The Ice Storm with Emily Yoshida

[00:00:01] Blank Check with Griffin and David, Blank Check with Griffin and David Don't know what to say or to expect All you need to know is that the name of the show is Blank Check It's not a bad Elijah, it's a teen Elijah One of two reasons I reset

[00:00:51] Because you actually wanted to get the voice I want to get the voice right and I also want to say podcast more than 15 times Podcast What's what would your line have been? Elijah, podcast My line would have been

[00:01:03] You're touching that reckless jerk off for God's sake and he's trying to get into your podcast Yeah That's it I mean that's a great one I almost did the Ritchie You can take your pants off and I'll podcast it but that's as far as it goes

[00:01:20] There's a lot of good lines There are a lot of good I was like trying to avoid replacing penis with podcast Sure Which are a lot of the best options in this movie Right Yeah Hello everybody, my name is Griffin Newman My name is David Sims

[00:01:37] This is Blank Check with Griffin and David Great So podcast about filmography is directed to a massive success early on in their careers And give them a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion products they want And sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they

[00:01:55] They storm baby Okay, they freeze over You get electrocuted Alright I didn't know Teeth straightening This is Mays series on the films of Ang Lee Yeah It's called Brookbott Munkett Sure Rolls off the tongue It's fun because our guests never know what the podcast is called Yes Yes

[00:02:20] And this is my conditional favorite of his films Mmm Yeah, it's up there for me It is my favorite of his films that doesn't star a Marvel superhero Right Right That just features it textually Yeah Yeah It's called The Ice Storm

[00:02:38] This is probably the second best Fantastic Four movie ever made I had that thought I was just gonna say it was the best one Incredibles, I know you're not incredible Yeah, Emily doesn't like that Oh, I like the Incredibles, okay

[00:02:51] It's just like the crazy or the most randy end of all of them So I like that movie fine I mean look, at this point we've dug into it We've raked over these coals We have, we did it all

[00:03:01] We talked about and we came to no conclusive answers Because this filmography is confusing Cause he is a perplexing public figure Yes A textual Gordian knot Oh, that's one of your blank check bingos Yeah, I'm trying to re-establish the terms I want people to get big bingo scores

[00:03:17] Mmm-hmm But this is The Ice Storm It is 1997 Masterpiece It's a fantastic movie It's a phenomenal film And represents an interesting point in his career Okay I would argue Go on It's not a check bound It's his first American film, really Fully American Yeah, right

[00:03:41] It's also the first film he wanted to make After the father Knows Best trilogy Oh, interesting And he got hired, essentially To make sense and sensibility Yeah So like he had this one already cooking Look, this movie opened some doors for him

[00:03:55] He was able to make this movie Cause of some doors that were opened by his previous work Uh-huh But our guest on the show today This movie was a big door opener for her This movie changed my life man This movie fucking changed your life

[00:04:08] You played this movie with candles? And it changed your life I gave you a set of headphones Yeah Listen to The Ice Storm Listen to The Ice Storm Just the audio draft You heard a sad oboe Yeah Some mournful flutes Hi guys You know who that is

[00:04:27] It's the mother blankies herself Host of Night Call Emily Ashida's back in the studio Hello Hi Emily Thank you for having me back I feel like I was just on but But not really Not in podcast time In real time it's been about 15 minutes

[00:04:43] Since the last episode you recorded Yeah Let me look at your Wikipedia Podcast time it's been about 6 months Oh yeah, no Your guys' Wikipedia This is like a relatively new discovery for me I didn't create this Or neither did Really? No You didn't spend all your

[00:05:01] Your spare time that you have Creating a Wikipedia About your own podcast No it's incredible It's my first Wikipedia page Or like Wiki page Hey And I'm aware of With my face on it But I want to I don't want to do something this petty And yet

[00:05:19] I do want to have the picture replaced Ooh Do you have a picture you want? Or I have a staff photo that I just got From New York Mag My place of employ I feel like it would be a more appropriate picture To have on it

[00:05:34] Because I look very podcast ready in the picture Because that one I'm like on vacation in Berlin And I look really chill And that's like not my podcast persona So it's more that the new picture is so apt

[00:05:44] For the entry rather than that the old picture is like I have like there's one picture that people use All the time that I hate It was a Twitter avatar It was my Twitter Yeah, it's my Twitter avatar I've been meaning to change it for a long time

[00:05:56] Because my hair hasn't looked like that For over a year But yeah It's whatever It's fine I'll say this Some of our guests on the show Their wiki entries for the blank check Wiki are better than their own professional Like bios I'd love to know what that's like

[00:06:12] I'd love to have You mean like a professional On wikipedia.com No, they're like the blankies bio That they've written for me Is better than the one that I use for my work Oh so you want to like port it over

[00:06:26] That's what other people who have been on our show Have said that That's amazing Yeah Well good job to whoever runs that thing All are blankies It's a collective effort I assume Aren't wikis usually? The doozers I don't really know how they work Yeah, down a fraggle rock

[00:06:42] Anyway this is your sixth or seventh episode Joining the six timers club Wait, wait, wait No it's your seventh episode Well it depends on if you Yeah No it's your eighth if you split What? Yeah Pagan's reawakens Speed racer If I could drop this mic I would

[00:06:58] And I would actually start our hands up I'm proud to be victorious here Like she just don't care Where's Lawson? Oh no I'm wrong It's your seventh or sixth Thank you Right, yeah, okay But I will say I saw Richard recently I did too

[00:07:14] And he was like asking about Future, I don't know I think I mentioned that you were going to be on the ice storm episode And he was like So that would make her Is that would that be her sixth? Nope we had a very Heated slash drunk teta-teta

[00:07:28] About our rankings Among the hosts Knowing that we are neck and neck And with JD as well With JD but he wasn't He wasn't with us at that moment But I feel like there's some light competition I feel like we're going to start Richard's done five

[00:07:44] And this is your sixth Assuming we're counting Titanic That was one recording session It was just a very long one I mean, Erlich in an episode That has been recorded But hasn't come out yet Throws down the gauntlet That he wants to be the first person

[00:07:55] To join the 25-timers club Alright So he's behind Erlich He wants to post Baldwin numbers How is he I mean you guys would have to do like an entire Television season or something with him Or I don't know How would you jump up to 25?

[00:08:15] Unless we did a fastbender miniseries And we let him guess multiple times For people who have really long Filmographies Yeah I don't know, King Vidor Bud Boddaker I don't fucking know Buster Keaton Richard Flesher Someone suggested Buster Keaton He's like 46 films

[00:08:35] I mean it would be a lot of like In this one he, you know, I don't know Road the rails, I'd be like, you know Hey, everyone's a masterpiece Except for the ones that aren't He's made a lot of mediocre movies But his best films are the best

[00:08:46] Anyway, today we're talking about the ice storm And as alluded to Emily This film plays a very important role in your life You pitched yourself right at this one Yeah This movie, well I've watched it many times But mostly because I want to say in the year 2005

[00:09:03] I wrote an essay My critical essay to For my second shot Getting into the UCLA school film and television Because I did not get in the first time I applied Were you already at UCLA And you were trying to get into the school It's like within, okay

[00:09:19] So I'd been at Loyola Marymount In LA And then I did it and left school for a year And Had applied to get into UCLA for the next year Didn't get in so I took a year off

[00:09:32] Because that was like the only place I was going to go And then I tried again and I got in And I wrote my critical essay on the ice storm And it, and I got in And it changed your life? Yeah, it changed my life

[00:09:47] I made a lot of really strong points About Nixon and Power and authority What else? Well, so I was I was telling David because I found it And then I stupidly forgot to bring it in But I think I'll try to like read it

[00:10:03] Part of it at least some point later in the podcast I was reading through it And you know it's cringy always to read anything You wrote when you were younger That much I understand I don't think that's unusual But I also realized that

[00:10:14] Like the overall gist of it And the kind of climax Of the essay is basically the same as An essay I wrote like last month About annihilation So now I'm right in the Ice storm is annihilation Chip and that's going to be Any opportunity we get

[00:10:34] To make the ice storm into annihilation I'll say I re-washed it last night And independently came to that bridge Between the two films Really? I think they're two of the films that best A visualized depression Yeah, yeah There's something very subtle in both films

[00:10:49] And obviously one's more of a heightened genre thing One's more of a slice of life thing But I like I think this movie gets cold weather As right as do the right thing Gets hot weather Oh that's such a good point Yeah, that's very true

[00:11:03] And I think in the same way that do the right thing Is able to like marry that hot weather To a sense of like rage This marries it to a sense of Malaise and depression Where every shot in this movie just feels sad Without being like melancholic

[00:11:17] Or operatic Well it's like everything grinding to a halt Like the way the molecule stop moving The way the train stops going to New Canaan Right, and the negative zone It's a very precise sort of Aesthetics in that way And also this movie does not

[00:11:35] Get enough credit for how good the sound is Oh the sound is great Unbelievable And goes really far in terms of Selling all the ice because like I watched a lot of the special features last night When I couldn't sleep And they talk about

[00:11:48] The fact that they filmed it in like the spring And it was like a little chilly They used a bunch of hair products Like hair sprays for when you need Like the sort of frosting on things But other than that

[00:12:01] Most of when you see ice in the film It's like plastic Or when it's wet it's gel I knew it was spring Because it's so green Yes, it's a very verdant movie But every time there's like a step In the film The ice sounds are so precise

[00:12:17] Especially when it's Elijah Wood Stepping foot by foot Boot by boot onto the diving board Or the slow motion across the field All that stuff And like the crunch of his boots Like not just the crunch of the ice Under the boots But the crunch of

[00:12:32] The boots are so frozen That flexing the boots Yeah, yeah It's a... Yeah, I love the idea Of it being the do the right thing For winter and a pre-sum For winter and depression I think it's the do the right thing For the waspy, cold depression

[00:12:49] The thing is like what happens when rich white people Like build to a hell of a... Oh it gets very cold and everyone stops moving Someone very quietly dies Well I connected to this movie also Like all of the elements And the milieu of this movie

[00:13:03] Is like an alien landscape We was at the point that I first saw This movie which would have been in high school I... Yeah I guess it would have been high school Or junior high or something I... Like I didn't know

[00:13:17] I didn't know that you could take a train To Connecticut from New York Who does that? I didn't know that like Yeah, I didn't know like what a boring school was I didn't understand where he was going to school I didn't understand any of these signifiers

[00:13:30] Of like what kinds of people these are I just connected to it on a purely Emotional level, like teenage level And everything and then as I watched it Later it was like okay I understand Like this is... For some people this would be a very strong

[00:13:43] Like nostalgic document Yes it was a bucket of a type of person In a community, yes Yeah I only kind of picked up on that later Because I'm just like I was just east coast dumb For many many years And yeah but I still

[00:13:56] It also was the first film That I remember as like a young You know teenage viewer trying to You know collecting my mind About how to watch movies and everything And realizing like oh This was made or written by A guy who's like in his forties now

[00:14:14] Who's like writing about Like at the time that he grew up in And like this is going to happen Every decade And the next thing I remember thinking that about And having that realization about Was uh, was Freaks and Geeks

[00:14:29] And I was like we're just going to follow We're going to travel our way through the eighties now And just have that wave of nostalgia That kind of moves along with whatever generation Is in creative power You get Landline which is our generation's The ice storm Yeah totally

[00:14:44] Bad Except not that good Dave and I were talking about How this movie for both of us And I didn't know if other people felt this way But you volunteered this information where you're like Oh we were on the same page about this

[00:14:59] And I feel like if you saw this movie in high school Or younger it functions this way This was like a big sexual movie for me And it's like a movie that deals with sex in a very odd way Without being like a sex movie

[00:15:10] Yeah I think I was too young to see this movie I think I saw when I was like 13 I think I saw 13 And I was uh, like I was like I was probably seeing movie like American Pie At the same time So I'm like I'm

[00:15:22] Closer to very different messages about sex In teens in America Right right American Pie I'm like wait is this This is how it's all going to work And this I'm like wait so no one just No one even takes their clothes off Which is very objective based

[00:15:36] And then if weird things happen They're like gross out gags And then this movie deals with like Weird psychologies Like they'll like wait I thought it was just putting stuff In other things What are these other acts that are happening Do you have to wear a Nixon mask?

