, I like I did like basketball cards, but yeah, I was a baseball card guy, but NBA jam That was you know that I played that all the time

[01:28:20] Yeah, and we talked about this but that was like the big sort of burlin wall coming down and our family was like We have separate bedrooms now and we finally won the video game system war and you got an n64

[01:28:31] Oh sure. Yeah, that was a big turning point You know and that was a big thing with all this stuff with like our mom The super nintendo wasn't as big a deal for you right?

[01:28:39] No, we weren't allowed like the genesis the snes we'd go over to other people's houses and want to play that And that's a That's a problem as a parent when because what ends up happening is your kids wind up picking their friends based on who has what system

[01:28:52] Oh for sure. That's not good at all No, it's true because those are usually the kids with the parents are just like Yeah, just play video games for 10 hours. I'll order you pizza And then you just like come out and you're like You're just like drinking

[01:29:06] Mom wouldn't let me go and you you as well into the video game section We weren't allowed to have a toys or us We couldn't look at the the right. It was like no caffeine. No video game like all these things were like just completely forbidden

[01:29:20] That was like a big it was like sort of a years long bath I mean famously when our parents announced that they were going to have a third child We thought like a family meeting. This is going to be the video game system talk

[01:29:31] Right. We very much were like we got it and 64 it's new on the market We're getting that out of the PlayStation That's the only thing we have to know is which system are we buying my parents Uh had a love hate relationship with video games

[01:29:43] And they would take it away from me sometimes because I would smash the controller. Oh, you're too aggro. I got aggro Well, I've speaking of that you know Again, we were very much parented together and there would be like

[01:29:55] Certainly peaks and valleys in that regard and so like we were both good. Don't skip over it No, no, no, we're going. We're going to we're going to valley Had different parents. Yes. It's like 10 years later. It's right

[01:30:07] But so for me and griff like and and you know being the younger Sibling you you always want yeah some level of approval and also just let's do this together And so like we wanted the system. We both wanted the system right right? That was great

[01:30:21] We got the system. Yeah, but then you get the system and of course we don't want to play any of the same games Right and did you want to play like sports games? Like yeah, I want to play any game

[01:30:31] I would play I would play those other games, but for the most part You know, I if I had the time to myself. I really want to play sports games

[01:30:38] But let me finish so okay, you know we we had we had an incident where we were on a bean bag in I don't know if we were in the same room then or if it was just my room

[01:30:48] That would have been your that's where we had the system. It was your that's where the nintendo was It was on like a little cart was like a tv on a cart. Yeah, maybe I don't know

[01:30:55] And like an a doing screen. Yeah something like that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was like a quarter the size of us at the time yeah, um and uh and griff was playing on the bean bag and

[01:31:08] I guess I think I had my recollection is I had come in and said Can I play soon and he said something like I'm very close to being this level of blues brothers 2000 the n64 game

[01:31:20] A real pull. Oh, I remember that game. He says something like 20 minutes. Sure 20 minutes Yeah, so I go you know do whatever trying to get to a save point eat some french bread pizza or whatever we do

[01:31:29] And then come back 20 minutes later. I'm like it's time for me to you know use the game system alone and griffin I don't know what he said but It was a little like uh, well, just 20 more minutes. It's a little 20 in a disrespectful tone And I

[01:31:46] And I uh, I punched him at the on the crown of his head as hard as I could I punched him on the top of his head. You'd had enough right right out enough

[01:31:55] I didn't know that was not where you're supposed to punch someone if you're trying to hurt them Yeah, I guess I you punched him like right here. Yeah And I guess I just figured it was sort of like the epicenter of

[01:32:04] The brain and human or something like that but real and so I punched him and immediately I'm in tremendous pain, but I'm also in tremendous trouble right because I just punched my brother in the head

[01:32:14] Right and so you were a big puncher. I mean you you almost became a professional boxer I was you know, I this was in the period before you had

[01:32:21] We might disagree on this a little bit my recollection of our fighting because our fighting was we didn't always get along And our fighting was griff. I would make fun of you

[01:32:28] You would say you're stupid your this or that and I would and I would do it right I was only verbal and you were only my recollection of my fighting style would always be Like a tackle and a pin

[01:32:39] Yeah, and then like getting ready to punch and then just I remember one time I pinned Griffin down and I was ready to punch them and I just ended up slapping him in the ear

[01:32:48] You know, so I could never go that was a big one and that was a kind of no I kind of couldn't go all the way, but then this was a time. That was a way all the way. Yeah I'm watching blues brothers 2000 gameplay on my computer

[01:32:59] Also a game that came out two years after the release of the movie. I mean, I like a famously bad But it'll get you in the mood for for punch. So So and I'm I'm writhing in pain because I just punch him in the crown

[01:33:11] Fractured your hand. Well, okay. So and I'm in a lot of trouble right and I'm going to my parents and I go You don't know how much this hurts for James James, you know, this is the moment your brother was terrible. You could not do that

[01:33:25] You know, I think I think you know what? I think we were sleeping in the same room Because what happened is I think I was