[00:15:50] Right What even the whole person in a richie character works Like what's she like doesn't she have a crush on one boy Why is she going back and forth between the two of them Well I could understand that I'm just saying all these things are like

[00:16:03] A movie that isn't cut and dry Both between the teenagers who are figuring out their sexuality And the adults who are trying to redefine their sexuality All of it's strange The teen stuff I almost had a better handle on

[00:16:13] It was the adult stuff that I was very confused by Oh unquestionably a better handle on the teen stuff The key part of everything broke my brain Right I knew what that was kind of

[00:16:21] But it did I mean it still kind of breaks my brain to watch it Well the first time I ever heard of this film Was in I think 17 magazine or something Because there was some little blurb or profile Of it was either Elijah Wood or Christina Ricci

[00:16:35] And both of those actors were very important to me As a young person Christina Ricci was huge for me She was me She was Wednesday Adam I mean like only 90's kids will understand but Christina Ricci Yeah she was incredibly formative I was gonna ask you that

[00:16:51] Was she like an Emily Ashida avatar Like from Wednesday Adams on Right Casper, Casper's a master please Yeah a little bit of Casper I didn't really watch that one that much But I had a huge crush on Elijah Wood also And so then I heard that they were

[00:17:05] So the 17 magazine article Which is like not equipped to really like to Yes yes yes And I started I was like They have a hot on screen smooching scene And I was like oh my god this is gonna be the biggest thing in the world

[00:17:18] This is gonna blow my little mind And then I didn't actually see the film for I don't think I saw it and I definitely didn't see it in theaters I don't know how soon once I came to the home video I saw it

[00:17:27] But I was like oh this is like Not really hot it's more like kind of sad and weird Yeah it's weird that the next year she made the opposite of sex Like she went from playing like an awkward 14 year old To playing like a femme fatale essentially

[00:17:41] And she says that in the book The character is written as more of a conventional femme fatale Right in the book I think she's sleeping with boys and girls There's multiple scenes with that And she's kind of a traditional Lolita type Yeah

[00:17:54] And she said that Emily wanted to work with her She felt like she was very much in her awkward stage Yeah And he molded the character around her current persona at that time She was like 17 when she made this movie Yeah But yeah she just looks really young

[00:18:08] Cause she's got those chubby cheeks Everyone in this movie has chubby cheeks But she's also in like one of those weird teenage periods Where you're like your neck is not in proportion to the rest of your body Parts of your body are growing faster than others

[00:18:21] Also the thing that I find so endearing about this character I feel like it's like just the tell about everything you need to know About this character from the first Well really from the first scene that she's in When she's watching TV is that she's got

[00:18:33] She is always covering herself up Yeah From the neck down Like she is just so not sure how to feel about her body Even though she's like doing all this precocious stuff She's still clearly extremely uncomfortable about everything And you know it's like half the scene

[00:18:48] She's wearing this like cape That is just like a tent over her body Yeah Which feels important Yeah it's a great teen character even though It's an amazing teen character I remember The idea of her mom seeing her biking And like being like oh she seems different

[00:19:07] Like cause no one's looking at her And it's like the mom says this really profound thing And Christina Rucci is like shut the fuck up I don't want to deal with emotions right now She's like are you a drunk? Don't make me think about you like a person

[00:19:19] Yeah well that's also good Joan Allen is very well cast and she's playing this person She's like I had a thought about your internal You just looked very free Kevin Klein tells like Jesus what the fuck What are you talking about

[00:19:32] Kevin Klein tells this story on like one of the Retrospective criterion documentaries Where he walked by Joan Allen And she was sitting somewhere around location Like not in her trailer pointedly With the script and with a cigarette Sort of like staring off into the middle distance

[00:19:50] In like a very Joan Allen way And he was just like she's so fucking intense Like look at just the amount of energy She's putting into this thing And then he was like should I be doing that Is she a better actor than me

[00:20:03] And then he went to the craft service table Kevin Klein said He's a personality actor Yeah he just He's very technical but like Joan Allen's one These people were like Joan Allen He's one of those actors who sometimes the moves She's doing are almost imperceptible

[00:20:20] It's like it just feels like she's internalizing As much as she can And then they call action and she tries to move As little as possible You know But this is like She said She was very disappointed by the response to this movie Because this was

[00:20:37] She thought the best movie she's ever been in She still thinks it's the best film she's ever been in And you kind of get the sense of like This is kind of the perfect Joan Allen character And you imagine her going like this is it

[00:20:47] This is the one This is my like So I'm not really aware of the response to it at all But I don't know if that's something you guys want to discuss now Pop or later It opened at the Cannes Film Festival

[00:20:59] We can talk about it so like I said James Sheamus read this book Like I think even before it was published The book was published in 1994 And he brings it to Ang Lee and he says Like oh my god like you said Like this movie means a lot

[00:21:13] He loves the image of The father finding the dead child And then crying Like he's like yes that's a movie This smells like an Ang Lee movie So he wants to make it And then he gets hired onto Sense and Sensibility So this movie gets sort of delayed

[00:21:29] And then it gets made But they said they were filming this When Sense and Sensibility got the Oscar nominations Right so I guess It was a pretty quick cash in They probably made it in like early 96 Total McGuire said he went up to him on set that day

[00:21:43] And said congratulations and he said what Like he was just like so kind of Into his thing but this was like He was just kind of moving along Like Ang Lee was going to keep on making films This film was at the Cannes Film Festival

[00:21:57] Yeah Wins Best Screenplay Which is you know a minor Cannes But still It was well received I think It was released by Fox Searchlight who are like You know an awards Studio but it was released in September And Yeah I was just looking

[00:22:17] It up and it said November Lies September 27th The thing Sigourney said Is that they kind of got Boned Not Sigourney's words By Titanic and Full Monty Because Fox had those two films that fall They had the biggest movie of all time

[00:22:35] And then they had this weird breakout Andy's success The fifth thing they really got Boned by was the Full Monty Because Titanic doesn't come out obviously For quite a while longer But the Full Monty's out By the time this comes out and

[00:22:47] Fox tries to platform it in the same way They open it small, it's the most miserable movie ever made It doesn't make a lot of money It gets No Oscar nominations It was like planned as like an Oscar player You know Kevin Klein he's like

[00:23:01] At that point still a very respected star They could have sold it on the Like the Swing Angle more They do not Have you seen the trailer? The trailer's weird There's a trailer that's on the DVD That's like It's very like Everyone can't stop sleeping with everyone else

[00:23:23] Oh it is okay well the posters And the advertising are very like The poster's fucking sad This isn't gonna be as bummer Like when you're like cold and think about death There's also that weird French poster That's like Ice Cubes Oh weird, weird That looks extremely 90s

[00:23:41] The other one is kind of like You could place it anytime within like 20 years That ice storm And then there's the DVD cover which is not the slivers of the faces The DVD cover is the one I'm most familiar with I'll get it for you guys

[00:23:53] I think Sigourney's point I'm on the computer Was not that the ice storm was having screens It was probably from it by Titanic But more that They thought this was going to be a big They put their resources behind In terms of making an Oscar movie

[00:24:09] Which would translate into eyeballs Full Monty broke that and then they had the front runner Right but also the Full Monty made like A hundred million dollars They have 45 I take it back But you know the ice storm just wasn't a hit

[00:24:21] I think the reviews were like respectful But not The kind of rush to see it reviews Sigourney got on it for a globe She won the BAFTA Which is bizarre It's just a small girl So weird I mean I love her

[00:24:37] I think everybody, all the lead cast is great in this movie But like she would not be the one that I would pick Not at all She's good But she doesn't have like some big moment Great pants But I also love Sigourney in general

[00:24:51] Yeah but it would be like my sixth favorite Performance in the movie I think she's like two or three for me What? She's like highest like four For me Like all three kids have to be in there And then Klein and Allen like they all be

[00:25:07] The film holds is the number one best performance In this film So David I am a well known Garbage belly You eat terrible things And my body suffers from It's not like you can handle it No I don't have the stamina To eat what I eat

[00:25:27] Bad things happen to you as a result Just finished filming season two of The Tick And my body has been collapsing Okay I felt like garbage I think it's just the stress of everything Right? I was feeling sick the other day My appetite's totally gone

[00:25:43] And it's that thing where it's like I know I need to eat Sounds like you need to see a doctor But okay you're hungry I'm probably dying I need to eat But I've had this a lot recently where I've just been working so much

[00:25:55] And like physically demanding stuff That my like appetite's gone And any meal looks dying to me and you know what I Genuinely do? I reach for an RX bar Which is your like number one favorite blank check Brought it Without question I love these things

[00:26:11] You love the RX bar First of all it tastes good Second of all I know it's actually healthy for me They got all the ingredients right on the front With everything that's in it So you got like egg whites, dates, nuts Chocolate, right?

[00:26:25] Fruit, spices, like it's just all right on there Egg whites, dates, almonds You're listing things I don't like Right take them apart, Griffin's not into it Not at all Put them in a bar And people go oh this is healthy for you and I go

[00:26:37] I'm not going to touch it Not interesting You put it in a bar and then tell me hey it's peanut butter chocolate flavored I will eat it There's some savory options There's some sweet options Chocolate sea salt

[00:26:49] Right you got a little more of a kick in that guy Mango, pineapple, you're going sweet Right the blueberry flavor I like them all honestly Apple cinnamon It's like a pie And it really is It feels like the best Most sustainable snack I can have

[00:27:09] You can eat it for breakfast They're a good snack, they're a little energy boost Pocket food It's like easy for your body to absorb it Which once again like Notorious egg hater speaking of you You don't like eggs but you like Rx Bar

[00:27:23] I like them too but you're the acolyte This is the only egg delivery system That I've ever enjoyed So listen up for 25% off Your first order, you just go to rxbar.com Slash check And enter promo code check at checkout Or if you don't want them

[00:27:39] You can also order them and send them to me I will gladly eat them, I enjoy these things Slash check and make out the address out Casa Griffin 1717 Griffin Boulevard Do we think At this time That Crumbholz is hotter than McGuire That's my question

[00:27:58] Define hotness in terms of career In terms of physical attract In terms of pulling down ladies He's kind of a ladies man And McGuire is like the dork here Oh I think that McGuire is on his path to pussy posse Yeah that's what I'm saying

[00:28:14] This is the tragedy Of David Crumbholz, he never got a pussy posse And he like And then Oscar Isaac came along And took his career away from him And while he was on numbers He's like cool I'm on numbers I'm set for life And Oscar Isaac was like

[00:28:32] What if 5% less Jewish And Erica was like yes Star Wars please I used to My boyfriend in college We always used to joke He Couldn't have a career At this time, this was like in the mid 2000s He could not have a career because of David Crumbholz

[00:28:52] Did you have a Crumbholz-y boyfriend? I had a very Crumbholz-y boyfriend Crumbholz-y in? Yeah Crumbholz-y in, alright Well this relates to another movie I watched Kind of as a companion Piece to Ice Storm But he's a little Elliot Gouldy

[00:29:08] I mean Elliot Gould is one of the hottest bitches in the game I was tweeting about Elliot Gould the other day As I was reminiscing Which Gould did you rewatch? Well so over the weekend I watched, I saw a long goodbye at Alamo

[00:29:20] Oh that's one from the Gouldmage It really is It didn't even matter what I answered I was hoping that was going to be the answer She said like Ocean's 13 I would have been a little shone I just watched like select episodes of Friends

[00:29:34] Yeah I would have been fucked if you had done that And then I watched Bob and Carol and Ted and Atlas Oh yeah sure Maybe the start of the Gouldmage That was the beginning of the Gouldmage I don't think the night they raided Minsky's

[00:29:48] Was the start of the Gouldmage I just like referencing the night they raided Minsky's Harry and Walter take New York I think that might be later, I'm not sure That's a later film, I'm saying that's maybe towards the end of the Gouldmage They took New York

[00:30:00] I'm still living in the Gouldmage I don't care what anybody says I'm not charming Obviously he's an older man He gives a good interview I was reading a lot of recent interviews of his You know Griffin knows him They were on a TV show together

[00:30:16] Have I ever told my Gould story On air because you told it to me I have the one that's worth telling He's in this movie right That's where we're talking about him Yeah exactly, we're staying really on track If I had boys like Karen and Hannah

[00:30:32] He would be an Emily's boys Oh he's a Griff guy 100% He's a David's dude He was on Malini The one episode of Malini that I was on That no one ever saw The pilot that was never here The single greatest piece of television Let's just tell everyone that

[00:30:56] Lost in Pop Culture But he's one of my ultimate guys So that was like The embarrassment of riches was getting to Work with him and spend a lot of time with him Because when you do multi-camera stuff A lot of it's sitting around

[00:31:10] Where you're just hanging out in the rafters Waiting for them to call you up for your scene I spent a lot of time with him And we bonded a lot talking about anxiety and depression He like I was like oh my god

[00:31:22] Ellie Gould is about to become my father figure And then I kind of was I felt so wounded after I got That's all information I never had the courage to reach out to him again And I haven't talked to him since

[00:31:32] Oh I thought you were going to say that you reached out to him and you didn't respond I was so worried that would happen That I didn't want to put myself out there I'm sure, I bet he would have

[00:31:40] I think he would have, this is a real mansion I feel like we connected And That week or two that we were working together I was like this is going to be the next eight years of my life This is going to be unbelievable

[00:31:52] He's going to help me get a good head on my shoulder Right before we went out to film the episode He put his hand on my shoulder and he went Your family They didn't show affection that much did they Oh my god

[00:32:04] Like right before I'm about to like enter And then you just like have tears streaming down your face Because Ellie Gould has stared into your soul But he said like There was one night where we had like dinner At like the Ivy with like Lauren Michaels

[00:32:16] And everybody and he kind of keyed in on me And it's like how are you feeling And I was like I'm just trying to stay calm And he's like that's an interesting choice of words C-A-L-M Calm And then he was like can I give you something

[00:32:32] And I went sure And the next day on set on the back of his side So he didn't, he said sure And then that was the end of that conversation He said there's a quote I want to give you

[00:32:42] When I go home I'm going to write it down I'll bring it for you in the morning And he wrote it on the back of his script page And it's I have this frame to my wall Oh my god you just brought it took you five seconds

[00:32:52] Where the world sees, say it to my favorites Where the world sees as to be the scene of our personal Hopes and wishes where we face it as free Beings admiring, asking and observing There we enter the realm of art and science Albert Einstein

[00:33:04] I have to go take a break Right? That's my most prized position My entire life Now why am I talking about this for five minutes Because I want to believe that Elliot Gold's listening to this He's going to reach out to me and say I missed you

[00:33:18] Gouldie he loves podcasts About movies he wasn't in He loves Steve Krumhol Right starring young men who kind of have like a slight Vibe of his Sort of like a hairy chested Jew vibe I think that They could really like put Barbara Streisand on his shoulder

[00:33:34] I think to get back on these frozen train tracks I think that McGuire's Whole thing at the time As Molly's game sort of illustrated Was being the wolf in Sheep's clothing Yes, yes, of course Not just that he played this sort of sad act guys

[00:33:48] But also that in life it sounds like that was kind of his Move, you know? I'm sure that they were full of plot behind this I think so, absolutely I think he's already, you know it's already fired up Because he makes this boys life with Leo in 93

[00:34:00] So they're already in the same circle And how old is he when he makes this How old was Toe, Toe Burt's McGuire He was born in 1975 So he'd be more like 21 Yeah, he looks, yeah I mean he's very baby-faced So this is his year

[00:34:16] Because this year he's in the ice storm He's instructing Harry and then the next year he's in Ciderhouse Rules No, Ciderhouse Rules 99 So next year he's in Fear and Loathing in Pleasantville Now this movie was huge for me Because it starred three of my favorite actors

[00:34:30] It starred Toe Burt McGuire and Joe Nown from Pleasantville One of my favorite ever movies that I watched over and over again And it starred Christina Ricci From Adam's Family Values Especially Values I own both on VHS But Values is the one she gets the Oscar nom for

[00:34:46] She's all-time Thanksgiving scene star also between this and Adam's Family Values Yes, that's true She's the queen of Thanksgiving Is there a third Ricci Thanksgiving film? Is it perfect to do a Ricci Thanksgiving triple feature? I don't know, is Buffalo 66 like set at Thanksgiving?

[00:35:00] That a Speed Racer takes place That's right, we've already talked about Ricci Yeah, this is my second Ricci pod We love some Ricci So I was like all in And I liked Kevin Klein because I loved a fish called Wanda

[00:35:12] I don't know if I'd seen a lot of other Kevin Klein In and out? Yes, I had seen it I saw that in theaters I saw this on the BBC On BBC2 Where Did your family have some expensive satellite package Where you got foreign channels?

[00:35:30] I don't understand how you would have gotten the BBC How much was your cable bill? BBC2 Not just BBC BBC2 No, it's called BBC America It's on the wrong name of the thing I don't know, you have to explain yourself here Because we are so perplexed

[00:35:48] BBC2 was the channel for the more alternative stuff Because BBC1 was like the flagship channel But in any other layers There's one B So on my TV In Britain where I lived What? Ben You're so dead right now Ben is dead I lived in Britain

[00:36:12] I had five channels So that's where you saw this I saw this on the BBC I remember either Entertainment Weekly or Time Out New York Used to do a chart of movies and their appropriateness With relation to children That's very servicy

[00:36:26] And nice, and I don't think any outlet would be So uncool as to do this And they were like Here are the different quadrants of where This movie has potential offenses But they would include movies that were clearly 100% Offensive

[00:36:40] And I remember the ice storm being included in Sexuality They said two children show each other Go into a bathroom and show each other their genitalia Not true, only one of them does Yeah, how were they described it? And I was like That movie sounds weird

[00:36:52] And it always stuck in my craw Didn't remember what the movie was I think I'd seen Sense Sensibility When I was sick, my mom made me watch it I saw Crash and Tiger when it came out I didn't like it, and then I loved Hulk

[00:37:04] Oh so you got to this after Hulk So after Hulk And you're like, okay I got to check out this guy Yeah, got to delve through the film I watched it at summer camp on a laptop Okay

[00:37:16] And I was like, I am all about how sad this movie is And this movie is All weird sexual tension Where was your summer camp? New Mofford, Connecticut My guess was that your summer camp was either Massachusetts or Connecticut New Canaan, Connecticut So I did not know

[00:37:34] So this recent time I watched this for this podcast I was watching with The other day We were watching it with a friend It was interesting to get his He had not watched it before And he And one of these things I'm just like east coast them about

[00:37:50] Apparently that New Canaan is known For all of its mid-century architecture Like it's there Specifically for a reason because of all these Insane transparent houses Oh also my college essay did have a reference To how everybody lives in a glass house Yeah Send me my diploma

[00:38:08] Pass me that giant bong please I still don't have my diploma from UCLA Really? Come on UCLA I'm still waiting on my diploma from CalArts Library fees Yeah, but So that was interesting to learn this time around

[00:38:22] That was a new fact I did not know to contextualize the film But yeah New Canaan, Connecticut Yeah, I mean I was coming at this post-hulk Being like, okay that movie is great Everyone else hates it What's the weird stuff that he's bringing into the Hulk

[00:38:34] And then this movie is like Oh here's all the weird family psychodrama Which is already contextualized Through the Marvel Comics Prism Yeah, because the movie fucking opens with the Fantastic Four Yeah Opens with Team McGwys Explaining comics for you Man-explaining comics for you Man-explaining Fantastic Four issue 141

[00:38:54] I will say that like I was expecting I was fully bracing myself this time around Because I haven't seen this movie for at least five years I own it on DVD It's one of the few movies I do own on DVD

[00:39:04] But I just hadn't seen it for a while I bought a criterion for this one The old criterion with the line Have you experienced Fox DVD No, the old Farmin' Airman Yeah, yeah I thought I'd played this movie twice

[00:39:18] I had the Fox DVD then went to the criterion DVD Then went to criterion Blu-ray This movie is like a fucking straight shot For me as sadness For me to buy Blu-rays What was I saying You were saying you hadn't seen it in five years

[00:39:32] And you were worried I was expecting an opening sequence That features now known Asshole Toby McGuire Also Explaining Comics And doing a like metaphor Between the movie and a comic Because this is gonna be real cringy I have on this podcast called them baby books

[00:39:56] Yeah, I was like I wanna get past the baby book part of this But it actually like works for me It's like fine, I like it They don't do it too much and it also In 1987 you actually had to do this You had to be

[00:40:10] You had to set up being academic about a comic book People would be like, comic books, that's for the kids Still, I don't know But they just kind of hit this one metaphor Which then they only revisit like once Yeah The book is a bigger metaphor

[00:40:24] And the book that he sees a four A flaming four in the sky at one point Oh cool The metaphor is very obvious that he's figuring out That his family are like the fantastic four The final shot when he gets off the train He's Franklin Richards

[00:40:38] When the family's together at the end of the movie It feels very fantastic for me With Christina Ricci of course being the thing All this repression No, no, no, Jonah Allen is an invisible woman And Kevin Klein is fucking Mr. Fantastic Right, and he's human torch

[00:40:52] He's flying through the skies But it's also You get these great like Fucking Kirby drawings Yeah, sure Films, these like weird And he's On a train coming back that is stalled Read in his baby book Emily, you're covering your mouth What do you want to say?