[01:33:33] Sentenced out of the room different room parents room little like sleeping bag right next to the bed in my parents room griff had the room Himself I think we were separate rooms at that point. I would argue that we didn't have

[01:33:44] I'm positive I slept on our parents floor. I believe that okay There's not a blanket on my parents floor and I was just the whole night Just like with a shattered growth plate in my hand completely broken

[01:33:55] He had a cast for us just begging my parents like to take me to the hospital, right? It's enough You're not you're in trouble. You are not getting out of this

[01:34:02] Which the broken hand was blamed on me not because I riled him up but because my head was too hard That was james's company line at the time. If your head wasn't so hard. I wouldn't have broken my hand We fundraised off that I was hardheaded. Yeah, yeah

[01:34:16] Yeah, you know you could be you can be hardheaded at times. I can be hardheaded certainly in this instance Uh, what a story You know what what a story mark. Um, do we have anything else we got to say about the movie? I

[01:34:32] Mean there's kind of the tram-foot moment at the end I think it's weird that they win the game and that only then are the monsters like told like you can just beat the shit out of Danny DeVito if you want like so I camera

[01:34:42] Sobs get rid of it, right? Oh, yeah. Well, I think that's another thing is like this movie is Not about anything no right. It's about nothing It's yeah, it's that's the that even even that alone is the closest the movie comes to sending any sort of message

[01:35:00] But it's barely a message. It's not you know, it's just It's it's about two things. It's weird. Let's make looney tunes cool for this generation And let's make michael jordan shiny as a person and I would say one of the interesting things one of the

[01:35:14] Interesting experience I had rewatching this film after watching it probably 30 times from you know Right to nine or the VHS that came with the coin. Do you remember the coin? Yes? Yeah, I do um Was remembering the movie

[01:35:27] In a specific way as you remember a lot of old movies you haven't seen in a while as a collection of moments, right? Right, I know I remember this scene

[01:35:34] I remember them doing this or that and you go back in a film like that and you just sort of assume That there's other there's connective tissue There are b-plots

[01:35:44] I'm not I remembered every second of this film because it is just a collection of moments. It's a series of commercials Yes, there's something it's but there's something about the thing where they're like might makes right beat up Danny DeVito

[01:35:56] And they do right and then they're like now it's time to give the talent back and they're like do we have to and he's like Yeah, they could just beat the shit out of him. You're still monsters Yeah

[01:36:05] So it has to flip the message on them pretty much right away Not to harp on this but the fact that michael jordan chooses to stake his life After he's already left his family without warning

[01:36:14] I mean there's the scene where bugs and daffy have to go back into the real world to re retrieve his Boxers yes north carolina. Yes, he wore under a she is that real or did he just make that up? I think they made they made that up right

[01:36:28] Well, can we can we say that that might be the only admission in the entire film of gambling addiction? Right. He had to gamble his life. He did. That's real to get a real thing. Yes. That is big

[01:36:40] Um, but uh, they have to go get the shorts and then the kids have to reassure Uh or or bugs and daffy have to reassure the kids that their dad is all right and you're like right

[01:36:50] He just left. Are they not worried about them? Yeah, we don't see teresa randal That's another thing when the when the spaceship Yeah, also interesting that they used a cartoon spaceship In the minor league Yes, you know you think because I guess

[01:37:05] Part of the reason that the film sort of makes sense is like when you go under then you're a loony tune You can stretch right anything. Yeah, but if you come back up you're you're back on that

[01:37:12] But so right they use a cartoon spaceship landed on the baseball field and the wife play I believe I can fly just starts clapping standing walks out of a spaceship. Oh cool. He made it in time for the game

[01:37:23] Right, right. There's no like what they didn't even know he wasn't gonna be at Because you imagine the conversation the next morning where the kids go look mom We know you've been crying for four nights straight We want you to know everything's fine

[01:37:34] Bugs and daffy came to us at three o'clock in the morning and told us the dad's just helping them Don't worry. He's risked his life betting himself into slavery. They don't mention that. No, no

[01:37:44] Don't they imply that the kids keep it from her? Is there there's a moment where they go mom? I don't you know like I don't know Yeah, um, they're also set the thing that the kid is bad at sports

[01:37:53] Which feels like it's gonna pay off later in the movie where he gets off the the minivan But there's just not enough time in this extremely roomy movie for any payoff there

[01:38:02] First like there are so many setups of all the different oh the dog is scary. The kid is sad, right? Well, it feels Completely like a movie that was made by directed by two different people right three different people

[01:38:14] I mean, I think Eric Goldberg did the animation Joe Pick essentially did live action Ivan Reitman was sort of overseeing everything and the movie was pitched only as Hey, this is a smart way to revive the looney tunes

[01:38:25] You'll get Michael Jordan to want to do this and he's one of the most famous people alive It did feel like it was going to lead to him doing other movies and it just never did I don't think he gets obsessed with basketball

[01:38:35] Yeah, I think he wanted to yeah Can we talk about the possibility of them remaking this movie? Well, so I mean there was the official announcement last week