[00:41:14] I really thought for a really long time That it was a nihilist Great, that would be a good Marvel villain I believe in nothing Yeah I was like, yeah, that's why you would do all sorts of fucked up shit It's sheer nihilist

[00:41:28] Why are you fighting the Fantastic Four? I don't know I don't believe in anything Our arch-villain, Greg, Cama, a nihilist I mean, just Yeah Anyway But this thing that I've always loved about the Fantastic Four The idea that like your family is like Your source of greatest strength

[00:41:46] And your greatest weakness It's like the raw Feed of like Everything you come from Is also what holds you back And yadda-da-da-da-da But he's on this train in Meteor Rez It's stuck on the ice, the lights are off He's trying to read it and then comes back on

[00:42:04] It's very dreamy And especially not knowing the context of it In that opening It looks like an abandoned train That he's like hiding it almost Yeah, it's like how is he living here It looks like he should be frozen It looks cold

[00:42:20] Yeah, and it is one of the few This has become I think a very tired thing Recently in recent years Everybody has been doing the See the ending first Hate in Meteor Rez I like this one I do I don't mind this one at all

[00:42:38] That was another thing I was expecting to not work for me Or feel like tired Retroactively tired It's not the in Meteor Rez that's trying to Give some big hint about where the story is going Well it's not really in Meteor Rez Because Paul's entire storyline

[00:42:52] Takes place completely separate In Meteor Rez would be like Kevin Klein waking up on the floor of the bathroom Or something How did I get here? But that's a thing because he's so often away from them That's where producer Ben is by the way

[00:43:06] He's on the floor of the bed Until the end of the movie, it's not like it's some big twist You kind of just feel like this is one of the times he's going back and forth You don't really care that much about where it is In the chronology

[00:43:17] But then from there we go to These two central families One is Yes Alan, Klein, Richie, McGuire Sure And then the Carvers Jamie Sheridan who's phenomenal in this fucking movie He is, he's excellent. He's a good actor Sigourney Weaver Elijah Wood and then Adam Bird Adam Hanbird

[00:43:40] That's right, little man Tate himself The star of America's favorite prequel Jumanji Yeah He's Robin Williams Oh you're right He's not right, he's young Robin Williams He's not the monkey boy He's in the beginning with Kirsten Dunst No, no, no, no, Kirsten Dunst is the child

[00:44:00] Who's the other, it doesn't matter Literally who cares I don't know Anyway Those are the two families They live close by, they're very close And they are intermingled Kevin Klein is having an affair with They're like next door neighbors But even in New Canaan that means they're like

[00:44:20] They walk through a forest Everyone's super isolated Isolated Right, isolated and that's a very, very clever metaphor Did you note that in your essay? Isolation And also their emotions are cold Sure Also it's 1973 Nixon is on the TV all the time Watergate is bubbling over

[00:44:43] For our listeners you have to imagine The context is like It's like you have a president People lost faith in him People are really jaded about authority You feel like he's up to criminal activities You're wondering whether or not he's going to get taken down

[00:44:57] He's sort of flailing publicly You're also kind of addicted to the news Watching it Even though it's so miserable It just makes you feel bad I think a lot of our younger viewers will never No, it's a very period concept For context it's like your president had

[00:45:13] A consensual affair with an adult actress He didn't try to silence her Shut up, God knows what will have happened Six months from now anyway We'll find out that he robbed Fort Knox What if it just comes out that That'd be amazing That'd be impressive

[00:45:29] And people would be like He's locked up the body I love the defense of him robbing Fort Knox He needs the body If he could get it then that's on us All that money to buy all these lost So he's going to pay them off

[00:45:43] He's got it out for Knox Here's a very serious question Then we'll get back on subject with the movie This very serious question How do you think the public would react If it turns out that Donald Trump drinks diarrhea I don't know He's like can I

[00:45:59] One cup of diarrhea please And he just sips it up and goes I think they'd think that was weird I'm so glad you shit your pants That's enough You don't think they'd think it was weird? Yeah, I guess so Does he also want our staff?

[00:46:15] No, no, no, don't proceed the bit This is a diarrhea man Ben, you're in the bathroom You hit your head It's diarrhea problem What's the real start of the movie? I'm trying to remember what the opening couple of scenes are

[00:46:29] We have Joan Allen is at the book fair Looking over this table of all these New psychology books That's not really the start That's where she meets Reverend Sexy Time Reverend Henry Zerny Henry Cherny, how do you say it? Yeah Wait, is that the beginning?

[00:46:49] I can't remember the exact beginning The opening of it is Toby and then Well, it starts with him It's cool And him with Katie Holm And Krumholtz He's taking a bong rip with Krumholtz He's telling his close female friend His ducky

[00:47:09] God, I have such a crush on Libbitz Don't tell your friend about it She's cool, she's got short red hair She's really cool Toby, hang out with her She seems cool She should realize eventually But First of all, you're so cliched

[00:47:27] Of course you have a crush on Libbitz That's the least interesting thing you could possibly do This is Katie Holm's first Screen roll Is she already on Dawson's Creek at this point? No, because I think that's 98 No, it's 97 Dawson's Creek has just launched Wow

[00:47:45] She's launching her parallel film career Then, I don't know Doesn't she play the exact same character in Wonder Boys? I can't remember In the exact same character in Batman Begins In the exact same character in The Gift Well, not the... It is 98

[00:48:01] You guys had me all worked up So, 98 to 2003 Was it a mid-season pickup? That's fine Because I definitely watched it in 7th grade January 20th, 1998 Wow It was mid-season, you're right On The WB So This was her first performance Crazy So Set up the dynamic of Krumholtz always

[00:48:35] Finds a way to H.U. With the girls that told McGuire L's Hang out I was going to say hook up H.U. He also hears that she Every year for Thanksgiving So, be it Trying to save time We've saved so much time Let's make this a two-parter

[00:48:59] He hears that her peas Every year for TGs Yeah, Thanksgiving Leave their apartment So now, Tom McGuire goes, I gotta get invited over to that apartment Gotta get into that apartment I gotta get in I'm chosen to get there My favorite part of this whole intro part

[00:49:19] Of him at school Which I also, I think I thought that he was at college For the first couple times I watched it I think I did too, that's a good call Because I was like, what's boarding school And he's like In a dorm and he goes

[00:49:33] Talks on the pay phone He's doing drugs, who does drugs when they're in high school Unbelievable Kids these days He's doing his hand Hey, Ben No, but my favorite part of this Is when he gets the call from his dad

[00:49:50] And he has to use the phone out on the hallway And they have their little Exchange, he talks to it And then he talks to Christina Retina Charles and Charles And then he gets the phone And gets handed back to his dad And he's like, I love you

[00:50:06] And there's just that slightest of glances over his shoulder To two dudes we never even see We never even come in focus and he's just like Okay, fine You know that character Toby I like that his relationship with his sister Is pretty solid

[00:50:22] Yeah, it's such a breath of fresh air In the middle of the film when he comes back For Thanksgiving and they have their first scene Face to face You're like, oh my god, two people who actually kind of like each other Amazing

[00:50:34] Their initial dynamic where he's like, don't touch my shit And like immediately you're like You're cool with each other And even when he realizes she has touched his shit He's just kind of like, oh boy Yeah, you've been touched my shit, I haven't

[00:50:46] But why is he at boarding school and she's not I guess that was kind of a thing I mean, she's younger, I think it's like maybe She'd be going a year from now Yeah, maybe Alright, so he's gonna come home For Thanksgiving There's an ice storm happening

[00:51:02] And Christina Reti's making eyes at Elijah Wood in the playground Where they're with Sigourney Weaver We're just getting all of that They have the dinner party at the Carvers Where the kids are serving and drinking Wine in the kitchen And then watching the parents from

[00:51:20] The weird doll sundries Like this house is incredible Yeah, and that's when The idea of the key party is For spread up Can you believe this nonsense But also they're all talking about couples therapy It's a given that all of them are in it

[00:51:36] And it's like the only thing we've ever fought about Is whether or not to continue going to couples therapy And Joanne Allen does not find that funny Yeah, and then there's the Moment with Joan and Sigourney In the kitchen where she's like Don't touch the dishes Oh yeah

[00:51:52] Before you even find out about their affair Or like, oh, they're having an affair But yeah But Joanne Allen and Sigourney Weaver represent Very different They're both early 70s mom types Right, and they're sort of women Who grew up with confines Around them socially They're pre-boomers, these people

[00:52:12] They were probably born in the 30s In a culture where the walls are now being redefined And Sigourney you get a sense feels A loss at the life She could have lived Where she born five years later Sure What have you

[00:52:28] That she now is stuck a little bit into a box So the way she's costumed is just Absolutely incredible A total smoke show in this movie And Yeah, she's like Somewhat liberated But performatively so The line that's so telling to me Is when she catches Christina Ricci In

[00:52:50] The bathroom and she says, you know A body is his temple And it's all about It's not that it's her son And the female body No, no, no Her body is a temple And she goes off on the thing About Samoa or whatever

[00:53:08] Which is one of the best moments It's the worst sex talk I've ever seen They're two really bad sex talks Oh my god Climb sex talk The self abuse talk Just skip right to masturbation It's amazing There's a part where she uses male pronouns Sure

[00:53:28] She's talking about how That's why when young men Are coming of age and underdeveloped Countries like the Samoa They send them out into the woods until they've learned a thing or two Because what she has walked in on Is Christina Ricci exposing herself Not, you know

[00:53:46] I mean, I guess the boy was sort of yelling His way of getting out of it Why are you doing this? But no, yes She's got this sort of like jumbled up Like literature in her brain That she sort of spews

[00:54:00] But none of it really makes a lot of sense They have a water bed too, P.S. Yeah, so good Joan Allen feels like She feels a little threatened by the fact that society Is asking her to change Well, yeah, I mean

[00:54:14] Well you think about these characters and both of them This generation of parents Would have been Like young parents and had kids And been kind of out of like Definitively out of youth culture throughout the entire 60s but just out of it

[00:54:28] Just on the other side of it, so it's like now There's some kind of feeling of having missed out On something and her feeling like, yeah I don't know The vibe Yeah, and she She's looking at these books She doesn't even know what to make of these things

[00:54:44] There's this modern progressive Pastor who's kind of given her eyes Oh man Like a corduroy blazer And a turtleneck, the best look But she's also like She's shop listing Shop listing From pharmacies There's this sense of, especially when I was 13 Watching this being like, why are these characters

[00:55:06] Doing these things? Like it doesn't really make any sense And Ang Lee said his big into the movie was It's the notion of the culture shifted so much The kids are now kind of acting like parents The parents are now kind of acting like kids

[00:55:18] And something is sort of cosmically wrong With all of them, but in a way that's so Vaginabulous the only way to reset it And set it right is for something horrible to happen And it's like everyone is kind of Just off their axis to some degree Yeah

[00:55:32] I kind of want to talk about that Overall idea a little more at the end Sure, okay I have opinions about that, like a few other things That don't work for me about the film But yeah, I think that The sense of like discord or disarray

[00:55:46] Or something is like very Yeah And yet the kids are mimicking each other Like, I mean sorry, I mean mimicking their parents And Like they're like tell me Kevin Klein kind of behave in the same way in this movie Yeah

[00:56:02] And I think that's intentional, like there's a weird sort of Like cosmic balance Between mother and daughter and father and son Yeah, and Rishi is kind of like Playing this very complicated game Of like she at school Wants to position herself as like The grand all

[00:56:18] Seeing sort of like Right, she's been around Right, I know the story about everyone else What they're doing wrong, what I'm doing right But then is like very sheepishly Kind of roping Elijah Wood Who's someone who barely like Acknowledges other human beings

[00:56:34] And still obsessed with the notion of the molecules floating around him Yeah Elijah man Those eyes And he's like a child star too I mean like this is like A kid that I like I saw Flipper in theaters 100% he's like an above the title kid Huck Finn North

[00:56:56] Yeah, I was really taking there was a TV Movie of Oliver Twist That he was at the Dodger Inn That I was really into that Richard Dreyfus Who else is in that I don't remember, I just remember The next year is the faculty Right

[00:57:14] Bizarre also to think about Like with Richie and opposite of sex Like faculty in this being Right, he grows up kind of All of a sudden And then of course he goes off to New Zealand But yeah he was younger He was 15 when he made this movie

[00:57:32] She kind of keeps on like Very structured like Let's go hang out in this abandoned pool and kiss Yeah That abandoned pool is kind of cool though But that's sort of very Like rigid like we need to fool around With each other kind of thing

[00:57:48] But I love that she sets her sights on Like the kid who's like That everybody thinks is stoned So removed from The structure of masculinity That's beginning to be formed at this school That's the only explanation That's the one that I want Because it's literally a CPR dummy

[00:58:06] And the guy's like But it is just sort of like He's like a boy body Like she can kind of manipulate him You know And then his younger brother As Elijah Woodlair says Idolizes her Pretends to shoot his little army guy at her Yeah, I mean

[00:58:26] Everybody's like a something in training He's like a unabomber in training Very much like He won't stop pulling a sit on all his toys Yeah, he's blowing up his model planes Right, kind of can't reconcile His own emotions

[00:58:40] I kind of like that scene though because it's like such a Naked cry for help and his mother responds with like How are you doing? You're being weird Whip blow up So according to me there's a bad mom I mean she's not into it

[00:58:56] Like you said, this is just not where She imagined I think Jimmy Shurnes so physically out of the picture There's that moment where he comes back and he's like Hey, I'm home and they're like you were gone Yeah, right Whereas like I feel like Ben and

[00:59:10] You know Kevin Klein and Joan Allen They're more like why didn't this work? This seems like it should have worked We're both great Communicative like we're not You know openly contemptful of each other Like yeah They're pretty solid as parents all considering They're not greatest parents

[00:59:28] They're not great but they're like At least trying to put forward the appearances of being good Which is something I guess They're having the self abuse talk Even if they're bad at it But it's building up to I mean I guess they

[00:59:42] Souther Klein and Weaver have only slept together Like two or three times Is that right? I mean there's that great Which is a classic this is how you shoot Unsatisfying sex is just all Back all male back Yeah Nothing worse than boy back

[00:59:58] He starts like complaining about his golf buddies He's just like I already have a husband I don't need another one It's like the coolest line reading ever Yeah she's mean Yeah And then her next thing is She's just like I gotta go put in

[01:00:14] My diaphragm I'll see you later That's incredible Let me go grab some birth control And then she hears the car And I just love him just like I guess I'll hang around this home for Two hours I guess I'll like wobble On the waterbed I mean I

[01:00:32] I think her character This is why she's not my favorite performance in it Is that it does feel a little bit Easy like Woman who has been a mom And been like done all the suburban mom things And been a parent and whatever

[01:00:46] Even if she's bad at it is like taking out her revenge On men by just being like The worst to Kevin Klein And that feels like It's just convenient Easy line to draw So she said Ang Lee made them all Write character biographies

[01:01:04] And Kevin Klein was like I'm not in acting school anymore Why do I gotta do this What a jerk She said that she went to him and very pointedly said I think this character Weaver, we were talking about

[01:01:16] Went to Ang Lee and was like I think the key to this character Is the fact that we can't really figure her out There is no cut and dry psychology And we don't really want to explore all of these things

[01:01:24] Because I don't think she has any sort of routine I think she's so displaced I think there's not logic behind her behavior I like that in that scene At when he confronts her at the key party It doesn't feel vindictive

[01:01:36] She's just like I don't know I had some errands to run Like she's just so thoroughly like Look I'm living in some weird life That would have been different If I was born 10 years earlier or 10 years later

[01:01:46] I don't really know how to make do with what I got Right now just let me do whatever the fuck I want She's also just lonely I mean you can tell And the really profound thing she says They all talk about how They feel like Ang Lee

[01:02:00] Weaponizes and maybe this is something he learned Doing Pride and Prejudice because people still talk about this today Sorry I keep on making that mistake I would never keep those two I've never read an Austin book in my life I guess you guys ain't cultured Like me

[01:02:16] I didn't grow up and never mind I hate David, how are you doing? I want to talk about a podcast That I'm a big fan of I think you're a big fan of it too Okay who's the podcast? What's Who Weekly I'm asking you strongly

[01:02:32] Who is the punk? We're in trouble here Barely even tracked Who Weekly It's a podcast about everything you need to know about the celebrities you don't It's hosted by friends of the show Lindsay Webber and Bobby Finger I'm asking why hasn't he come back?

[01:02:48] He's come back soon but if you need that finger fix If you want to get fingered start listening to Who Weekly That's right, he is the namesake of one of our best draws Correct Fingered You know so this is I've been obsessed with this podcast since it launched

[01:03:04] Because it was one of those podcasts where you're like That was a good idea And you know It's celebrities like Rita Ora Or Julianne Hoff How? I think it's Huff Like Clayne Crawford Or Brad Pitt's new girlfriend Neri Oxman

[01:03:24] They dig into all these sort of like quasi celebrities Who you may not have heard of But seem to be like living these ridiculous lives Or like you've heard of them who haven't seen or Heard any of their work You're like what are they famous for

[01:03:36] I just know I'm seeing their names a lot Justin Bieber is marrying a Baldwin daughter But it's not the Baldwin daughter I knew Like what? And everyone's saying this like I'm supposed to know who she is And I'm going Who Weekly

[01:03:48] So every episode goes deep into the biggest Who Leopardy Stories of the moment They have a call in episode every week You can call 619 Who Them And you know listener questions such as Is Tessa Thompson or Who Are Them I think she's them

[01:04:04] Who the hell is Maria Acton And why is she in all of Kim Kardashian's Instagram Literally no idea I'm going to listen to the show to have an answer Extremely important stuff It airs twice a weekly, new episodes on Tuesdays and Fridays

[01:04:16] And you can check it out, Apple Podcasts Or wherever you get your shows Who Weekly The thing Lee would do that apparently He still does Is weaponize his seeming lack Of handle on the American On the English language To say very Like blunt things And very profound things

[01:04:38] I haven't seen the criterion DVD but I remember That being a part of the Doc on the feature Regular DVD They say he's really expressive The fact that he comes from an acting background Is like he would sort of just take on the face

[01:04:54] Or the body language of what the scene was supposed to feel Like not what they were supposed to do But the scene is kind of like this You know? Or he'd look at them and just say Like one word

[01:05:04] And he said there's the moment Sigourney Weaver comes back from the key party And you don't see what's happened between her And the kid And she comes back in on this weird Kind of mopey walk And she walks right up to the door Where Christina Ricci

[01:05:18] And the young boy are And like walks up to it and then doesn't open it And pure it And she said to Engley I really think I would look in there I think as a mother I would check to see if my kids were okay

[01:05:30] And he said no, no, no Too ashamed And she was like I just trust him so fully At that point that I didn't fight back on it Even though I felt so fundamentally as a mother That I wouldn't do it and I watch it now

[01:05:44] And it was so the right choice In a way I never would have been able to internalize But there is something so profound There you look at that moment where it's like A wide shot, she walks in very slowly After seemingly getting the best guy From the pool

[01:05:58] Right? And then just sort of Almost puts her hand up to the door And walks away And it's like the entire notion of dealing with anything There's too much shame See I This is a thing I don't love her being just ashamed Of like bagging the hot guy

[01:06:16] From the party I feel like it's a little punishing of that She's definitely The movie punishes her a lot I mean it literally kills her See this is interesting It's the book that punishes her But also I don't know

[01:06:34] I feel like he wants you to look at it In any way you want to look at it He talks about this movie as a painting That you can approach from different angles He talked about how Or I read something about how it was funnier

[01:06:46] Like when they shot it There's a funnier version of this movie That's maybe a little more heightened And then he heard the score And he was like Interesting and then as it came together In the editing room they were like No no no it's sad or sad

[01:07:02] Or muted And it was also like Apparently this movie was two and a half hours for a long time And then it comes in at like 150 There are a lot of late scenes which I haven't watched It's also like in my head

[01:07:14] It's spanned more time but it's just a weekend It's just two days And the last half of the movie is just cutting Between essentially three different Environments in the same two hour span In the same night And getting to this idea of the movie being able

[01:07:28] To be viewed from different angles Emily seems to be eating like bird seed or something I'm not sure what she's eating Eating on mic though Hi it's my eating on mic debut Sigourney Weaver is the character I come out of this movie Feeling worst for