[01:38:43] Ryan Coogler is on board as a producer right Terrence Nance current showrunner of random acts of flyness on hbo is directing Um and and LeBron is doing it. That's one of the reasons he moved to la

[01:38:55] Is to be able to film this almost immediately after moving to la they're gonna film it next next summer supposedly Yeah, so I don't know what the fuck that movie is and I I've always said this where

[01:39:06] The weird thing about remaking space jam is then the only reason the looney tunes are in it Is because they were in the original space jam right because kids today I don't think care about looney tune

[01:39:15] Well, there's another there's another point as someone who was so excited for space jam because Michael Jordan was in it And then I was a basketball person. I remember being a kid and if there was a movie

[01:39:24] I mean if there was a movie where an athlete appeared in the movie for three seconds I was gonna see it right. I mean I watched the sixth man

[01:39:30] Probably about 30 times a thousand times shak being a good burger right watch that scene over and over blue chips when I was Enough to watch it right with in blue chips, which is like a dark movie about like the nca is bad A drunk nicknolty, right and then

[01:39:45] Kids are watching because they're like shacks in this movie and he is in it Like no, but it's it's that You know provides a good amount of sports porn sure this movie provides a great amount of sports porn right and That's just not

[01:40:00] Like when I was at age I would do anything for that because I didn't have Yeah, there was you didn't have a computer You didn't have youtube I could go watch as much footage of LeBron James right on the computer now as I want

[01:40:11] I couldn't I could die watching footage of 15 years to delve through now That entire appeal is basically lost for a sequel there were two basketball players and and two athletes period who made movies in the 90s

[01:40:24] And was shak who was anomaly because of how big he was and also that he liked rapping and video games and all this other Shit, michael jordan who was the most famous athlete on the planet

[01:40:32] But nowadays like I didn't know who kairi erving was before uncle drew came out You didn't know about the commercial. I was like is this some comedian. I don't know about I didn't know about the commercial

[01:40:42] I knew some of the older people because that was of the era where I would have to be in the room You hadn't heard of reggie miller or whatever Chris Weber

[01:40:48] What lisa lesley's in it, right? Like I knew those people did you see uncle drew you I did not know Kairi erring. I never heard of and so it was such a novelty that it was like

[01:40:58] An athlete starring in a movie right whereas LeBron's already like done several different commercial campaigns has been in train Rec is in like funny or die videos

[01:41:06] Like a funny guy space jam came out in an era where you and I would go to a cafe with really shitty food Just so I could sit next to A replica of shak's shoes of his size 22 shoes

[01:41:21] I just want I want to eat these fingers right looking at his shoes. Yeah, I mean that was just it was just a totally different Experience being a sports fan back. That's the weird thing about making a space jam too

[01:41:30] Is it's a movie that exists only for people who are nostalgic for the movie when they were children No, I got two takes what to do against that one I think it's it is a movie for the wb to maybe finally

[01:41:41] Make one last play to bring the tunes looney tunes back into the culture Since uh looney tunes back in action. They have had some sort of looney tunes cartoon on the air some series and none of them have

[01:41:51] Really worked right they keep on trying and none of them really work. Um, exactly So maybe this is the hill mary. Maybe this will do it but two To any NBA fan. They're so much invested in LeBron Versus jordan now

[01:42:05] That it's almost essential that he makes space jam too Because everything he does is now in comparison to jordan. So it's like well, where's his space jam though? He never made a space jam

[01:42:15] Yeah, so now we need to see how he does space jam so that we can stack it up to jordan space jam That he literally has to do space jam rather than doing his version his family comedy absolutely not I mean also

[01:42:27] I like had like a call with like a warner brothers executive a year ago Where it was like they want to make shorts like even before this movie was officially green lit but was inactive development. I think um,

[01:42:39] Uh, someone else was supposed to produce or direct it at the time It's definitely just a lin was supposed to do it for a little while They were like sending out the fucking like beacon to comedy writers being like we need to write looney tunes theatrical shorts

[01:42:52] That have LeBron in them right There was also some concept for a tiger woods starring space jam when tiger woods is at the height of his fame Okay, so the legacy of this movie comes out does well domestically

[01:43:05] But makes a billion dollars in merchandising and the soundtrack is big and all of that they immediately go What's the next one and for like years? They kept on going like is it race jam? They wrote a pitch that was him and jeff gordon

[01:43:18] There was like the the tiger woods version There was spy jam, which was jackie chan is a spy with the looney tunes Sure like the premise just came take someone who's good at something else pair them up with the looney tunes live action

[01:43:30] We're the jams the word though because jam is refers to slam dunking right? Yeah, but that was always their thing Like spy jam got announced at some point. Go hunt. Well the tiger woods thing would have made a lot of sense

[01:43:40] He was he was similarly brand after he crashed his car after sleeping with every denny's waitress in this day before First act Um looney tunes back in action a movie I love that we will hopefully cover someday on the show

[01:43:54] Which was their attempt to do like okay? This is like a proper live action looney tunes movie Um has all the elements of the aborted versions in them