[01:07:42] I find her weirdly the most empathetic Especially her final moment where she just kind of Sadly curls up on the bed with a blanket Right well with a blanky With a blanky I don't think that you don't feel bad

[01:07:54] But I just question the impetus to make you feel bad for her I guess is what I'm saying Interesting I don't know I mean you feel bad for her Because she has Engaged in behavior that's like Made her ashamed To Confront her kids about I don't know

[01:08:14] I feel bad for her because she feels like a Dramatically unfulfilled person She feels like the loneliest Character in the film to me And the one with the least Sort of tangible options But the movie does obviously end on The family and she's not there

[01:08:30] So obviously there's a little more emotional Fulfillment or story fulfillment at the end of the movie For the hoods Whereas her last shot is essentially what you're talking about Exactly I really could have done without the curling up Into the fetal position shot

[01:08:44] It's like really one of the only gripes I have Really? Interesting Bad time with what's his pants I mean with her key guy Oh oh oh It's the night of that It might have just been a bummer of an experience

[01:09:00] Because Jamie Sheridan has a bummer of an experience With Joanne Well the Isn't the curling up The curling up is before Elijah Wood Is brought back in She's reacting to The key party Which like I don't know If we're not going to see it

[01:09:22] I think that we're just led to believe That she feels bad for Sleeping around I guess so But she doesn't really feel bad for sleeping with Klein I don't know what Emily is saying though Because it's Mysterious

[01:09:38] In a way that other things in this movie are less mysterious I don't think she's coming It's like I feel like the movie is showing us that she's kind of making herself miserable In a way With all the things that are supposed to be liberating her

[01:09:50] Which is like You can be said for a lot of the characters in the film But I think for her She's the most Extreme end of this Spectrum of liberation and misery Together Right, well so I think the key party Is that The key party is this

[01:10:10] Hey we figured it out We've unlocked the mystery We're all going to feel Like yeah And no one has a good time at the key party No, I know we're doing this movie completely out of order Two days We're fine One of my favorite moments

[01:10:28] In this movie is when they actually Do sit down to pick the keys With our host Alison Janney Alison Janney Also there is This time around I noticed that there is a painting A portrait of Alison Janney Hanging over the fireplace and I was like

[01:10:44] That's a prop to get The 70s style portrait Of Alison Janney from iStorm Would be incredible But when they sit down and it's really Clear immediately that nobody Knows what they're doing We've all read about this in like Readers Digest Or whatever but we've probably

[01:11:02] Not Readers Digest but still But you know What do we actually do? Now we're actually In the thing, it's real We order and they keep on making jokes But I'm not actually coming up with anything Golf handicap I mean it's almost like us trying to Start this podcast

[01:11:20] Which we're still I think 30 minutes away from starting The episode Funny This is a good warm up No, you're right This isn't like, it's not like Alison Janney Runs a weekly key party She's perfect casting because she's so good at the Like maniacal grid of like She's like

[01:11:40] She says something like new this week Or something like that Totally voluntary Like it's like a I don't know, a roast pig or something like that Are they all gonna fucking the cars? I think that's sort of the thing Wouldn't you cancel this party for weather also? Yes, 100%

[01:11:58] A car based party A car based party During an iStorm where everyone lives 15 million miles away From each other in the same town Is that the idea of a key party? Is that it has to be car keys? Because I thought it was

[01:12:12] It has to be car keys You could go off somewhere But the idea is you got kids You want to bring them back to the home That feels a little wonky Wasn't there like a CBS Swing town It wasn't called key party

[01:12:28] It's called swing town, wasn't that good But it was sort of like a third of the way To being interesting And then the CBS just watered it down so hard It was like 2009, what if we try to do madman Yeah exactly Which is pay and end

[01:12:42] The Christina Ricci show was another version of the same Was that the last thing that she did? No, see the beginning of everything Which is all the fifth year old The end of that series Yeah, Amazon What a great title for a show that's so memorable

[01:12:56] Z Cole in the beginning of everything Apart from that I am looking at her and yeah I am a very struggled post speed racer So like being in a movie that I don't even see Yeah, for her I really, somebody needs to revive her She's so great

[01:13:12] She's so important She is important I wonder what the deal is with her I don't say this to be knowingly vague She feels to me like someone who Like the psychological Strings of Being a child star caught up with her I mean she's given interviews to that effect

[01:13:30] Especially with regard to like her body image And everything, and eating disorders and everything That's definitely out there on the record I just wish I just wish she'd have a second win Take as long of a break as she wants But I really want more Christmas

[01:13:44] She makes movies She was in the hero of color city Which we've talked about in this show before She played yellow And she did I can't believe that Olin Wilson didn't play yellow in the hero of color city Wow She did a Lizzie Borden

[01:14:00] Like TV show on lifetime It was like a movie that got spun off into like a series But that didn't take And then right, the Zelda show didn't take It was the beginning of everything Yeah, I mean I guess we should have known when David Hofflin

[01:14:14] Was cast as F. Scott Fitzgerald That might not be a hit David Hofflin She did two different, she did a Lizzie Borden movie It was a spin-off Oh and she was the voice of vexie in the Smurfs too You forgot about that So So That's a key party

[01:14:34] Well, yeah I guess So it's basically like the first day Oh and you were going to explain to us how a key party works David Because you were looking at the group sex wiki Oh I can go back to the group sex wiki There's also a rainbow party

[01:14:46] Which is a baseless urban legend In which Do you know what it is? I want you to describe this I actually have heard of this as like a joke urban Legendary thing, like females I'm quoting Wikipedia Wearing various shades of lipstick Take turns, filleting males

[01:15:04] In sequence, leaving multiple colors On their penises Ignoring the obvious fact that you just have Like a sort of dark purple Sort of like Be a filet show sludge They were covered On a filet show sludge A classic filet show sludge There's also the classic Bunga Bunga orgy

[01:15:26] In which participants have sex underwater Such as in a hot tub That's like Bunga Bunga Oh wait No, that was a You're not going to read something? Well it's just like a daisy chain Okay But then just like Bukaki Like is like a subsection of this

[01:15:46] It's not really a group sex thing It's just sort of like a porn sex It's just a piece of the piece Anyway Alright I don't know what you're murmuring So I feel like there's a whole Because of the way that the sex Or the tea party rather

[01:16:04] Is staged It's like It's kind of adding to this idea That isn't necessarily just a film about This craze that swept suburbia Like swept wealthy suburbia And nobody knew what to make of it But it's like a basic thing of like

[01:16:20] A thing you've read about that you think everybody else is doing Yes And you internalize it And immediately feel like you're weird for not doing it When in fact nobody's doing it Which could be any number of things Because the beginning of the movie when you're talking about

[01:16:34] It's like that's like a west coast thing And then they get to this scene And Klein and Allen are both like Yeah go check her car I think we left her keys in there But Allen has just put together

[01:16:46] Once he tumbles over and hits his head on that But yeah she knows that he's having an affair She doesn't know with who But also She knows that we're in the basement Because she was in the basement Well whatever I mean it just feels

[01:17:00] Her final choice is made when he Makes the fuss over Sigourney Weaver Getting the hot guy No no no I think she Because her choice to go to the party Is after she admits that they were having an affair In so many words like his apology

[01:17:14] Or he doesn't even actually admit it All he says is I don't feel good about it Like I remember that line And it's not exactly what you think it is It says something like that But she just kind of keeps on doubling down

[01:17:26] Like there's an out for her to not go to the party She doubles down There's an out for her to not get involved with the key party She doubles down And you get the sense that on any other night If they walked in even with all the problems

[01:17:38] That they would have They would just laugh and leave And it's like the ice storm is like a metaphor Almost like it's a metaphor Oh my god molecules Molecules Wow There's the moment I love The two things I love at the key party

[01:17:56] The red herring of the guy from the office Who Kevin Klein is like 100% sure Is gonna sleep with his wife He's shown up Solo Oh yeah no that might be Henry Zerny I think that's Henry Zerny He's a weirdly high billed Henry Zerny

[01:18:12] Which feels like a red herring billing They want you to think that he I think they just build the kids low Cause they were kids Cause the guy plays the father Michael Cumpstey But I like that red herring Klein is just side eyeing him

[01:18:28] And then has that chuckle when he pulls Someone else In the key party bowl But then also the father coming And like John Allen is like what are you doing here Sometimes the father has to Tend to his flock if you catch Oh yeah yeah yeah

[01:18:44] I'm gonna choose to believe I'm gonna choose not to understand what you mean Right and then he just looks really Sad he walks out and the final Indignity is like as he pulls his own keys Out of the bowl the other guys are like

[01:18:56] Hope he didn't pull my keys And that's just it, it's just here's the Sad man gonna Drive home alone in an ice storm Yeah no everybody is Also the co-worker Does not just pick any other keys He picks the fat ladies Key And all the boys are like

[01:19:16] Side eyeing each other Wait a second Yeah it's real, everybody is on their worst behavior Also he's the one who's like Cause the woman comes in with her son And he's like I wish some of the guys Would have brought their daughters

[01:19:30] And then Kevin Klein wants to like bomb it On Q Yeah it's real sad and gross Yeah Klein is slightly elevated In this scenario actually Like just very slightly You can see the sort of panic like rising In him a little bit

[01:19:46] Then he just gets wasted and hits his head on the side of a table Meanwhile Richi has gone over You assume they sort of misdirect you To think that she's gone over to see Elijah Wood I think she is

[01:19:56] We've already had, right so she makes out with Elijah Wood In swimming pool They have their phone conversation And when she goes to the bathroom She has the I'll show you mine if you show me yours Seen with the younger son

[01:20:10] Elijah Wood's like I'm never gonna talk to you again Right yeah he bikes up to her And then immediately on Thanksgiving They hang out again and that's when Kevin Klein Discovers them in the basement So she puts on the Nixon mask

[01:20:22] And lets him sort of dry hump her essentially And then there's the great line So they said in the script Uh huh It's supposed to be that Kevin Klein carried her The same way he would carry Elijah Wood at the end of the film Oh okay

[01:20:36] And we wanted like a very literal sort of Mirroring of that image Uh huh Yes Kevin Klein had thrown his Back out like the day before And he was like is there another way we can do it So they came up with the thing where

[01:20:50] It's like a forward piggyback Which is such a beautiful Moment because it's like Very like baby-ish Like I don't really I'm not angry at you I just need you to know that I don't like the look of this kid Right yeah yeah yeah

[01:21:08] Like I'm not judging you but we can't be flipping About these things and then she sort of just crumbles Into being a small child that he like Holds in his arms That moment is really really really great Yeah Yeah I mean it's so funny to me that

[01:21:24] All the parents are like that Mikey kid Bad news but he's just like this sweet He's a sweet boy he's just weird Weirdo He's a weirdo with perfect bone strokes Yeah everybody thinks he's on drugs But he's just like a little You know he's like probably a spectrum