[01:44:02] So like brendan frazier's father in the film is timothy dalton playing james bond so they could use all the spy stuff They had developed interesting so they're just right. They were just like pulling from this and that

[01:44:11] Races the looney tunes in it for no fucking reason. That's a blame. Is this movie good? Like i was saying to ben like half of it rules and half of it is like we spent money on this We have to put it in there somehow

[01:44:23] Um and then that movie bombed so hard that they're just like fuck it. Let's try looney tunes babies Let's try a show where they live in an apartment together Like this has been the last 15 years. It's kind of the same problem the mumpets have right where they're like

[01:44:34] Well, we still got this brand Yeah, surely there's a way to make it stick and they're just kind of throwing shit out Well in one sense it makes sense because you already have this Platform that people will will be excited to see space jam 2 people love space jam 1

[01:44:47] They'll go see it. So if you if you sort of get them back into the looney tunes to that The other thing is space jam 1 was a horrible platform for the looney tunes. Right? Terrible just Yes, it didn't help them as characters

[01:44:57] So it helped them as iconography for a couple years and then after merch right um, but I think Like the thing it's the same thing with the muppets and the looney tunes that people don't realize How much it was about those creative teams

[01:45:09] That it wasn't just these characters and the designs of them But it was like Chuck Jones and Michael Maltese and it was Jim henson and his writers, you know

[01:45:17] Like jerry joles and all these people. Yeah, um, and they've never reestablished a creative sort of brain trust behind these properties But now I think there's enough nostalgia I mean LeBron James has always talked about how much he loves space jam

[01:45:30] He's certainly obsessed with Michael Jordan. He wears number 23 like but once again his connection to the characters Do you think it's weird that he might wear? No, I mean he is in a way Obsessed with Michael Jordan, but I also think he's been very careful

[01:45:43] At times which is a little bit why I'm surprised he wants to do this so bad He didn't broach the legacy stuff until recently right, yeah He's been very careful about when to sort of start talking about it and is also very clearly as an athlete

[01:45:55] Yeah, and very different from Michael Jordan. I mean, you know, it's a basketball player totally different Yes, but in terms of all-encompassing talent like if I was fucking LeBron James's acting manager I'd be like let's get a pitch for a movie with you in SpongeBob

[01:46:10] Uh, like I wouldn't be make spice jam too spice jam I'd be like I'll say I'll say I'll say I think I spice jam could be good Spice jam would be great. Yeah Oh, yeah, yeah

[01:46:24] It's a chef, right? Right, right. Chef Casper could direct it. Yeah, Faber would come back for that He's not busy But like doesn't it make more sense if you go like oh the premise is it's LeBron with the

[01:46:35] Transformers or the Ninja Turtles or someone who's like still popular today I think there's just something about being in the same universe as Michael Jordan that that gets everything a little more exciting

[01:46:44] And look coogler fucking rules Terence Nance is really cool. Maybe they'll do something weirder with the sequel But it's a bizarre thing. Well, yeah, the movie could be really good, right You know in part because it doesn't resemble at all space jam one

[01:46:58] And there's nothing to be told into there's no exact gritty. No one's going to be like you better have a scene where this happens because that's legendary Yeah In this film I'm not seeing it they changed the voice actors for the nerd looks

[01:47:13] Uh, like Ewing is boning. He's taking women to bone town. No one no one will say the word nerd luck Oh god, I will protest. Yeah, you will protest. You'll be well

[01:47:22] Now I guess we have to cover we all have to come back together to cover space jam too if it happens Assuming it does we well, I think they've staked out a release date. They have yeah, and they are planning to shoot it next summer

[01:47:33] They know they have a limited window of his availability. You got to do it in the summer Uh coogler. I think guarantees that the movie gets made now. He was sort of the missing element I mean he and he's got a blank check literally and they've been

[01:47:44] Paving the runway as I said this call about the fucking looney Tunes shorts was a year and a half two years ago Like I don't know if they're still doing that but their thing was like

[01:47:51] We're gonna start putting lid brawn with the looney Tunes to get people used to the idea and coogler already did exactly What you would need to do to make this movie good, which is find the emotional through line in the rocky movies

[01:48:02] But right turn it into your own movie right and hire like a really visually interesting director. Do you think jordan's in it? I can't think they got it He's it's a bit of a bummer to see michael jordan these days, right? Do you agree?

[01:48:15] Well, that was bad enough. Well part of that is also michael jordan In addition to be one of the most beautiful men of all time is one of the worst stress men of all time And he's only gotten worse

[01:48:26] He looks like an alcoholic dad. That's the other thing is like his eyes are always bloodshot now, right? Like he always looks bleary-eyed. He looks yeah. Yeah, you know, he's just he's a little fuller

[01:48:36] He had a messy divorce. He's carrying some water weight on him. His basketball team is terrible. He's a very bad owner Horrible and he's like the exact kind of owner you don't want where he's like the team has staked out this like working to draft

[01:48:50] This guy right done all our and he like barges and he's like no no we're drafting this guy Because you know, he'd back me down if we were playing they're like Well, he drafts a ton of north carolina players drafts a lot of

[01:49:03] He's drafts a lot of players who are in the nc tournament and go deep into the nc always Which lets you know, you know two weeks before that, you know, he's flipping around

[01:49:13] He's come on. He's flipping. You know, Celtic's famously offered him four draft picks for the ninth pick Said he turns them down Which is insane To draft frank Kaminsky who is fine. Who is a ninth guy? Who is the most that guy?

[01:49:30] He's a guy. I would say he's that guy if I had to say boy I and I like the hornets because I like their the collars They're a bit of an underdog team like they were good when I was a kid

[01:49:40] Like I've always just still aligned from the movie. They are the least v-rile team They're not the worst team in the mba, but there's no sex appeal to that team whatsoever. No, no agreed So merchandise spotlight

[01:49:50] I got drunk and bought 27 space jam mugs off of ebay five years ago Why because we used to own so much space jam merchandise that I went on ebay and was trying to remember what we used to own when I was drunk after I had

[01:50:04] Done this bit successfully for the first time right and someone was selling a lot Of 26 mugs that were just a ceramic bust of michael jordan's head that didn't look like michael jordan's

[01:50:14] So they're identical you would drink out of his skull sure and I just thought the image was so funny of this ebay picture Of a dude's garage where he had a perfect cube of just stacked mugs right?

[01:50:25] Why did he buy this many? Why has he been sitting on them for this long? Maybe he stole it like then did he put it in his pants. He had a cube crotch I put in a low ball offer Five comedy points. Thank you

[01:50:36] I always did was your offer five comedy points. I'll give you a five whole comedy points at this point I'm not making much money, right? I'm not successful in any way humble break. Thank you

[01:50:47] And I think the guy was asking for like 200 dollars sure and I was like it's a lot of money I'm gonna low ball hundred dollars, which is not a hundred dollars. I had no and he accepted it within one section He was like what?

[01:51:00] Someone said yes to that it's been sitting on these for 20 years So then this very angry ups guy shows up at my doorstep with the heaviest box of all time It's 27 ceramic mug. He's like this is something good, right and you open it and it's 27 Yes

[01:51:17] That I didn't know what to do with so for like two years that was the only present I gave to people right and it was sort of like the people closest in my life Birthday graduation things I got I think I got one

[01:51:29] I only I never gave anyone more than one right Yeah, it was the deal was everyone gets one right and I have one left And it's how I will propose to my wife

[01:51:40] Great merchant my spotlight so fian hawking got engaged that was my gift to them at their wedding They were like we finally got them and they lived with me when I had these things delivered

[01:51:49] Like that was my big gift for a while griffin is have I I don't think I've told this on my Monster is there a monster like a while ago?

[01:51:57] I had a friend who was dating someone who is a mutual friend of griffin's but I didn't know griffin yet And uh one day I was like you want to hang out. She's like now I have to go to like apple bees in Harlem because like

[01:52:10] My boyfriend's friend decided to like have his birthday there and I was like oh why and she was like I don't know I guess he likes apple bees. He thinks it's funny or he just thinks it's funny in february By the way, it's freezing cold right

[01:52:21] I may have told the story of the pie guys a camera and I was just like oh, okay, whatever Let's hang out tomorrow. And so we hang out the next day. I was like how is that apple bees thing?

[01:52:28] She was like it was horrible. We had to like wait an hour It wouldn't let your reserve table so we waited an hour and a half outdoors in the cold It was literally snowing and then I ordered a quesadilla burger

[01:52:37] And I couldn't finish it. It's a burger where the buns are quesadilla And so before I knew griffin I knew this story. She never said his name Yeah, I knew this story of like this idiot who did this and the second you met me

[01:52:48] You were like oh, is this you? This must be you You did this and you were like yeah, I did that Yeah, of course I did that I would this was a really life bit heavy period of my life

[01:52:57] Cool, that was also when we were young in addition to maybe we see a movie after like part of the deal Of being able to go to like ESPN zone or all-star sports cafe is basically griffin being like I'll go if the food is fucking terrible

[01:53:11] If they have the most frozen I love that, you know chicken nugget Right burger, you know mozzarella My diet is based around the fact that I didn't like food growing up So I only wanted to go to restaurants that had toys

[01:53:25] And thus my food taste became based around what's the most chemically tasting Insane mutant food possible. Is this episode 17 hours? No, we're doing fine. We're doing fine. We're about two hours Yeah, you're recording for a while because there was that like long digression about your jean jacket

[01:53:42] David, yeah, if I know one thing about you And so your connoisseur context if I know two things about you is you love money I do love it sounds like a bit but you talk about it a lot

[01:53:54] Yes, money's on my mind right and we got a lot of sponsors on this show and they sell products and you're like Products are good, but they cost me money. I want to make money right right

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[01:55:58] so yeah robin hood uh check that robin hood.com and uh You can get trading right away. Yeah this episode sponsored by money Okay, let's play a box office game. Yes, this movie ends up at like 90 domestic 90 domestic exactly

[01:56:14] It's just like big benign 230 worldwide crazy great for a movie about basketball But at this point in the 90s right like you know basketball is becoming a little more of a global brand michael jordan big name Bucks bunny big name big name