[01:21:40] Yeah and He's totally like Like junior high age Emily This is like my archetype of like the dreamiest boy Like this would have been okay Also We could talk about how like These characters are like just the younger versions Of Thoroburch and West Bentley In American beauty

[01:22:02] Thoroburch and Christina Ricci were very much In the same like Christina Ricci was supposed to do ghost world And that sort of feels like a moment that like Yeah There's an alternate timeline But then what's the timeline because it didn't really pan out The Thoroburch either

[01:22:18] The Thoroburch there's a very identifiable problem Yeah Her parents But still it's like that type of girl There are just like These unhappy accidents slash maybe It was just never meant to really carry Through into the odds that strongly Like this kind of sardonic

[01:22:36] Not traditionally beautiful or cute girl Who's like you know Usually the smartest child If not person in the room and You know it just has like a dark sensibility There is something Brokerecci was prozac nation Weirdly right that was the movie where everyone was like

[01:22:52] Well that's gonna come out and that's gonna be a big deal Because that book was a big deal And she was sure And she was on the show for years And she was fighting with near max There is something kind of weird to actually viewing

[01:23:03] Ghost world as a handshake movie Where it's like okay this is the year 2001 That sort of archetype of the teen girl Is going out the window and is being replaced By Scarlett Johansson See you later in the rear view That's a good point Very fateful moment

[01:23:19] And she becomes the thing that I want coffee I don't know I mean it's too bad But Johansson does become Kind of the type for the new teen On Janu in the 2000s Like who's Christina Ricci now There is no Christina Ricci now right

[01:23:35] Well like it's like Hailey Steinfeld The closest we're getting like what are we talking about here No I don't think there is one There isn't somebody that I mean they're probably on TV if there is a person Right is it like Jane Levy Jane Levy but like

[01:23:49] She's cool but I mean you know She is but she's just I think she's too much Like there is a certain part where it's like If you are just like a cute girl though Like if you can be written off by any

[01:23:59] Idiot director at any point in your career Is just a cute girl then it doesn't work And that's actually why it's hard for I don't know somebody who's less I don't know it's tough It's like the true alternative girl The idea of having a sort of like

[01:24:14] Avatar on screen For weird 15 year olds What about Aubrey Plaza Oh boy you're probably right Opening up a can of worms That's probably Agony She more hit once she was in her 20s Like she never had a teen But she's sort of Yeah and she kind of is

[01:24:34] She's Christina Ricci stripped Of dimensions It's like a greatly reduced Tumblr Christina Ricci It's a tumblr of Christina Ricci God this is making me Miss Christina Ricci Well you can always watch The Ice Storm Or Anglia's 1997 masterpiece See the beginning of everything I mean let's talk about

[01:24:56] Sort of the culmination of all this I guess The worst sex scene of all time between Jamie Sheridan and Joan Allen in the car Right so right in the second night I guess it's Thanksgiving No it's Friday night Because we see there their little Thanksgiving

[01:25:10] Because Paul goes back to New York On the day after Thanksgiving But is going to come back for the rest of the weekend He's just going to go up for the night to like Have his date with Libbets And who's there of course He got crumbed

[01:25:24] He got holtzed I want to point out the Crumb Holtz's character Called Francis Davenport Which is like the worst match For Crumb Holtz ever I also love Oh he's so obnoxious in this movie But I love how he's like The way he gets

[01:25:42] Toby to go get beer for them Is like meed meed We must have Fuck you And yet somehow he gets every girl It's so amazing It's a confident nerd And I feel like that is one of these things That only works, I imagine only works

[01:26:00] In boarding school when you literally can't escape You're like I guess this guy has confidence So this notion of this guy acts like he's really smart I guess I have to impress him Like there's this weird sort of gas Weirding Like these are teenagers

[01:26:14] But Tom McGuire finds her parents medication Tom McGuire essentially Roofies Crumb Holtz To get him out of the way It's a real flimflam though But then it has to, is like forced into Roofine Exactly Pharmaceuticals I mean so this whole, it's sort of funny

[01:26:34] Because for being the person Who opens and closes the film Toby McGuire is not actually in this movie That's why he's absent for most of the time And he's absent for the most key part So to speak of this movie And it almost feels like

[01:26:48] It feels like this sort of science Experiment and he's like the control in it Like he's the person who gets like taken out Of this like Pot of boiling water Or not boiling water Yeah I don't know, my metaphors are all messed up right now Chemistry

[01:27:04] It's out of the Petri dish It's not a lot of the film But it does like this section hits me super hard Because a lot of high school who Griffin was Being the one sober person At a party where everyone else is like

[01:27:16] It wasn't often like three people And two people are asleep Like this is an extreme version of it But a lot of it was like I want to go to this party And talk to that girl I'm in love with Who I sit next to in science class

[01:27:28] And they're just stoned out of their gourd And I was like sitting there drinking a sprite Manhattan kid baby All those kids around drugs ones are age of 12 I know and I was terrified of everything Right, Z I was getting high on criteria And David Reading baby books

[01:27:46] I was doing both Well yeah Give me those criteria and those ludes You were free basin commentary tracks Yes Yeah Well the other thing is that I feel like everybody Well okay so I guess Mikey In a way in his sliding down the ice Like

[01:28:10] Going into winter away And Paul Toby's character I mean they both kind of opt out In their ways from the turmoil That everybody else has kind of swept up During the storm And I think one of them doesn't And I feel like I don't know

[01:28:30] This is the part that ends up sounding like Annihilation when I wrote about it To get into college because it is this Total Like either being attracted to Or If you think about the ice storm being the shimmer Here we go We're doing this

[01:28:48] You can't be at the border Of it, you either go in or you go out And I feel like Mikey, Elijah Woods character Is the one who goes in and is just like I'm gonna go just like trip out On geometry and molecules and stuff

[01:29:00] And it kind of feels like he's a sacrifice Yeah he is a sacrifice for sure He's a sacrifice for his family For the community for everything And Paul is, yeah again He's like a control and that's a mega Reference to the second book in that series

[01:29:16] But he's outside Of this thing And he just sort of twists and warps everything And everybody else is sort of on the periphery Where you actually Have the least clarity at all Like you either go all the way into the lighthouse The boarding school gives him the perspective

[01:29:32] That the others lack He's outside of this bubble Also as he goes through it His train is like stopped and shut down It's like it's crossing some sort of border And then it reactivates And it's like connectica's going into the negative zone

[01:29:46] Well it feels like he's like time travels And that because the way the guy's talking It's like going back in time to go back home Or something That's also very fantastic for you The friend that we were watching it with Who had never seen it before

[01:30:00] Thought that the train stopped because Of elyzha wood specifically Oh because there's like a power interruption I always thought that was the case Interesting, I don't know if we put that together But I guess that makes a sort of sense

[01:30:12] I don't think it really changes anything that much But it's sort of interesting I think the same The downed power line That kills elyzha wood Is also the same thing that stops the train Not that elyzha woods death is a sort of train

[01:30:28] Stopping but it's one sort of Right Poor elyzha sits on a god damn I've always been ever since I was scared of those Guard rails Those metal guard rails Seriously And he sees it's going to happen And he's just got this total look of wonder

[01:30:46] Over his face much like Natalie Portman At the end of annihilation Yeah I mean I also Feel this very strong because I Especially once we moved to Iowa And snow was kind of a rarity for me I would always be like it's snowing

[01:31:00] Or the world is unhabitable right now I want to go out as far as I can Into it and see how long I can make it until I have to come back And I totally see the Like I feel like now watching

[01:31:12] I would stay in and I would watch Netflix But I totally remember A time when I would be like yes I'm going to put on Every single piece of clothing I own And run out into it I love this movie I hadn't seen it probably

[01:31:24] In at least five years if not more But I've been like Spending a lot of time recently working On a script That is mostly like a snow woods Movie And I kept on trying to find ways To get down on paper

[01:31:40] The feeling I had and I realized a lot Of it came from If not like specifically this movie The way this movie is able to sort of Evoke that feeling of Being in a Somewhat secluded area That is both kind of like a dillic and creepy

[01:31:56] When it's that cold The feeling of like I feel like even just we talked about the sound design When it comes to like the ice and the steps And all that sort of stuff but even just their breath You know the clothing they're wearing

[01:32:08] And all the time even when they're indoors The amount of sweaters they have on and stuff This movie just feels like How that type of temperature Takes its toll on your Psychology Yeah and the another really Pointed thing about this being Set where it is and I guess

[01:32:26] In New Canaan where this is Like how the houses are They're like spread out It's not a neighborhood It's all these modern houses that are built in the 40s So it's almost like yeah you're like in this kind of You're not in a neighborhood

[01:32:40] It's not like a suburban block Like I feel like this movie would have felt a lot more on the nose If it did take place on what we would recognize Like a cul-de-sac But it's like you're almost in outer space Because there's all this like blank

[01:32:52] Space and forest and between All these houses they're all kind of like spread out There's no sense of connection And so this movie is about Like how it's easy to draw connections between Events celestial and personal That might not exist and you might be just sort of

[01:33:06] I'm getting this bad just very Poorly But there's, I think it's when Kevin Klein's Giving the world's worst birds in the bees talk And they're driving And through the windows Is his birds in the bees talk just it's fine to jerk off

[01:33:20] Is that the whole talk? I was trying to parse that He starts to talk about like you might be having feelings And he can't really get to it and then he Skips straight to like well on the topic of self abuse Don't do the shower

[01:33:30] Yeah no that's the talk right And then he expects you to And it wastes water and it wastes water And he was like also stay away from linens Yeah It's incredible And then it ends with him asking him to Forget that they ever had problems He's right exactly

[01:33:48] Toby's so squeaky in this movie But when they're driving in the background It's sort of like they're on one of these Like long endless roads where there's just Nothing it's like copy pasting Of the same line of trees over and over again

[01:34:00] And then the other thing is that kind of Low rock wall do you know what I'm talking about Uh huh oh you mean like Like on the sides of the road Cause it's like then there's like a raised kind of Like slope up into

[01:34:12] Right but like sort of a very carefully placed Low rock wall of about like six to eight inches And my parents My paternal grandparents Lived in White Plains New York and we'd go up there A lot and that's always what I like

[01:34:24] Think about especially if we went up there for the weekend Which I would hate cause I'd want to be in New York on the weekends And we'd be driving back like Sunday night I'd be bummed out knowing that as soon as we got home

[01:34:32] I'd have to do homework Like I was super depressed and it's January And you're driving past those like Lines of identical trees and those rock walls And it just feels like Everything so far apart Like you're not seeing any life Yeah you don't see people walking around

[01:34:48] Yeah there's no sense of a town or a community Or connection Merchandise spotlight What's the merchandise spotlight I mean this had a big PS1 game you don't remember There's no spotlight Will you reach some sort of profound Emotional like realization that causes you to cry