[01:56:28] Number one. All right, so this is november 15th 1996 okay number one of the box offices space jam opens to 27 It's like a year to the date after a toy story horrible multiplier Yeah, right huge especially for our children's movie huge opener

[01:56:43] Uh number two we've discussed it before it's got a great score. It's an it's a revenge thriller Uh payback no close. Oh ransom right which I rather mel Gibson one word revenge movie I listen to ransom score and i'm gonna feel like a hero

[01:56:57] Have you seen ransom james? No, I've never seen it either. I just love that tron Howard pretty good main theme from ransom number three New this week It's like sort of a sort of a romantic Dramity romantic comedy I guess

[01:57:16] With like a huge star who rarely makes movies Uh at that time and she directed mirror has to face. Yeah. Yeah, I it's hard. How do you explain the virus? It's gonna get it before you said she directed it just that she rarely makes it

[01:57:29] Babs that was like her last uh, pretty much. She directed right I think and then she has the guilt trip and the Fokkers and those are the only other movies after that

[01:57:36] I guess so. Yeah, is there nothing? I guess no, I think it's the guilt trip in the two Fokkers Babs uh number four a great movie. Oh my god. I love this movie. We were just talking about this director Uh heist movie

[01:57:50] It's a heist movie with such a good movie director. You love No, don't love the director kind of mix on the director, but we were just talking about him

[01:57:57] But I love this movie. This is my favorite of his movie. We're talking about it in relation to a six out of ten time at the L Royale No And maybe it's seven at a time. Yeah six to seven. Yeah

[01:58:09] No, it's a heist. It's sort of two good two really good sequences at the L Royale That's what I would call that Like a pretty decent like awesome set pieces at the L Royale place and vibe throughout the entire runtime at the L Royale

[01:58:21] Right, right, right. Um a good actor showcase at the L Royale mostly Cynthia Rivo is gonna have a really good career at the L Royale. I think so Um, okay, so this is a heist movie. It's 1996

[01:58:34] Really like it. What's what's the cast like big actor? Uh, it's an ensemble piece um like many a heist movie for ladies Oh, it set it off set it off right which you love. Great movie Queen Latifa Jada Pinkett Smith Vivike Fox Kimberley Elise

[01:58:52] Great movie number five. Oh another great movie that I really want to do on this podcast Uh, could we do two monsters on the leaf? No Now you can go right to hell

[01:59:03] Uh, the second film by this very blank check director who's only made like five movies interesting Uh saw this in theaters was huge for me. I've seen it so many times. It's my favorite of his movies Wow, it's a good weekend

[01:59:19] Five movies are they an actor as well? Is it adaptation? The director are they an actor as well? No. No, it's an adaptation huge star Massive start. But sort of at the beginning of his success like not Jim Carrey. No 96 beginning of his success

[01:59:34] A real like visual vibe to it Huh, yeah visuals really pop hyper visual movie from director Who's real blank check he's only made about five films massive star but kind of at the beginning of their career This is all good clues. Will Smith picture. Nope

[01:59:51] Good guesses, right? Yeah male star. Yeah Female co-star who's not as big although at the time she was hot. She's still big The time she was brand new like ingenue like uh well regarded Teen star a teen star. Yeah, and how old is the leader? He's teen probably

[02:00:11] He's maybe in the 21 at this point and then he and then he goes on to have a really big it's still big today. Yes Still bankable. Yeah, very much very much so

[02:00:21] Huh one of the few movie stars one of the few movies. Oh my god. I like it. I'm genuinely per play I know I love a stumper and had either of them come from tv before She did she's tv star. She was a tv star. Uh, he

[02:00:35] I guess he was in tv. Yeah, but like I mean You know he gets famous in the movies Uh, I'll give you another clue. He's already an oscar nominee Oh, so he had an early oscar. What was it the caprio? Leonardo DiCaprio

[02:00:49] Okay, right. So he was a regular on growing pains first. Yeah, but I mean, you know, let I mean Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, it's uh, William Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet. Good call. Good call. Yeah Um, yep with Claire Danes of my so-called like rewatch that movie

[02:01:03] I watched it all the time. It's aged to mass so well. It's amazing. It's so good It's kind of a brave. Yeah. Yes. Yeah 100% that 90s Venice beach sort of like, you know radiohead soundtrack like yeah, so good Uh, what else you got in there sleepers?

[02:01:21] Sleepers weird movie. Yeah, um epic about child molestation Um, first wife club seriously first wife's club. Yeah Uh ghost in the darkness Oh with the kilmer and uh Douglas yeah, okay michael collins irish independence Yeah, when Liam Neeson was boring Independence day still playing right. Okay

[02:01:45] Yep crazy crazy crazy. What a time what a time what a place We love it. Oh the movies we love them The movies The movies that's a call back to something. Yeah, you'll like that eight weeks from that. Yeah, exactly I gotta find that clip

[02:02:00] Um, so pump up the jams Pump it up. Oh, we gotta give a credit to uh, uh our our blankie Who remakes the theme song for us? Uh, yeah, their name is

[02:02:13] Go on mast manta. Hey, thank you so much for that. That was really really cool. We gotta record that Don't say that on mike. I was gonna forget otherwise. Okay, we'll beep it out then So it's a mystery and it sounds more exciting than it actually was

[02:02:27] Uh any final thoughts james? It's pondering This feels like the the beginning of movies being designed as like this can't not work Right, it's all and just that idea of like movies as intellectual property, you know as product is brand revival

[02:02:46] As sort of like stuffing as much in as you can. Yeah, yeah, but also but again such a lack of Like I feel like it's very hard to make a movie like this now without

[02:02:59] Either the director or the writer coming in saying like, but let's throw a little list in there You know, let's get this like so let's make this the message. This is a just a Again, as you said purely a commercial. It's a product. It's a commercial, right?

[02:03:11] And this is now they try and trick you by like hiring, you know more legitimate artists But there's also people leaning on them be like, don't forget to include all this stuff But I wonder did we like This movie more when we were young for that exact reason

[02:03:24] Like it was just bite-sized little like high energy cartoon watching this movie now again My my recollection being so much different but my recollection was loving this movie Like no boring parts of your six and forgetting parts that didn't actually exist

[02:03:37] No, when you watch this movie now, you're like, right. This is barely a movie I mean, I remember walking out with our mom. We were both like over the moon about it You're like, what do you think? And she was like, it's just like a commercial

[02:03:46] Right, that was her criticism as an adult I'm not saying there's anything wrong with a great Pixar movie or something like that But do too many directors want kids to be like adults in that they are

[02:03:56] Sure, you know that they that they're going to the movies and they want to But on the other hand, this is a movie and I'm all for like movies that are just like Hoja Transylvania

[02:04:05] Movies where it's just like this is just fun. This is just fun for kids, right? Like not trying to even begin to emulate the pathos of a Pixar or whatever But this is a movie where no one involved had like genuine

[02:04:17] Like sort of emotional creative aspirations, right, right, you know And like I feel like even other movies that are like like you look at like Roger Corman movies or whatever Where he's like churn them out, but the director is like Copeland. He's trying something

[02:04:30] This movie is everyone just being like we know exactly what we're doing like sell the fucking hamburgers, you know Yeah sell sell the band-aid sell it all right

[02:04:38] Um, it's a weird film in that way and it kind of opens the door to I think studios being like, oh do we have We can't make any effort right? What if we just don't give a shit? Um

[02:04:50] What's it like I'm trying to think of an analog though like there's nothing quite like space jam No, no, I mean the movie I weirdly think as close as to space jam is uh from Justin to Kelly

[02:05:02] Yeah, right, but no one even gives a shit about that one, right? Um, yeah, the weird thing it has going for it is the mash-up quality which also was very

[02:05:11] Unusual at the time not the live action animation, but the idea of like brands were kept very pure at the time Like they wouldn't even make Freddy versus Jason and the fact that it's like two different things together

[02:05:22] Freddy versus Jason is like an alien versus predator right those things were always like where it was like people just demand a clash of brands Right and they do comic books or video games that we're like, don't ever make a movie. That's too messy for a movie

[02:05:33] Okay, what's your mash-ups? Oh, okay when I end with this our dream mash-ups. Oh, please you go first. Yeah Um, okay because I have to think it's yeah You know what I loved was x-men versus calf com the that brand of video games that became marvel versus calf

[02:05:49] And that was huge for me. Sure. I mean, I think I pitched this before in the podcast but knights of rodanthe Okay, and ight of rodanthe. Okay, it's a bunch of older men who have to team up to save diane lane We got Hugh Grant Dickie gear

[02:06:02] John Qsack all the men who have romance diane lane post 40 are the knights of rodanthe Yeah, that's my mash-up. I'm not gonna top dogs hogs Which of course is the big mashing of the uh wall becker universe

[02:06:16] Oh, that's not about hogs hogs and david dogs. Well, that's the sequel. Okay So that's dogs hogs But dogs hogs is of course the wild hogs boys end up pulling up into the driveway of the old dogs boys and

[02:06:32] Boys will be boys and dogs will be dogs and you can't teach an old hog new tricks So that's dogs hogs. Right. Yeah. I don't know those are my mash-ups. Benny got any Yeah, Beverly hillbillies okay, um meets uh

[02:06:49] The jetsons it's weird that he started with Beverly hillbillies. I'm like, oh, he's got a joke coming and then you're just like, uh Okay, I got one. I got one right here Ben. I got one for you Beverly hill cop billies family of eddie murphy's the clumps

[02:07:06] All get rich suddenly moved to Beverly Hills and all become cops under the tutelage of axl foley They don't know how the fancy appliances work hotel for dogs, but it's a cruise for dogs cruise for dogs for dog dogs

[02:07:24] The wild hogs and the old dogs build a hotel but it's it's the 311 cruise Oh Oh no hotel for hogs James Let's talk about basketball Yeah, it sucks the basketball you're a nicks fan still do you care?