[01:35:06] In your car in front of your family What if there was like an ice storm puzzle quest Where you just had to match up the blocks of ice There was some cell phone game That was weirdly huge What if there was an ice storm mystery dinner

[01:35:18] Oh that sounds good That just sounds like a key part That's the trick It's a mystery dinner Who are you going to fuck It's going to be unfulfilling Jamie Sheridan literally is like that was terrible No that's amazing The moment that kills me in his performance

[01:35:38] Is when he sees Elijah Wood He's kind of just stunned silent And then when he, you're like why isn't he crying yet He's clearly taking the time to process it When he reaches down to grab him The physical strain of lifting him up Turns into crying

[01:35:52] He's got this one seamless moment Where it's like his face turns red Is trying to summon the courage And then he just loses it He is the only person In that scene who doesn't I think also This is my other gripe with the film

[01:36:08] And I guess with the direction That doesn't work for me But it's like a totally in keeping with the era Everybody underplaying a child's death There are so many movies where a child dies And everybody's just like Gazing

[01:36:22] And it's like no you'd be losing your shit right now This would be the most terrific thing you've ever seen I never buy that I agree with that Obviously the movie is entering a sort of like Hyperreal realm at that point

[01:36:34] But yes, I think my problem with this movie As a kid was it ended so Insanely, like because you don't see that coming Obviously That it freaked me out too much And I thought this movie was like too dark Like too miserable or something Uh, I was wrong

[01:36:50] I saw it this time and I was like If a movie unsettles me this much that means That it's doing something right Because it unsettles me still to watch this movie I want to read this Angley quote to you guys It's from the preface of his screenplay

[01:37:18] I love that I thought that matches your annihilation stuff Yes, cool guy I love him, he's great That's why this movie is good Uh, who the fuck else is gonna think about Like the actual earth on which The characters are walking as being a character In that way

[01:37:46] Most directors would not have approached the book this way Yeah, no, it's incredible They would have seen a comedy of Like 70s moors But this is like a story of elements Like a literal story of elements And that's incredible I love that Kevin Klein also said that like

[01:38:04] Whenever he walked by set Angley would just be sitting there Staring at things Thinking about things That he was like never doing anything else As it was being like prepped and lit And trying to find Things that like spoke to him

[01:38:20] You know, and it doesn't feel like it's a movie That's very like It's reserved There's even like when he does the hard like camera Move down to the bowl with the keys In it, it's like jarring because He's been so restrained cinematic Up until that point

[01:38:36] But it's just a movie that's got like such a kind of Fucking muse on son to it But just this sort of like Improvation, the level of detail In sort of the emotional tapestry Of it feels very attuned Yes, I think it's very interesting that Angley

[01:38:50] Made two movies in a row about America At a crisis point That are both about outsiders Looking in on like Something that they think they understand and then they don't Like this and ride with the devil That both start to be in a choir

[01:39:04] I think it's very a very funny little Mini phase in his career And we'll talk about it with the devil next week I think we wish that he got in the chance to make a sad Fantastic Four movie Sure, why not? That's what bums me out about the

[01:39:18] F***ing MCU Fantastic Four we're going to get Is they're just going to make it part of the whole f***ing thing And I think the Fantastic Four kind needs space To be totally isolated So that it could be about the family

[01:39:28] But we've never talked about the Fantastic Four On this podcast before I will say Franklin Richards as a kid Was a character that really fascinated me Where like the parents had this child Because their kid in the comics Has powers better than them

[01:39:42] That they don't understand how to deal with him And it is such a perfect like 70s Comic book metaphor for what's going on Where they're like He can like astrally project Like he can reshape reality What do we do? And then they put like

[01:39:56] Dampeners in his brain so he can't use his powers And it is just a lot of great metaphors You can throw out a f***ing Franklin Richards That's your second movie and then your third movie is Galactus And then in the 90s when everything goes wild

[01:40:06] And then you have a little universe in a ball Valeria Anyway the box up is gay Let's talk about it guys Let's talk about September 26, 1997 Okay I'm missing my screening No you're gonna be fine When is it 6? 6 yeah What is it oh? You were never really here

[01:40:30] I'm just saying that to you And you were never really RSVP Yeah exactly Number one of the box office was An action movie starring like a TV star It was like his first play For action movie stardom The peacemaker The peacemaker Starring George Clooney and Nicole Kidman

[01:40:52] Directed by Mimi Leder It was the first DreamWorks movie That's why it's notable 12 million dollar opening weekend It makes 41 It's kind of a bomb Here we go new movie star New studio, new big director It's the same year as Babid and Robin Yeah

[01:41:12] Number two is a movie starring One of the stars of the ice storm I saw in theaters with my mom Is it in and out? Yes with Kevin Klein This is his last good year He doesn't make any good movies after this

[01:41:26] I mean unless you're kind of like Delovely It's okay He was in this star studded Midsummer Night's Dream He was with Callista Flockhart Which I saw in theaters because I loved Callista Flockhart See I owned it Because I was in a Midsummer Night's Dream

[01:41:44] Sure I was also in a Midsummer Night's Dream In the 8th grade I was a puck See I never got to do it I don't want to talk about that What? It's a fucking fairy Oh boy Our drama teacher hated us I can't explain it

[01:42:00] I got continually shafted I won a high school Monologue competition with a Helena monologue That year Known in the state of Iowa as Best Helena And did not get cast as Helena In our local community theater That feels like an axe

[01:42:18] This is like fucking like my fairy lady Julie Andrews shit I want to dig into this I still hold the crush I never got to do Midsummer That was the one Shakespeare I always really liked My mom was like you like this one right Yeah cause it's fantasy

[01:42:34] My favorite thing about Midsummer Night's Dream Is that it's the only Shakespeare play not based on anything So Shakespeare finally sat down He's like let me do an original story So like There's some actors There's a fairy kingdom as we all know My school was so pretentious

[01:42:50] The only Shakespeare I got to do was 12th night We did 12th night We staged in a depression era Circus Circus Yeah Mids through spears in my school You were at the furnace You're just talking about like after school activities No that was school That was the cafeteria

[01:43:12] School was here is your spear You ended it You had to shake the spear First you had to get the spear out of a trash fire From the cornucopia The trash Nicopia Number three is a Thanksgiving movie Which is What? Is it Christmas film?

[01:43:32] No it's a food movie Food movie but it's not about the Thanksgiving Well it's very interesting I want to triple check this but I'm almost certain That it is a remake Of an Ang Lee movie Well it's not a tortillas soup

[01:43:46] So it's not a re... that's the one I'm thinking of Tortilla soup is the one that's the remake of the Trigman woman So it's just an ensemble film About Cooking And like family drama It's an ensemble film about cooking and family drama Yeah

[01:44:02] I think we talked about it on the Eat Trigman woman We were talking about our favorite food movies There's a lot in that era Exactly because there's what's cooking The Grinda Chata movie and there is tortillas soup It's not Big Night No it's not Big Night

[01:44:16] Does it have a big star in it? It has an Oscar nominee I think No it doesn't really have a big star It's an ensemble picture No it doesn't even have an Oscar nominee What kind of director are we talking about here? Uh Anonymous Not that well known

[01:44:36] He's made some movies Oh he directed... oh no he produced A lot of big movies Interesting. The director is not going to help you on this one Is it John Avnet? It's a black movie Oh soul food? Oh well there you go

[01:44:52] I was running out of clues I could give you Have you seen Soul Food? No I haven't Who directed that one? George Tillman Jr He was like He made Men of Honor Alright number four Is an underrated Action thriller set in the wild Of the era

[01:45:12] Set in the wild? Like the jungles you're talking about? No Sure it's cold It's a cold movie? From 1997 Big action star? No not a big action star Big ish star It's got the same name as a famous guitarist The Edge It's a good movie Lee Tamahori

[01:45:40] What if I come up with a funnier joke for that Number five is going to be The best episode of a possible Upcoming series depending on how the bracket goes Number five It's a film from a very famous director The Pan-Trap? No

[01:45:58] And I think it would be the most interesting episode Of that miniseries Of his miniseries 1997 You're saying possible is in One of the winners One of the people who's in the final four Bay Pig in the City? One of the stars is very funny

[01:46:16] We were just talking about it Very funny That's a confusing... you're not going to get that clue America's number one humor Sean Penn Yes So what's the movie? I'm trying to remember there were so many pen comedies Around that... well so he didn't do Liar Liar

[01:46:32] He let Kerry take that one He's a supporting character in this movie A supporting character in 1997 Yuckster Uh-huh And it's a director we would cover Is not a Michael Mann? No, other one Oh, oh, oh! It's The Game David Fincher's The Game Which we need five million dollars

[01:46:58] Are you game? Sure I love that movie We're going to go see Ready Player One tomorrow That's the end of the episode, Emily thank you for joining us Thank you for having me Ready Player One is fine Great, can't wait to see it

[01:47:14] Can't wait for this hot take to come out in July It's Okay C plus On a scale from Ready Player One to Ready Player Ten What would you give it? Give it a Ready Player Two! That doesn't sound fine It's like a Ready Player Five

[01:47:32] This is the thing You were saying something to this effect Before anybody had seen it at South by David You tweeted this It's not going to Not work, it's a Spielberg movie Right, right, right It's not going to be incompetent

[01:47:50] It's going to take you from the beginning to end and you're going to feel satisfied by the story But it's also not Starship Troopers It's no Starship Troopers And that is a bummer Too bad, Stephen I've been told that it's a major improvement

[01:48:02] But I've also been told that's a huge low bar Yeah, we can talk more about this off-podcast There was one thing I was like shocked by That apparently is just from the book We'll also talk more about this Four months earlier

[01:48:14] In the episode that you've already listened to Emily, thank you so much for being here Thank you for having me again Six Divers Club! You get a pen this time Come and get me Lawson! Night call Right here in the Audio Boom Network Produced by the producer Ben

[01:48:36] Mr. Oz Yeah, it's a Listen to Us We'll still be making our podcast It's one of the few podcasts where I have to listen right when I download You like Colton Aliens Listen to our show Thank you Stuff that we were talking about today

[01:48:54] Your piece on Nihilation is one of the best pieces of film we're adding I've read all year People should Google that And also everything else you write She's also a nice friend And that's her number one I like getting dinner with her sometimes and catching up

[01:49:08] At the end of the day Quality person But only at the beginning of the day At the beginning of the day You stay away! At the end of the day I go, I don't know, I'm always a quality person Thank you guys Have fun as always

[01:49:24] A real night among dragons Hey look, here's what I gotta thank And for good over our social media Joe Bonaparte rounds for our artwork Lane Montgomery for our theme song Go to Blakeystarrated.com For some real nerdy shit Yeah And as always Yes Next week

[01:49:46] Tune in for Ride With The Devil With Pierre Labousa And as always I'm very sorry to inform you that Emily was not able to retrieve Her school paper written on the ice storm Because there's a great track record of school papers being read on this podcast