[02:07:43] I know you're a college. I do care. I mean, I do find college should just be a more I was trying to think of but I struggle with it because they're just gonna Do a stereo thing. I don't know by all means keep talking

[02:07:55] No, go on go on. Well, what's okay. So so what is your tattoo pretty soon? What is your favorite basketball based movie you've ever seen? It's gonna be a great review subscribe Hoosiers Hoosiers yeah

[02:08:07] Yeah, it's Hoosiers. I'm trying to think like so what else is this blue chips? I mean, they're the kids movies. What's and I feel like this is an obvious when I'm missing

[02:08:15] Well, I mean, yeah, they're the kids but they're like like Mike. Yeah, like there's that horrible kevindorant I think we'll be Yeah, go to t public. I'm sure Wild haws haws misses the number one available now. There's mr. Right with common. Oh, yeah That that one is is

[02:08:33] It's called just right. Oh white man. Just right. Yes. I Yeah, it's up there go to blanket Dot com for some real nerd fast break is good. Yeah And as always, I cannot believe I allowed us to talk about love and basketball is a great love and basketball

[02:08:47] It's very good. It's not like the best basketball movie, but it's a terrific movie And I think it is about like next week About Episode about the new Bradley Cooper film of stars born starting and ending our Bradley Cooper mini series

[02:09:03] Unless you decide to make another movie, of course, then we resume. Well, yeah, but they'll be catching in later But no, yeah, it's Hoosiers and I got a text from Romney saying how was James So clearly the competition rages on wow

[02:09:15] Um, you already did the as always. Yeah, you guys an extra time now overtime No, I knew what I was saying It was a different reference that you didn't get

[02:09:27] Reference Michael Jordan your favorite basketball player. No shack shack. Oh, it is shack. And shack is the most like Bershindisable right? He's the most living merc. Did you did you see that real sport segment about shacks merch empire? Uh, yes. Yes, I did

[02:09:40] I was just did you watch like the beef history recently about him versus, um, tim duncan No, I mean sorry, david robinson. How long do you think they're gonna where he literally made something up in his

[02:09:49] Autography where he was like I when I was a kid I asked him because he grew up in san Antonio I asked him for an autograph and he blew me off right and everyone was like that doesn't sound like they have

[02:10:16] Certainly we can discuss the long-standing rumor that stern banned him because of gambling and all that stuff But like right you don't want to say like the mafia killed mr. Jordan You don't want to just throw that out there

[02:10:31] All right, uh, are you guys feeling good? Uh, I'm trying to find this one. Are you ready to Come on slam Jam No one said anything about my jack. Great jack the 90s jack. It is it's a great jacket. I like the red too though

[02:10:52] I like I like your colors deep on fashion nothing. I just said I liked it. Well, I need yeah at the colors Yeah, I said that too. All right good. It's good. Yeah, where'd you get it? I bought it Upstate it looks heavy not like

[02:11:06] Like pretty I like the jacket. I actually don't know if I would go with such a bright red under that jacket I'll just say I don't know if this is a bad way to start Just you can just

[02:11:19] It just I don't know I really like the jacket but it's sort of a you're recording a nice duller color and You have the red shirt is exploding out of the red sets off The blue

[02:11:30] And it works with the black pants and the white shoes trust me. It's just a perspective you can't do earth tones I don't like purples perps You know what james? I like a purple start off on the wrong. I like purple. Sorry. You guys are intense in here

[02:11:45] Michael Jordan the first billionaire in NBA history player history He's he's the third richest uh african-american alive Wow, it's opera It's a vc guy whose name I didn't recognize and then and then it's uh michael jordan He owns the charlotte hornets You know there are now

[02:12:12] Um, you know what you should do You should do the line where daffy says Uh 12 a guy can't even get wet around here. Yeah, that one is fucked Why Robert smith That's the richest african-american. There we go. Yeah

[02:12:31] Uh, nobody well he he and opera has been switching positions now. He's he's he's got like a billion on our brand right now. Wow Yeah, well, he he owns an mba team No, no, i'm talking robert smith jordan's third. He does own an mba team

[02:12:45] But I actually what do they say he's worth one point one four billion I think he's gotta be worth more than that because he could sell the team alone for About a billion. Yeah, he might not own it outright. No, he doesn't but right right

[02:12:57] But yeah, but also the brand and everything. I mean that's just the brand is I feel like that that's a lot of it What team was the center? Patrick ewing no, no, no, he was on the mavericks

[02:13:08] Oh, you mean shawn brad. Yeah, it's so fucking offensive that he's in this I got I got context It makes me so mad the context is really good and you guys are gonna like it

[02:13:20] They have four hall of famers and then shawn, I mean, I don't know if mugsy is a hall of famers I have thoughts on that. Yeah, I'm gonna do this and it's gonna be really embarrassing

[02:13:28] And we've been working all of this it's gonna go at the end the episode Make the argument that bugsy bogus is one of the greatest athletes. He's special. He's a very special person

[02:13:36] I mean, I know basketball. Let's do it on mike. All right. All right. We're gonna talk about basketball. Believe me. Okay ready?